I've got the 45g, need your help, input, advice!
- Thread starter DebsSisterFlo
- Start date
DebsSisterFlo
New member
Ok Jason, but you said this in an above post:
Is that what you mean by poor and sloppy? Not being snarky, just trying to get a handle on things. This isn't a big tank, I don't think I need a complicated setup, and heck, anything is better than what I have now. Maybe we can get this all ironed out on sunday? Please check your pm's and let me know.
Is that what you mean by poor and sloppy? Not being snarky, just trying to get a handle on things. This isn't a big tank, I don't think I need a complicated setup, and heck, anything is better than what I have now. Maybe we can get this all ironed out on sunday? Please check your pm's and let me know.
Ok, Lets draw a line on a piece of paper. on one end of this line, lets write FUNCTIONAL BUT LOOKS LIKE TAR... and on the other end of this line write WORKS GREAT AND LOOKS GREAT. Underine the AND LOOK GREAT part.
Now, one the end of the line that is FUNCTIONAL BUT LOOKS LIKE TAR, write, "pvc pipe in tank". in the middle of this line somewhere close to the middle, write "plastic overflow / clear glass" and on the end of this line that says WORKS GREAT AND LOOKS GREAT, write "Black Glass overflow".
Now, one the end of the line that is FUNCTIONAL BUT LOOKS LIKE TAR, and, "pvc pipe in tank"- wirte "3 dollars" In the middle, where you wrote "plastic overflow / clear glass" write 20$-25$ and on the end of this line that says WORKS GREAT AND LOOKS GREAT, where you wrote "Black Glass overflow", write 35$-40$.
Your chart should look like this...
<a href="http://photobucket.com/" target="_blank"><img src="http://i28.photobucket.com/albums/c205/jmkarcz/October132006.jpg" border="0" alt="Photobucket - Video and Image Hosting"></a>
The question lays in where do you fall in this chart. Your tank is empty. It's Dry. There is nothin in it. Do you, Jessica, like the pvc pipe? Do you like the clear glass, and could you (watch out KiowaScout) Flip out the Andrew Jacksons (white guy no racial reference) out of your wallet to buy the overflow box glass or the plastic one from EBAY, or, if your stocks are doing well (yeah right) you can afford specialty glass like the black glass, or something cooler - let us know if you do.
Does this help?
J
Now, one the end of the line that is FUNCTIONAL BUT LOOKS LIKE TAR, write, "pvc pipe in tank". in the middle of this line somewhere close to the middle, write "plastic overflow / clear glass" and on the end of this line that says WORKS GREAT AND LOOKS GREAT, write "Black Glass overflow".
Now, one the end of the line that is FUNCTIONAL BUT LOOKS LIKE TAR, and, "pvc pipe in tank"- wirte "3 dollars" In the middle, where you wrote "plastic overflow / clear glass" write 20$-25$ and on the end of this line that says WORKS GREAT AND LOOKS GREAT, where you wrote "Black Glass overflow", write 35$-40$.
Your chart should look like this...
<a href="http://photobucket.com/" target="_blank"><img src="http://i28.photobucket.com/albums/c205/jmkarcz/October132006.jpg" border="0" alt="Photobucket - Video and Image Hosting"></a>
The question lays in where do you fall in this chart. Your tank is empty. It's Dry. There is nothin in it. Do you, Jessica, like the pvc pipe? Do you like the clear glass, and could you (watch out KiowaScout) Flip out the Andrew Jacksons (white guy no racial reference) out of your wallet to buy the overflow box glass or the plastic one from EBAY, or, if your stocks are doing well (yeah right) you can afford specialty glass like the black glass, or something cooler - let us know if you do.
Does this help?
J
Nope.... not snarky, Just look at the first systems (10 years ago and more) that were reef tanks with drilled overflows... the overflow was in the right or left rear corner. The and the water was returned on the opposite rear corner.
Since that time, more daring people have designed systems more pleasing to the eye.
I don't know about you, but my reef is about 1 thing... it all boils down to "Eye Candy". If I can't make stuff grow, Look good, and draw attention for being neat and facinating, I'll drain the tank and buy a mortor cycle.
I'm sorry if I seem "Snarky" but it's alot about looks. And it's alot about books. To understand where we are going in this hobby, you also need to know where it's been, What was broke, how it was fixed, and the new processes that were switched to. Beleive it or not, undergravel filters were once cutting edge technology, and sponge filters and airstones have produced some very healthy and successful reef tanks... but gauging what's successful is in the eye of the builder... you. If you just want something in your livingroom that looks like it was plucked from a wholesalers floor, where they only need a glass box with water that flows in, and flows out.... do it. I'll drill it in a second. You would proly do good to look at an aquaculturing site, like www.Aquaticecosystems.com - they specialixe in the not so pretty, but making it work for you and being functional.
back to topic... The thought with the box in 1 corner and the return in the other, is that filtered water is returned the furthest from the box/overflow to give the water more of a chance of being completly "turned over" before being filtered....
WE LEARNED.... that dead spots and detritus spots developte among other things..... with this method... and additional pumps were needed to avoid this.
I and I capitolize I try to remove as much equiptment from the inside of my tanks as possible... thats what sumps and filters are for... aquariums are for fish and corals and rocks.
Do you agree?
Jason
Since that time, more daring people have designed systems more pleasing to the eye.
I don't know about you, but my reef is about 1 thing... it all boils down to "Eye Candy". If I can't make stuff grow, Look good, and draw attention for being neat and facinating, I'll drain the tank and buy a mortor cycle.
I'm sorry if I seem "Snarky" but it's alot about looks. And it's alot about books. To understand where we are going in this hobby, you also need to know where it's been, What was broke, how it was fixed, and the new processes that were switched to. Beleive it or not, undergravel filters were once cutting edge technology, and sponge filters and airstones have produced some very healthy and successful reef tanks... but gauging what's successful is in the eye of the builder... you. If you just want something in your livingroom that looks like it was plucked from a wholesalers floor, where they only need a glass box with water that flows in, and flows out.... do it. I'll drill it in a second. You would proly do good to look at an aquaculturing site, like www.Aquaticecosystems.com - they specialixe in the not so pretty, but making it work for you and being functional.
back to topic... The thought with the box in 1 corner and the return in the other, is that filtered water is returned the furthest from the box/overflow to give the water more of a chance of being completly "turned over" before being filtered....
WE LEARNED.... that dead spots and detritus spots developte among other things..... with this method... and additional pumps were needed to avoid this.
I and I capitolize I try to remove as much equiptment from the inside of my tanks as possible... thats what sumps and filters are for... aquariums are for fish and corals and rocks.
Do you agree?
Jason
The reason I label it as poor and sloppy, is that from a looks stand point, it looks poor... If you use the Kiowascout analysis method of reef aquascaping (Quicken), to total the dollars your spending on this tank.... lets tank a look....
I bought a 75 gallon tank.... used... got a deal... got it for about 80$.... I buy bulkheads for a total of 25$. I pay 55$ worth in pvc in valves, elbow, glue, primer, clear check valve and shipping (22$) Then I buy a used 20 to 30 gallon tank for 25$, but glass baffels into it for 23$ worth of glass, a Mag pump at 85$, a heater for 35$ (I buy good heaters) SALT...40$ (160 gallon bucket) Rock... we buy from the Jandlms for 2.50 a pound at say 80#lbs... so 200$, then fish for say 150$... we buy online, and from Jon again... Don't get me started on corals and frags, and the test equiptment....and , and and....
and so my tank is now around 718$... and theres some things I left out, but for the sake of discussion.... I wave my magic wand and WOOT (new word I learned sounds like it belongs) the tanks is up and running... I cut some corners... but who cares...
Now I told you this story to tell you this one... I got cheap and didn't use the glass for the overflow....I used the pipe.
Now I want one.
I have to up root my whole system and drain it to spend the 20$ for the overflow and put it in, let it dry, and then put it all back.
Jason
Is anyone else out there, or am I alone here?
I bought a 75 gallon tank.... used... got a deal... got it for about 80$.... I buy bulkheads for a total of 25$. I pay 55$ worth in pvc in valves, elbow, glue, primer, clear check valve and shipping (22$) Then I buy a used 20 to 30 gallon tank for 25$, but glass baffels into it for 23$ worth of glass, a Mag pump at 85$, a heater for 35$ (I buy good heaters) SALT...40$ (160 gallon bucket) Rock... we buy from the Jandlms for 2.50 a pound at say 80#lbs... so 200$, then fish for say 150$... we buy online, and from Jon again... Don't get me started on corals and frags, and the test equiptment....and , and and....
and so my tank is now around 718$... and theres some things I left out, but for the sake of discussion.... I wave my magic wand and WOOT (new word I learned sounds like it belongs) the tanks is up and running... I cut some corners... but who cares...
Now I told you this story to tell you this one... I got cheap and didn't use the glass for the overflow....I used the pipe.
Now I want one.
I have to up root my whole system and drain it to spend the 20$ for the overflow and put it in, let it dry, and then put it all back.
Jason
Is anyone else out there, or am I alone here?
DebsSisterFlo
New member
oooh, I think you're reading it that I wanted to do this without an overflow? Not so! No, I DO want the smoked glass overflow, definitely, absolutely.
I'm just trying to figure out where I want holes, etc. Today I'm thinking one drain hole, inside of the overflow, with an elbow and a durso (now that I know what that is).
For the return, would you suggest having the return hole drilled inside and hidden within the overflow, with the pvc going over the side of the overflow? Or would you suggest having holes drilled on either side of the overflow, with bulkheads, for the return? That's where I'm at now... trying to figure out the best return.
I'm just trying to figure out where I want holes, etc. Today I'm thinking one drain hole, inside of the overflow, with an elbow and a durso (now that I know what that is).
For the return, would you suggest having the return hole drilled inside and hidden within the overflow, with the pvc going over the side of the overflow? Or would you suggest having holes drilled on either side of the overflow, with bulkheads, for the return? That's where I'm at now... trying to figure out the best return.
scooters reef
New member
Uh oh, Jason is excited now
scooters reef
New member
I know when you know what you're doing, as you do, it isn't supposed to be difficult, but I almost had a nervous breakdown turning my acrylic tank into Swiss cheese. LOL, I'd never manage to even try glass
Oh, and for sure get decent bulkheads, from Fleet Farm as Jason mentioned or elsewhere. I just ordered mine from an online supplier and lose sleep now
I'd change them still, if I could figure out how.
Worst part is, once I started installing them I didn't like them right off, but was in a jam to get things moved and just used them. Dumb me
I like Jason's drawings though. Working within whatever you end up envisioning I bet it comes out perfect!
Oh, and for sure get decent bulkheads, from Fleet Farm as Jason mentioned or elsewhere. I just ordered mine from an online supplier and lose sleep now
I'd change them still, if I could figure out how.Worst part is, once I started installing them I didn't like them right off, but was in a jam to get things moved and just used them. Dumb me
I like Jason's drawings though. Working within whatever you end up envisioning I bet it comes out perfect!
DebsSisterFlo
New member
oh gosh Jason, how did we get on such a perpendicular path of thoughts?
Yes, I want holes.
Yes, I want a glass overflow.
Yes, I want a durso standpipe.
Yes, I want glass baffles in my sump...
I just need help now with my return...
do I want it to go over the side of the overflow, or do I want holes with bulkheads that I can see so that there is return flow on both sides of the tank?
I'm sorry, not sure how it happened, but wow I must have thrown you somehow!
Yes, I want holes.
Yes, I want a glass overflow.
Yes, I want a durso standpipe.
Yes, I want glass baffles in my sump...
I just need help now with my return...
do I want it to go over the side of the overflow, or do I want holes with bulkheads that I can see so that there is return flow on both sides of the tank?
I'm sorry, not sure how it happened, but wow I must have thrown you somehow!
RCS
In Memoriam
I think the gist of what the boys are saying is that you may as well do it right the first time and plan ahead (it's easy to plug holes) rather than doing it to a lesser extent and deciding a year from now you should have done it right the first time.
I don't think anything extravagant is necessary, but as Jason said, the less gleaming white pieces of plumbing you have in your tank, the better it's going to look.
I don't think anything extravagant is necessary, but as Jason said, the less gleaming white pieces of plumbing you have in your tank, the better it's going to look.
DebsSisterFlo
New member
ok, so what does that mean? Should I go over the side of the overflow? I just want to understand what's going to be done, what I should choose and why. It sure seems to confuse people what I'm asking... sorry to be so undecided, I'm not trying to be difficult, really!
scooters reef
New member
I'd wait for Jason to get back from lunch. He is probably chewing on a burger and figuring it all out at this very moment
One question I have, if the return is through bulkheads below water level, how do you add a siphon break? Or would it be dependant on the checkvalve alone? Sure does look better though.
One question I have, if the return is through bulkheads below water level, how do you add a siphon break? Or would it be dependant on the checkvalve alone? Sure does look better though.
DebsSisterFlo
New member
Jason, I looked at your drawings on page one and now that it makes more sense to me I do like that first drawing for the inside... but I think I'd like to stick to one overflow, two will take up so much room in this little tank...
DebsSisterFlo
New member
<a href=showthread.php?s=&postid=8334178#post8334178 target=_blank>Originally posted</a> by scooters reef
I'd wait for Jason to get back from lunch. He is probably chewing on a burger and figuring it all out at this very moment
One question I have, if the return is through bulkheads below water level, how do you add a siphon break? Or would it be dependant on the checkvalve alone? Sure does look better though.
that's what I learned at the other forum, and so that's why I'm thinking that I'd want the return to go over the side of the overflow (somehow???) so that if the power is cut it doesn't drain the tank down... but then at one point Jason told me that he has check valves on his returns for just that occurance, so maybe we'll do that?
I think I'll just drop the tank off and tell him "have at 'er!" and I'll pick up it when it's done and go from there! :lol: Should have done that the day I got the tank, then I wouldn't have things so stirred up now!
