Just got my tank!
- Thread starter Fmellish
- Start date
mmoore0803
Premium Member
How long did the tank run empty? Looks good and I see yer clown found a new home.
If we pretend the incident with the green goby never happened, (which I am doing), the tank ran fallow for three weeks.
However I don't believe there was anything bad in the tank. The two anthia that died came to me sick, and the green goby who I thought had died, wasn't dead. So I think the whole re-quarantineing process may have been for nothing. Except it did give me the chance to medicate all of my fish against any potential issues they might have had.
Josh
However I don't believe there was anything bad in the tank. The two anthia that died came to me sick, and the green goby who I thought had died, wasn't dead. So I think the whole re-quarantineing process may have been for nothing. Except it did give me the chance to medicate all of my fish against any potential issues they might have had.
Josh
mmoore0803
Premium Member
i see......rolling the dice.....and you claim to not like Vegas 
BONDQ
Premium Member
Clown #2 is not looking happy. I'd like to think that it's separation disorder, but I know that's not the case.
He was all active and happy two days ago, but won't eat now and is sluggishly swimming. I also noticed that his coloration is starting to look pale. He was a rich orange just two days ago.
Anyone think he has velvet? Should I go with Copper on this one?
He was all active and happy two days ago, but won't eat now and is sluggishly swimming. I also noticed that his coloration is starting to look pale. He was a rich orange just two days ago.
Anyone think he has velvet? Should I go with Copper on this one?
My male true perc died with the same symptoms. Once I noticed the symptoms he was dead in 24 hours. Without sampling his tissue and analyzing at a lab you will never know for sure. The presenting diagnosis from Kelly Jedlicki, expert of the disease forum at marinedepot, was brooklynella.
That's why I pulled all my fish out and treated them for brooklynella. Velvet is obvious, his skin will look like suede. Also, if worms are causing malnutrition he may experience sluggishness or slight loss of color. If he starts to lay down on the sand bed, it's too late.
you can reference my existing brooklynella thread here, pics are included.
http://www.marinedepot.com/FORUMS/Topic25892-10-1.aspx
Cheers
Josh
That's why I pulled all my fish out and treated them for brooklynella. Velvet is obvious, his skin will look like suede. Also, if worms are causing malnutrition he may experience sluggishness or slight loss of color. If he starts to lay down on the sand bed, it's too late.
you can reference my existing brooklynella thread here, pics are included.
http://www.marinedepot.com/FORUMS/Topic25892-10-1.aspx
Cheers
Josh
BONDQ
Premium Member
No More Clowning Around
No More Clowning Around
Well, Clown #2 is dead.
I went for a Formalin dip tonight and it didn't make it.
I was careful to measure the appropriate amount, but I need to get a Hospital tank to make sure I have the correct amount of water.
I had to approximate with the container I was using and that could have caused its death.
Alternatively, it just may have been because it couldn't breathe from being so sick. I made sure to use an air pump with stone, but it did no good.
No More Clowning Around
Well, Clown #2 is dead.
I went for a Formalin dip tonight and it didn't make it.
I was careful to measure the appropriate amount, but I need to get a Hospital tank to make sure I have the correct amount of water.
I had to approximate with the container I was using and that could have caused its death.
Alternatively, it just may have been because it couldn't breathe from being so sick. I made sure to use an air pump with stone, but it did no good.
Sorry to hear about the second clown.
According to most research, whatever he had, the tang will carry too. The tang may not mind it, but he could have it. Additionally, the life cycle for Ich and Velvet (not sure about Brook), includes a stages that live in the water, in the sand, and on the fish. The tank won't be free of the pathogen until it has run fishless for 4-8 weeks.
Generally a quarantine tank shouldn't have a sand bed, rock or invertebrates in it. It just allows you to treat with meds without killing the inverts plus the pathogens don't get the opportunity to nest. Most experts recommend a water change every day. Although if not treating and only observing a new fish, water changes don't have to be daily. Some people go to the trouble to siphon out excess food and fish p00p every day. I did that sometimes.
For my formalin plan Iwould use 3 gallons of QT water in a bucket with a powerhead and airstone. If gave me a daily opportunity to siphon out the qt tank waster and do a water change. While the fish is getting dipped, it give me some time to put new water into his tank.
Copper is easier, just add it to the tank at the recommended dose and maintain that concentraion during the treatment period.
The problem in all of this is that it's really hard to diagnose the problem and all of the advise from the experts is very conservative, so it's imposslbe to know when a fish is cured. The safe standard seems to be 6 weeks of observation with no issues. That starts at the conclusion of treatment.
Keep in mind, I didn't follow much of the advice.
I just wish the state of the live stock in the hobby were healthier. Putting a new fish in your tank shouldn't be Russian Roulette.
Why are fish arriving at stores so sickly? Why do so many fish get sick at stores? It seems there is little insentive for a LFS owner to cleanse his system and trash his livestock the first time he sees Ich. He just needs to keep stuff long enough to sell it, so he just throws some copper in his fish only supply and figures he's making an effort to treat incoming fish to some extent. And then the hobbyist gets the fish home and it looks fine for a week, or maybe two, or maybe even three, and then it comes down with something.
Or the fish may not have a pathogen, but simply not have a strong ticker after all of the stress of capture, whether through mechanical means or chemical means.
It's just a pain in the arse all around.
I think I'm done with fish, I've got enough, only corals for now.
Cheers
Josh
According to most research, whatever he had, the tang will carry too. The tang may not mind it, but he could have it. Additionally, the life cycle for Ich and Velvet (not sure about Brook), includes a stages that live in the water, in the sand, and on the fish. The tank won't be free of the pathogen until it has run fishless for 4-8 weeks.
Generally a quarantine tank shouldn't have a sand bed, rock or invertebrates in it. It just allows you to treat with meds without killing the inverts plus the pathogens don't get the opportunity to nest. Most experts recommend a water change every day. Although if not treating and only observing a new fish, water changes don't have to be daily. Some people go to the trouble to siphon out excess food and fish p00p every day. I did that sometimes.
For my formalin plan Iwould use 3 gallons of QT water in a bucket with a powerhead and airstone. If gave me a daily opportunity to siphon out the qt tank waster and do a water change. While the fish is getting dipped, it give me some time to put new water into his tank.
Copper is easier, just add it to the tank at the recommended dose and maintain that concentraion during the treatment period.
The problem in all of this is that it's really hard to diagnose the problem and all of the advise from the experts is very conservative, so it's imposslbe to know when a fish is cured. The safe standard seems to be 6 weeks of observation with no issues. That starts at the conclusion of treatment.
Keep in mind, I didn't follow much of the advice.
I just wish the state of the live stock in the hobby were healthier. Putting a new fish in your tank shouldn't be Russian Roulette.
Why are fish arriving at stores so sickly? Why do so many fish get sick at stores? It seems there is little insentive for a LFS owner to cleanse his system and trash his livestock the first time he sees Ich. He just needs to keep stuff long enough to sell it, so he just throws some copper in his fish only supply and figures he's making an effort to treat incoming fish to some extent. And then the hobbyist gets the fish home and it looks fine for a week, or maybe two, or maybe even three, and then it comes down with something.
Or the fish may not have a pathogen, but simply not have a strong ticker after all of the stress of capture, whether through mechanical means or chemical means.
It's just a pain in the arse all around.
I think I'm done with fish, I've got enough, only corals for now.
Cheers
Josh
mmoore0803
Premium Member
"I think I'm done with fish, I've got enough, only corals for now."
But you don't have the infamous Blue Velvet Damsel yet!
But you don't have the infamous Blue Velvet Damsel yet!
BONDQ
Premium Member
It really can be a pain.
The diagnosis process is rather vague and even then the treatments are many cases just as disruptive as letting the sickness take its course.
It can be very discouraging, especially given that the hobby is expensive both financially and time-wise.
You'd think that someone would have created some sort of microscope kit that would allow you to sample water and test for pathogens by now. Just in same fashion as a Salifert test kit.
I'm know I'm oversimplifiing, but things should be easier IMO.
Regarding LFS, I see your point, it's all about turning livestock, and there's not much they can do since they run central systems.
The Reef Room dips every incoming fish (I watched them do it, personally), and even then they had a couple of fish sick; though most look in good condition.
I have even been back over the course of several weeks and repeatedly seen some of their larger fish still on display and in healthy shape, so that's proof that they are trying to take good care of stuff, otherwise they would have died.
They speak highly of a Hydroplex dip on arrival. Troy says they have very good success with.
...and given that the only fish I bought there is Dr. Tang and thus far is the only fish that has been continually healthy, I guess we're doing pretty good.
I'd really like to see this True Percula pair do well. They are really pretty and they were somewhat expensive.
The diagnosis process is rather vague and even then the treatments are many cases just as disruptive as letting the sickness take its course.
It can be very discouraging, especially given that the hobby is expensive both financially and time-wise.
You'd think that someone would have created some sort of microscope kit that would allow you to sample water and test for pathogens by now. Just in same fashion as a Salifert test kit.
I'm know I'm oversimplifiing, but things should be easier IMO.
Regarding LFS, I see your point, it's all about turning livestock, and there's not much they can do since they run central systems.
The Reef Room dips every incoming fish (I watched them do it, personally), and even then they had a couple of fish sick; though most look in good condition.
I have even been back over the course of several weeks and repeatedly seen some of their larger fish still on display and in healthy shape, so that's proof that they are trying to take good care of stuff, otherwise they would have died.
They speak highly of a Hydroplex dip on arrival. Troy says they have very good success with.
...and given that the only fish I bought there is Dr. Tang and thus far is the only fish that has been continually healthy, I guess we're doing pretty good.
I'd really like to see this True Percula pair do well. They are really pretty and they were somewhat expensive.
BONDQ
Premium Member
Looking Good, Josh!
Looks like you need a weed-whacker for that kelp.
I suppose if you let it, it could take over the tank like a weed, but in proportion its got to be great for controlling other algaes in the tank.
Speaking of trimming, what will you do with the Xenia when it gets too tall?
...and how do you go about doing that without damaging it?
On a different note, that green brain has stunning coloration, as does your Gorgonia.
-Eric
Looks like you need a weed-whacker for that kelp.
I suppose if you let it, it could take over the tank like a weed, but in proportion its got to be great for controlling other algaes in the tank.
Speaking of trimming, what will you do with the Xenia when it gets too tall?
...and how do you go about doing that without damaging it?
On a different note, that green brain has stunning coloration, as does your Gorgonia.
-Eric
mmoore0803
Premium Member
cool acropora.....everything else looks great! Xenia is easy to frag....just cut the stalks
Thanks.
I trimmed the kelp for the first time on easter morning. It was probably 2 yards long. It reached the surface and then across the tank along the surface. I couldn't get my hand into the tank without touching it. It grows several inches a day. It was easy to trim I just used my thumbnail to sever all of the stalks at their bases. The pics you see now are what's left after a few days of growth of chopping it all off.
As far as Xenia, you can't kill it, it is a beginner coral. You can cut it with scissors or simply rip it in pieces. The cleaner the cut, the more even the growth will be though. I got a piece that was kind of jagged from being ripped and it grows funny now. It keeps walking up the rock leaving behind stalks. I have 5 large stalks now instead of the one I started with.
The brain does look well. Thinking that it was his location that made him thrive so well I moved my red brain next to him. Look in the full tank show from the rear and you should be able to see the read brain to the right of the green one. I'm hoping the red brain will flourish as equally.
My clowns are fighting now. Its cute when they fight. They used to rub butts, but now they peck at each others faces. It's like they are kissing, but really hard.
Cheers
Josh
I trimmed the kelp for the first time on easter morning. It was probably 2 yards long. It reached the surface and then across the tank along the surface. I couldn't get my hand into the tank without touching it. It grows several inches a day. It was easy to trim I just used my thumbnail to sever all of the stalks at their bases. The pics you see now are what's left after a few days of growth of chopping it all off.
As far as Xenia, you can't kill it, it is a beginner coral. You can cut it with scissors or simply rip it in pieces. The cleaner the cut, the more even the growth will be though. I got a piece that was kind of jagged from being ripped and it grows funny now. It keeps walking up the rock leaving behind stalks. I have 5 large stalks now instead of the one I started with.
The brain does look well. Thinking that it was his location that made him thrive so well I moved my red brain next to him. Look in the full tank show from the rear and you should be able to see the read brain to the right of the green one. I'm hoping the red brain will flourish as equally.
My clowns are fighting now. Its cute when they fight. They used to rub butts, but now they peck at each others faces. It's like they are kissing, but really hard.
Cheers
Josh
BONDQ
Premium Member
Let me know when you frag your Xenia and I'll give the cuttings a happy home.
My big tank should go into physical production next week; I just need to work out some design decisions and get them finalized.
I'm not sure when I'll have it yet, but it's going to be nice to have the extra space and to work on a tank of great scale.
Having the Nano (if you can call a 32G a Nano), gives an interesting perspective on the hobby, since well everything you do must be small. It's like having a banzai tree for a reef tank.
In a 300 gallon, it's exactly reversed.
It will be nice to grow small, thumbnail frags in the Nano and ultimately transport them into the large tank and have them grow really big. What an interesting scale change.
I can't imagine having a 6 gallon Nano or a 1 gallon Pico tank, but some people do them.
My big tank should go into physical production next week; I just need to work out some design decisions and get them finalized.
I'm not sure when I'll have it yet, but it's going to be nice to have the extra space and to work on a tank of great scale.
Having the Nano (if you can call a 32G a Nano), gives an interesting perspective on the hobby, since well everything you do must be small. It's like having a banzai tree for a reef tank.
In a 300 gallon, it's exactly reversed.
It will be nice to grow small, thumbnail frags in the Nano and ultimately transport them into the large tank and have them grow really big. What an interesting scale change.
I can't imagine having a 6 gallon Nano or a 1 gallon Pico tank, but some people do them.
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