Long post - please help me out with my sps problems

[PITSTOP]

OK, I was in his position using maxijets on a wave timer - they permitted significant amounts of detritus to accumulate in and on the rocks which fueled nuissance algae/phosphates resulting in poor water quality.

Since he plans on switching to a Tunze, I recommend he gets rid of all that gunk, and the Tunze will help keep the rocks relatively free of detritus.

I did this procedure to my rock, got rid of my maxijets, replaced them with 3 SEIO 1500's, Hagen 802, kept 4 maxijets for additional movement under my rocks - the result I am now having speak for themselves.

This is just my advice based on my personal success,

 

[10" Red Devil]

LOJ,

I am in a similar boat and I have all of the similar kinds of advice. I think there are these things we do that are definitely manditory to keeping SPS, but then there are other things that are not well understood about keeping SPS. It is amazing to me how people with almost identical tanks and regiments can have such varying results. Im talking about being just as diligent in keeping their tanks. Yet somehow one is successful and the other is not. I definitely believe there are people who can keep sps and have them be colorful, but largely they do not even know why. They have that secret ingredient(s) and just dont know it.

I dont want to discourage you but to encourage you to keep trying and hopefully you will find that holy grail of getting your sps to color up!

 

[LobsterOfJustice]

If I remembver correctly my w/c water tests around Ca-410 Alk- upper 8's, pH 8ish. I will test all those parameters tomorrow to make sure. A note on the low pH: my tank used to hover in the high 7's low 8's until I began dosing Kalk - now it is around 8.2-8.3 every time I see check it.

The corals are mostly frags (a few mini colonies) - the newest ones were aquired around 2 months ago, my oldest I have had for 10 months.

I have thought about the light issue - I will shorten the photoperiod, but why am I having these problems now?

I am not barebottom, SSB. I generally follow BB methodology, but just have a sandbed for asthetics. Back when I had to manually top off I was losing 2 gallons per day. I have an auto topoff now so I'm not exactly sure how much I evaporate now.

I do not dose anything other than the kalk and randy's alk solution (and now a little bit of B-Ionic mag). Also, about the detrius on the rocks - yes the MJ's do let a lot settle, but I turkey-baste the rocks almost every day and change out the filter sock afterwards. I will only take the rocks out as a last resort - some of my corals are doing very well and encrusting, and I am very happy with my current aquascape.

As said before, Ca reactor parts are on the way as well as tunzes. I got a GenX PCX pump for my skimmer, and got the plumbing parts in the mail today. I will be re-plumbing my skimmer tomorrow, which hopefully will make it much more efficient (running on a mag 9.5 now).

As always, thanks everyone.

 

[ReefWaters]

PITSTOP, I see where your coming from but I don't believe it will help Lobster. First, I don't believe he has much nuisance algae and scrubbing the rocks will get rid of 90% of the micro fauna that has been slowly increasing over the past year. I think that will send him in the wrong direction. But a good idea for a tank that needs a complete overhaul.

Lobster, I think if you want to stick with the game, take the advice you have gotten here to tweak your present system and methods to find your nitch. Just don't buy any wild colonies until you get the results you are looking for consistently.

Good Luck

 

[orion76]

<a href=showthread.php?s=&postid=6416531#post6416531 target=_blank>Originally posted</a> by 10" Red Devil
I definitely believe there are people who can keep sps and have them be colorful, but largely they do not even know why. They have that secret ingredient(s) and just dont know it.

IMO it's stability.

Even if your tank is suboptimal for keeping SPS, many will adapt and survive and some will even thrive...

If stability is lacking however the corals have nothing to adapt to and either RTN or slowly but surely die away over a period of weeks to months.

Some people will always have problems because they keep messing with their tanks to fix a mystery problem that is killing their corals, while what is really killing the corals is the continued messing with the tank

 

[ReefWaters]

<a href=showthread.php?s=&postid=6418071#post6418071 target=_blank>Originally posted</a> by orion76
IMO it's stability.

Even if your tank is suboptimal for keeping SPS, many will adapt and survive and some will even thrive...

If stability is lacking however the corals have nothing to adapt to and either RTN or slowly but surely die away over a period of weeks to months.

EXACTLY! I completely agree. You hit the nail on the head.

 

[LobsterOfJustice]

Picked up a salifert phosphate test kit today - p04 undetectable in my tank. I am still working on the skimmer upgrade... turned it on today and had a few minor leaks, fixed them up (hopefully) and letting it dry overnight. The tunzes are not in yet (ordered them through a LFS - it was actually cheaper than online).

Everything is kind of hovering in limbo in the tank - not getting worse or better. I'm hoping the tunzes, skimmer upgrade, and Ca reactor will solve my problems. I will keep ya'll updated.

 

[MiddletonMark]

Please do

 

[tgfrench]

Lobster

I feel your pain. I've had limited sucess with SPS 's to date. It seems I'm sorta hit or miss with something also. Maybe its just the adaptation thing going on. I've got a few corals that I purchased that are growing well and others that just sorta languish in my tank. One acro all but wasted away till I fragged it and all the frags colored up and are starting to encrust (go figure). All of my parameters have been fairly stable for the last year but just not much growth till lately. I added a 900 gph closed loop 2 weeks ago so I hope things will improve.

 

[LobsterOfJustice]

Update

On Sunday Dr. Mac gave a presentation at one of our local club meetings and brought some corals with him. I picked up three mini-colonies, and a frag (all acros) from him, and an efflo frag from another reefer. All seem to be doing well.

The base of the tricolor nana has lost tissue. It is wedged between two rocks - I have noticed while basting that detrius settles here. I am guessing the lost tissue is due to lack of flow. I still have not recieved the Tunzes - called the LFS numerous times. I know they are on their way, but I dont like waiting this long. They cant give me a straight answer as to why they are already two weeks late. I'm not worried about them scamming me or anything, but think they are handling the situation poorly.

Just hooked the skimmer back up tonight. I needed to do some replumbing and was waiting on some pieces. Also had to solve a microbubble problem. I have ordered all the parts for the reactor except for the reactor itself, which is being made.

My lights are approaching their 1 year mark - I have ordered 10K Reeflux to replace my XM's.

Water parameters as of tonight:
SG - 1.026
Ca - 400
Alk - 8.0
Mg - 1260
PO4 - 0
NO3 - about 1

Couldnt check temp because my pinpoint thing was being stupid. Whenever I check it is within a degree of 80. However, I never check it at night - is it likely my temp is swinging at night? How much would it have to swing to be having the effects I am seeing?

Is there some kind of digital thermometer that tells you the highs and lows over a 24 hour period?

 

[redwinger02]

MY opinions here.
1. Phosphate kits are a waste of money the algae in the tank will consume any detecable phosphate. (at least with a salifert kit)

2. As stated before stability is key

3. Halide photoperiod is too long IMO should shorten to about 5 hours.

4. Get rid of the carbon it just leaches P04

5. How stable is your alk? I find this to be a major factor with sps. Ca is not as big of a deal if it swings but alk swings is more detrimental.

6. Nitrate is a little high but shouldn't make a big difference IME.

7. The flow will help you out considerablly IMO. Stuff will settle less and will get skimmed out quicker before it has time to decompose.

8. Bulbs might be a little old and the spectrum has shifted at 12 months. Replace them.

9. As some have stated SSB. I doubt this is the cause but might want to consider getting rid of it.

 

[ReefWaters]

redwinger02 has some very good points.

However, I am running the same photoperiod and and I have a shallow sand bed. I dont seem to have any problems.

But like he was suggesting, I have a lot of flow, I do not run carbon, and my alk is usually stable.

Are you using a heater and/or chiller to keep your temp stable?

My opinions:
If your using any mechanical filtration, I would stop.
If you dont have a refugium, I highly suggest setting one up. The bigger the better but even a half gallon will have benefits for any tank. Especially sps tanks. They remove nutrients and add food to the tank that the sps thrive on.

Your parameters look pretty good IMO. Just keep doing what your doing, including what you have planned on doing, take your time and dont do anything too quickly. Spread changes apart. When you change your lights, dont do anything else to the tank that day. Leave it alone for a few days, other than feeding or fixing emergencies, before you do anything like a water change or adding the Tunzes, etc, etc.

Good luck and please keep us posted.

 

[LobsterOfJustice]

Thanks for the comments guys.

The halide photoperiod was shortened to 5 hours about a week ago, and I put a layer of screen over the tank to help too.

I just started using carbon after christmas. I am reluctant to stop because IMO the clarity of water has improved. I was also having problems before running the carbon.

My alk seems stable but I dont check it every day. I am hoping a Ca reactor will help here.

I have been using a filter sock washed off every few days. I stopped last night. I have a refugium but the cheato hasnt grown since I got my skimmer last spring.

 

[orion76]

<a href=showthread.php?s=&postid=6534143#post6534143 target=_blank>Originally posted</a> by LobsterOfJustice

Is there some kind of digital thermometer that tells you the highs and lows over a 24 hour period?

The Aqua Controller from Neptune Systems does that as well as for your PH and other parameters you may wish to monitor.

Probably too pricey if you just need it as a thermometer though.

 

[ReefWaters]

<a href=showthread.php?s=&postid=6537242#post6537242 target=_blank>Originally posted</a> by LobsterOfJustice
I have been using a filter sock washed off every few days. I stopped last night. I have a refugium but the cheato hasnt grown since I got my skimmer last spring.

Okay, some people may disagree but the reason I dont use mechanical filtration is b/c I believe the stuff you are removing is more important to the microphauna of the system than the benefits of removing it. My cheato did not take off for months. Now Im removing half of it almost weekly from my 10g fuge. Give it time, but I would bet now that you are not using the sock, that your cheato will grow faster, the skimmer will work better, and the corals will start perking up. The few times I have used mechanical filtration, I had crazy things start happening.

Good luck.

 

[LobsterOfJustice]

Update:

Good news and bad news, but good for the most part (I think). Since my last post I have lost more (5-7?) corals. BUT I have not lost any corals in over a month. I have swapped the Maxi-jets for Tunze 6000's and a multicontroller. The Ca reactor is now keeping my Ca and alk steady at 450 and 9.3. I took the filter sock off except I run it for a few hours after I baste the rocks. I switched the lights out for Reeflux 10K and the colors are coming back to some of my corals. I still have little to no growth, but I am hoping this is just a matter of time. I am ordering a second phosban reactor and some phosban this week, eventhough I am not reading any phosphate on the salifert kit (I have heard you can still have too much phosphate even if it's too little to show up). I will start out very slowly with it. I am also going to order some polyfilters because I figure they can't hurt.

Thanks to everyone who has helped.

 

[ReefWaters]

Sounds like you're on the right track. Now just don't put any new corals in the tank until you see better coloration and some growth out of 95% of the corals in the tank now. Just take your time and keep up with your reading. Don't ever do anything to the tank unless you have read 10 different opinions on the issue.

Keep up the good work! Good Luck!