I have started making live rock which is a lengthy process and I am curious as to what I need to buy to get the purple algea going and other algeas, bacteria life etc. I was told garf grunge but I would like to know any info you can provide to help me create some decent live rock.
Making LIve Rock!
- Thread starter greg97527
- Start date
It is not actually live rock until you add the bacteria and other life which is the question I need answered.....Anybody?
Cement Reef Rock Recipes.
Try this good simple basic recipe to make some of the cheapest porous cement reef rock around. It costs only about 9 cents a lb using this recipe! Using a five gallon bucket, add 5 cups of common easy to find type I/II Portland cement from Home Depot, a hardware store or building supply store. Add 25 cups of crushed oyster shell from a farm feed store. Add six cups of water and mix very thoroughly with a small hand held flower gardening digger. Use rubber gloves to protect your hands from chemical burning due to extended exposure to the high pH of the fresh cement - this is like soaking your hands in supersaturated kalkwasser. Tip the bucket on a 45 degree angle and rotate or roll it to help tumble and mix the cement well. Use the gardening hand digger to mix the cement as you tumble it in the bucket. If the mix is too dry add a little more water (slowly). Karen Holt tries for a final mix with the consistency of cottage cheese. Others go a bit wetter than this, but not too slushy. Many sand substitutes can also be used to make your cement if desired. More on this later. You can get crushed oyster shell at the farm feed store since it is used as a very common chicken feed supplement. And that, my friend, is why THIS cement reef rock recipe is so "cheep, cheep, cheep"!
Do not make the final product too runny or you will not be able to shape it into nice looking irregular shapes as well. An almost slushy mixture that will still stand up just a little and take some shape (just a bit) is just right for molding. In fact, James Wiseman advises that a wetter mix not only assures that the silicates in the cement mix get hydrated and bound, but a slightly wetter mix will produce more micro-pores or capillaries throughout the cement for better bacterial colonization inside the rocks. On the other hand, this can also weaken the cement just a bit, but usually not critically so. On the other hand, don't make it too dry or the cement will have too many large airspace gaps between sand or crushed oyster shell bits and it will then be weaker than the mix that is too wet. Maximum hardness is mostly reached after about a month of curing. Now, using rubber gloves, scoop handfuls of it into a bed of dampened sand (or substitute) for molding and shaping your cement into reef rocks.
Beforehand, you need to prepare this waterproof box or container with sand, crushed coral, aragonite sand or crushed oyster shell. Large plastic garbage can lids work well too. Dig irregular and creative shaped molds in the slightly dampened sand.
***** IMPORTANT READ THIS!!! *****
You need to cure your cement rock WELL before adding it to your aquarium, or it can easily boost the pH of the aquarium water well up over 9! Since proper curing is the most critical part of cement reef rock making, we'll go over the warnings here first, and then right afterwards we'll cover some curing methods. Improperly cured cement rock which raises your reef aquarium's pH, is not conducive to growing algae, fish, invertebrates or anything! Improperly cured cement rock = death to aquarium. Others and I have lost fish, live rock, live sand, live coral and more by getting too anxious to introduce cement rock into aquariums. 12 hours or even a few days with a vinegar curing process and then a week or two of fresh water curing didn't work with larger rocks. It lowered the pH but not enough and it can weaken the more delicate cement rock shapes somewhat and still not completely cure them or fully lower the pH. When properly curing in fresh water is complete (five weeks or MORE!) it should no longer raise the pH of fresh tap water and is now safe to add to an aquarium in any amount. Before adding your new cement rock to your aquarium, TEST the rock for high pH.
After you think your new cement rocks have cured enough in water, change the curing water again and then let them set with a new change of fresh water covering them for about four days. Do not aerate the water or even keep it moving during this final curing time before testing the pH. After four days of this final soaking in stagnant water, stir the water the cement is in just before you test the pH of the water. If the pH has risen to 8 or higher then continue curing another three days (to complete another week of soaking) before changing the water again, letting it set four more days in the new water, and then testing the pH of the water again. You can aerate the water during curing, but not before testing the pH or you will get a false low pH reading due to the aeration precipitating out the calcium hydroxide and calcium oxide that causes the high pH.
The object is to find out if the cement is still leaching, not to see if you can cover up the signs of this final curing and leaching. More on complete leaching and pH rebound at the end of this article. Once the cement is fully cured, I no longer detect these pH raising compounds or silicate leaching. DON'T use cement rock until you KNOW that it will not raise the pH of your tank to the point of killing things in it. This high pH will also cause binding and severe clumping of an aquarium's aragonite sand substrate. So, no matter how you choose to cure your cement rock, TEST IT for pH before using it in your aquarium. It makes absolutely wonderful reef aquarium rock if it is properly cured first. Save a reef, cure your rock!
It usually takes around 2-3 months untill my product is ready but I am doing several 50 gallon buckets at a time.
Cement Reef Rock Recipes.
Try this good simple basic recipe to make some of the cheapest porous cement reef rock around. It costs only about 9 cents a lb using this recipe! Using a five gallon bucket, add 5 cups of common easy to find type I/II Portland cement from Home Depot, a hardware store or building supply store. Add 25 cups of crushed oyster shell from a farm feed store. Add six cups of water and mix very thoroughly with a small hand held flower gardening digger. Use rubber gloves to protect your hands from chemical burning due to extended exposure to the high pH of the fresh cement - this is like soaking your hands in supersaturated kalkwasser. Tip the bucket on a 45 degree angle and rotate or roll it to help tumble and mix the cement well. Use the gardening hand digger to mix the cement as you tumble it in the bucket. If the mix is too dry add a little more water (slowly). Karen Holt tries for a final mix with the consistency of cottage cheese. Others go a bit wetter than this, but not too slushy. Many sand substitutes can also be used to make your cement if desired. More on this later. You can get crushed oyster shell at the farm feed store since it is used as a very common chicken feed supplement. And that, my friend, is why THIS cement reef rock recipe is so "cheep, cheep, cheep"!
Do not make the final product too runny or you will not be able to shape it into nice looking irregular shapes as well. An almost slushy mixture that will still stand up just a little and take some shape (just a bit) is just right for molding. In fact, James Wiseman advises that a wetter mix not only assures that the silicates in the cement mix get hydrated and bound, but a slightly wetter mix will produce more micro-pores or capillaries throughout the cement for better bacterial colonization inside the rocks. On the other hand, this can also weaken the cement just a bit, but usually not critically so. On the other hand, don't make it too dry or the cement will have too many large airspace gaps between sand or crushed oyster shell bits and it will then be weaker than the mix that is too wet. Maximum hardness is mostly reached after about a month of curing. Now, using rubber gloves, scoop handfuls of it into a bed of dampened sand (or substitute) for molding and shaping your cement into reef rocks.
Beforehand, you need to prepare this waterproof box or container with sand, crushed coral, aragonite sand or crushed oyster shell. Large plastic garbage can lids work well too. Dig irregular and creative shaped molds in the slightly dampened sand.
***** IMPORTANT READ THIS!!! *****
You need to cure your cement rock WELL before adding it to your aquarium, or it can easily boost the pH of the aquarium water well up over 9! Since proper curing is the most critical part of cement reef rock making, we'll go over the warnings here first, and then right afterwards we'll cover some curing methods. Improperly cured cement rock which raises your reef aquarium's pH, is not conducive to growing algae, fish, invertebrates or anything! Improperly cured cement rock = death to aquarium. Others and I have lost fish, live rock, live sand, live coral and more by getting too anxious to introduce cement rock into aquariums. 12 hours or even a few days with a vinegar curing process and then a week or two of fresh water curing didn't work with larger rocks. It lowered the pH but not enough and it can weaken the more delicate cement rock shapes somewhat and still not completely cure them or fully lower the pH. When properly curing in fresh water is complete (five weeks or MORE!) it should no longer raise the pH of fresh tap water and is now safe to add to an aquarium in any amount. Before adding your new cement rock to your aquarium, TEST the rock for high pH.
After you think your new cement rocks have cured enough in water, change the curing water again and then let them set with a new change of fresh water covering them for about four days. Do not aerate the water or even keep it moving during this final curing time before testing the pH. After four days of this final soaking in stagnant water, stir the water the cement is in just before you test the pH of the water. If the pH has risen to 8 or higher then continue curing another three days (to complete another week of soaking) before changing the water again, letting it set four more days in the new water, and then testing the pH of the water again. You can aerate the water during curing, but not before testing the pH or you will get a false low pH reading due to the aeration precipitating out the calcium hydroxide and calcium oxide that causes the high pH.
The object is to find out if the cement is still leaching, not to see if you can cover up the signs of this final curing and leaching. More on complete leaching and pH rebound at the end of this article. Once the cement is fully cured, I no longer detect these pH raising compounds or silicate leaching. DON'T use cement rock until you KNOW that it will not raise the pH of your tank to the point of killing things in it. This high pH will also cause binding and severe clumping of an aquarium's aragonite sand substrate. So, no matter how you choose to cure your cement rock, TEST IT for pH before using it in your aquarium. It makes absolutely wonderful reef aquarium rock if it is properly cured first. Save a reef, cure your rock!
It usually takes around 2-3 months untill my product is ready but I am doing several 50 gallon buckets at a time.
PatMayo
New member
hummm, never heard of it before.
I think you would have to start the cycle with a shrimp or something. I woujld not use live fish. I would think that it will take a long time for the rock to be ready for fish. I see the point of it all. To save the reefs. It makes sense.
Buy aquacultered rock and you will save the reefs.
I would be interested in knowing how it turns out for you.
I wonder what it will look like?
Regards,
Pat
I think you would have to start the cycle with a shrimp or something. I woujld not use live fish. I would think that it will take a long time for the rock to be ready for fish. I see the point of it all. To save the reefs. It makes sense.
Buy aquacultered rock and you will save the reefs.
I would be interested in knowing how it turns out for you.
I wonder what it will look like?
Regards,
Pat
I already have some made and will get some pics of it posted up here soon. As long as the PH is dow it works great. I have a small 10 gal tank that I put my hermit crabs in and they have been doing great for about 4 months now, it just takes forever for the rock to turn, it's just barely growing algea now.
boodwah
New member
Or you could order some aquacultured live rock from Tampa Bay Saltwater for $4-6/lb. I'm not discouraging anyone from making it. Heck, I think I'm going to try it. But I didn't know if you knew there was some pretty good inexpensive aquacultured live rock out there. Here is a link to a thread with pics of mine:
http://reefcentral.com/forums/showthread.php?s=&threadid=804073
http://reefcentral.com/forums/showthread.php?s=&threadid=804073
I'm looking for batteries right now to get some pics of the live rock i made.
Swanwillow
goby girl
I was going to make LR, but i didn't want the mess: someday when I get a house and a fishtank/room I'll be making my own.
I think you can get starter cultures for things at ISPF.com for things like that also. BUT, GARF probably has the best cultures for starting the life on it!!!
the DIY forum will be alot more helpful for this type of info
I think you can get starter cultures for things at ISPF.com for things like that also. BUT, GARF probably has the best cultures for starting the life on it!!!
the DIY forum will be alot more helpful for this type of info
Swanwillow
goby girl
sorry-mixed up the letters here: http://www.ipsf.com/
coyoteseven
New member
Here you go, an oldie but a goodie on DIYLR (Do It Yourself Live Rock):
How do I make it
BTW, If you happen to get a search engine failure (a system glitch since you're not really using the search engine
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How do I make it
BTW, If you happen to get a search engine failure (a system glitch since you're not really using the search engine
), close out the window and try again in a minute.
graveyardworm
Premium Member
I made a bunch of rock when I started using the same basic ingredients, the only additional ingredient was silica sand. Very soon afterwards the rock had an established population of bubble algae which I have never been able to get rid of. I have no other nuisance micro algae, that all came and went and all thats left is bubble algae. So I would be very curious to see how your rock matures over the next year. Please keep this thread updated periodically.
jumpincactus
New member
Another trick for seeding base rock or homemade rock is the next time your LFS cleans their reef tank have them give you the coralline algae scrappings then turn off your filters and spread the coralline around your base rock/homemade rock. after about a half hour you can turn your pumps back on. This method really does work. Of course it takes time but you will have effectivly seeded the rock. Or as the others have said buy a piece or two of live rock and seed that way.
GARFVolunteer
Premium Member
Re: Making LIve Rock!
To make the rock live it needs to be seeded with something that has life on or in it like live rock and live sand.
Coralline algae likes smooth surfaces so the smoother you make the surface of the rock the faster the coralline will grow. I made my first rock 7 years ago and it is very coarse and and porous but has little coralline algae growth. I made other rock over the years trying different methods and some were smooth and coralline loves them but they were very dense like a cinder block and would never support much life.
The hard part is coming up with a method that is very porous yet smooth on the surface. I came up with something that works very well... make the rock with 10 parts crushed coral, 1 part sand and 3 parts Riverside White cement. The one part sand is just enough to strengthen the mix but keep it very porous. Once the rock is cured, you can easily make it smooth using sanders and grinders. I use a Delta bench sander and a Dremel tool with different attachments to smooth it out. Rinse the rock very well and it is ready to go.
I have never been a fan of using the oyster shells to make the live rock. it is kind of like using tap water for your tank. Sometimes the water is good and sometimes it is not. Some have had great success with it and others have not. I would stick with the crushed coral just to be on the safe side.
I also use Riverside White Cement which is a low alkali cement manufactured by TXI. Many cements will have a high pH for years and therefore any rock made with it will not be suitable to put in a tank for years. The Riverside White cement does not have the high pH problem and the rock can be placed in the tank after 28 days of curing. Here is their web-site: http://www.txi.com/products/cement/cement.html
Riverside White Cement
Comparable to Type I and Type III
Manufactured so the finished product is white
Common uses: Swimming pool plaster, roofing tile, precast curtain walls, architectural panels, terrazzo surfaces, stucco, cement paint, decorative grouts and mortars.
Available in bulk, 2000 lb super sacks, 94 lb bags
Specifications: ASTM C-150 Type I Low Alkali; Federal SS-C 1960/3
Thanks,
Scott
To make the rock live it needs to be seeded with something that has life on or in it like live rock and live sand.
Coralline algae likes smooth surfaces so the smoother you make the surface of the rock the faster the coralline will grow. I made my first rock 7 years ago and it is very coarse and and porous but has little coralline algae growth. I made other rock over the years trying different methods and some were smooth and coralline loves them but they were very dense like a cinder block and would never support much life.
The hard part is coming up with a method that is very porous yet smooth on the surface. I came up with something that works very well... make the rock with 10 parts crushed coral, 1 part sand and 3 parts Riverside White cement. The one part sand is just enough to strengthen the mix but keep it very porous. Once the rock is cured, you can easily make it smooth using sanders and grinders. I use a Delta bench sander and a Dremel tool with different attachments to smooth it out. Rinse the rock very well and it is ready to go.
I have never been a fan of using the oyster shells to make the live rock. it is kind of like using tap water for your tank. Sometimes the water is good and sometimes it is not. Some have had great success with it and others have not. I would stick with the crushed coral just to be on the safe side.
I also use Riverside White Cement which is a low alkali cement manufactured by TXI. Many cements will have a high pH for years and therefore any rock made with it will not be suitable to put in a tank for years. The Riverside White cement does not have the high pH problem and the rock can be placed in the tank after 28 days of curing. Here is their web-site: http://www.txi.com/products/cement/cement.html
Riverside White Cement
Comparable to Type I and Type III
Manufactured so the finished product is white
Common uses: Swimming pool plaster, roofing tile, precast curtain walls, architectural panels, terrazzo surfaces, stucco, cement paint, decorative grouts and mortars.
Available in bulk, 2000 lb super sacks, 94 lb bags
Specifications: ASTM C-150 Type I Low Alkali; Federal SS-C 1960/3
Thanks,
Scott
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