Monti-eating nudibranchs?

Great pics Marc.

I pulled one out of my tank yesterday.

DSC_1991.JPG



I also have this stuff on one of my other corals.

DSC_2001.JPG


But I'm not sure it is the same.

I lost my sixline wrasse last month, I'm wondering if he was keeping the nudi population in check.

They have a few nice lemon meringue wrasse at the LFS, think I'll stop by tonight and pick one up.

Any chance anyone have photos of the eggs?
 
The "stuff" you pictured are two more. And if you took your picture and imagined it was a clock, look at the two white specks just below the coral's tissue at 5 o'clock. Those are two more tiny ones.

Siphon out all you can.

The eggs are what appears to be a "herd" of them in the very first post of this thread, as well as the only picture on page 2. They are <b>tiny</b> dots shaped similar to grains of rice.
 
<a href=showthread.php?s=&postid=6106132#post6106132 target=_blank>Originally posted</a> by ol'reefer
One interesting thing I have noted with the ones that I have, they seem to be only going after my brown caps. They have not affected my orange, green, purple or any of the encrusting ones (Superman etc..) as of yet. Maybe they are saving them for a midnight snack. Bad humor, I know :)
IME, they seemed to really gravitate towards a couple.
When those were done, they became much less finicky eaters :(

I only had two varieties that seemed to taste bad to them - and still had some areas affected. Was able to `fight them off' of these with inspection, removal, heavy fragging - but that's a couple of over a dozen Monti varieties.

They're a PITA. I lost over a dozen varieties of Montipora in my most of a year-long battle with them.

FWIW, I've marked one LFS off due to these, as they were using a `natural cure' [wrasses] ... which left their tanks fine, without problems/symptoms - and my tank infected. If involved in fragging/trading, IMO a natural cure is questionable as you very well might pass them along further + be another vector for the pest.
 
I have been battling these guys for almost a year now....

Originally I pulled the montipora colonies from the display and dipped in 60PPM Levasole......it just stunned them and allowed me to blow off the ones I could see. I scrapped off all eggs I could find and then returned to the main tank. I did this for about 2 months on a weekly basis. After the first month I didn't see any more nudi's during the dips....So I felt safe ending the dips after month 2. All corals looked great for about 2 months and then.....I made the mistake one night by saying to my wife "I am so glad I decimated the little stinkers (not the word I used originally)" And wouldn't you know it the second the words left my mouth we noticed a monti nudibranch crawling on one of the rocks.......!@#$%^!@!@

At this point I started dips again using TMPCC and had poor results unless dosed extremely high (Expensive!)

So my new treatment scheme goes as follows (and I think I am actually killing them during the dips). I have reached the point of despiration and decided to perform a Hail Mary move and yanked all Monti's from the reef and put into QT and started dipping with 120PPM Levamisole for about 45min....:eek2:

I have done this many times now and the monti's show little to no stress.....their polyps are out within 15min after the dip, and all have held most of their colors (they are paler but not bleached)and none have died from the dips. I have indeed found dead nudibranchs in the bath when I was done.....I am doing the dips every three days because they seem to breed quickly and I am sure I didn't find any eggs....so they need to hatch and meet their maker.....

I will do this for a month or so and leave the main tank empty of Montis for several months. I will then introduce a canary into the coalmine (monti Frag) for a while to see if any nudi's somehow survived starvation before I put everything back.
 
UGGGHHH!!!

Thanks for pointing out the egg pics.

If you break them in half are they like star fish in that they will grow into two?

I've been picking them off with tweezers, I got about 30 of them last night. The Monti they are on has grown onto the surrounding rock so taking it out is not an option.

The eggs were a little tougher. I hit them witha tooth brush but I'm worried that I may be making the problem worse cause it is not easy to siphon them out.

I added a Lemon Meringue Wrasse last night, hopefully he will survive and start eating those little buggers.

I hope this does not turn into a year long event.

Keeping my fingers crossed.........GO LEMON WRASSE!, GO!
 
npirate.....

I gues it has been a couple of weeks with the lemon wrasse.... Any advance in ridding the nudis???????? At some of them???
 
Lemon wrasse didn't make it. My Clowns beat him up and he died from his wounds. :( i could not tell if he was eating them becasue he never really got acclimated to the tank.

However I have been making progress.

I've been picking them off with a tweezer. Their population is way down and they only re-appear after 4 or 5 days. Also i've noticed that when i am picking them off if I fan some water towards the coral with my hand they tend to come out a little more and they are easier to get. I sometimes use a turkey baster to blast it with some water also.

One of the two corals that was infested with them has made a 100% recovery and they have not re-appeared on it.

Also the one they have reappeared on has been recovering nicely. Many of the areas that were bare have grown back compeltely and there are only a few bare spots on it.

I'll be picking up another wrasse tomorrow. I also added about 25 very small blue leg hermit crabs and there are always one or two walking around on it. it's possible they are just picking off food.

Good luck, if the second lemon wrase works out I'll post to let you know.
 
Does anyone know if monti/acro crabs eat them? I was wondering if anyone has a monti that is hosting a crab and also has this problom? Just curious.


A few more pics. they seem to be making a come back.

nudi-DSC_2041.jpg


nudi-DSC_2052.jpg


nudi-DSC_2042.jpg
 
they will never go away unless you remove all your montis.. TMPCC doesnt totally kill them in my experience either.. I got rid of mine by removing all mine to QT, dipping, (with tmpcc that seems to stun them and makes them easier to remove) scrubbing, observing, and blasting with a powerhead. after about 4 weeks I noticed none on the corals in the qt... and havent seen any since. one thing to note is that they wont attack all monti varieties, they prefer caps but wont mess with all caps. from my experience
 
<a href=showthread.php?s=&postid=8594698#post8594698 target=_blank>Originally posted</a> by menard
Marc
The only fish really attack this barstards is Radiant Wrasse.
I had bad infestation a while back, this fish really helps w/ o ripping every montis in the tank., As long as u dont have any agresive fish in the tank that can attack this fish, so he can feel at home and comfortable and start working, you will be amaze, and watch this natural nudi preditor strike each one in the tank until U have no more.
The tank is nudi free until now..........thank god for this fish.:)

Radiant wrasse? Latin name? Link? Please help!
 
The second Wrasse is not doing well.

Once again the welcoming committee has not been kind to him.

You can see him in this photo getting sized up. I had to remove him to my refugium this morning. Poor little guy.

CLICK TO ENLARGE
welcoming+clowns+DSC_2102.jpg
 
I currently have 5 varieties of Plating Montis, 4 varieties of digitatas, and a fairly large orange whirling monti. Some of these are fairly large, but I also have quite a few frags of some of them. Pulling them all out would be a nightmare, and I'm sure I'd end up reducing them to ruble since most are glued to or already encrusted onto large rocks.

As of right now, a digitata and my larger whirling monti are the only two that I've actually observed the on. I first noticed them on the digitata as it is closer to the top and the front of the tank. It was a frag where the "branches" had become fused and formed a somewhat large irregular shaped chunk. Because of this, I attached it to the rocks laying sort of flat, so that hopefully some of the branches would start to grow out on their own and resemble a normal digitata, again.

It lies, in such a way, that the frag is lying almost flat against the rock with only a narrow crevice between it and the rock. Doing so, has apparently allowed them to "hide" and proliferate under the leading edge. Apparently, this is very attractive to the nudis. :blown:

None of the other digitata frags were attached in such a way that presented such an ideal location for them to set up "camp". This is why, I believe, that I haven't yet noticed them on my other digitatas. There just isn't as easy a place to hide, since the "branch" on the others is attached at a more perpendicular angle to the rock and not creating such an attractive hideout.

I have been pulling the occasional nudi from this digitata for a month or two, not really knowing what I'm dealing with. A few years ago, I found a much larger predatory nudi on some starpolyps and assumed that any hairy-looking nudi was probably not desireable.

So far, they've been attaking the same small area of this frag, so locating them hasn't been a problem. By the way, does dismembering them create assexual reproduction or do they die if they've been "scraped" to death? Anybody know?

Unfortunately, it seems that complete irradication may not be possible if you can't remove all your montis from your system, however, could the introduction of enough predators keep them in check enough for your corals to survive? I know this isn't ideal, but under the circumstances it is seeming like a better and better option.

I added my six-line wrasse from another tank last night. He is a real scavenger in the other tank and is always looking through every nook and cranny for something "alive" to munch on. Poor guy, he wiped out every bristleworm and copepod from that 42g Hex months ago but still continues his endless seek and destroy mission, hoping beyond hope that he somehow "missed" one. :uzi: I just hope that he notices the nudis instead of all the copepods and bristleworms in the much larger system. Somehow, I doubt it though, but I'm gonna try it anyhow. :(

So far, I've "read", that people have tried introducing the following potential "nudi predators" to their systems:
1. Yellow Cori Wrasse
2. Radiant Wrasse
3. Red/Blue leg hermits
4. Six-line Wrasse
5. ?

Did I miss any potential predators?

Also, does anyone know whether or not a yellow cori wrasse will co-exist with a six-line in a 150g?

Is anyone worried about introducing ICH with any additions of predators to their tank? I hope you aren't just dumping these fish into your tanks without qt'ing them for this dreaded beast, because IMO it just as much a pain for your fish as nudis are for montis. I enjoy my fish just as much as the corals. I don't want to lose either one. Unfortuantely, that may not be the case.

In addition, I decide to FW dip(15 sec as recommended in a previous article) the larger whirling monti last night, because I just couldn't seem to be able to remove or access them in all of its little crevices. This morning it was still a pale orange but showing significant slophing of mucous. Only time will tell if it'll pull through. Has anyone else tried this drastic measure? Any success?

Keep up the good fight-Mike
 
6 months later...

6 months later...

I still battling these little F#$%^&'s.

They have Infested

- 1 Digi
- 3 Capricornis
- 1 Foliosa
- 2 Danae Orange / Purple

They started on my Large Green Capricornis, they didn't come in on that piece it was one of my first Monti's. Now they are on the Digi and my Orange Danae.

I tried:
- Siphoning w/ Baster
- Tweezers
- Tooth Brush
- Plastic scrub brush
- Fresh water RO dip (3 times)
- Lugol's Iodine Dip (2 times)
- 3 Yellow Coris Wrasse (2 died, third has no interest)
- Hosing them in sink (killed my 3 Caps and Purple Danae)
- Quick Cure

I hosed the corals off with cold water using a hose in my slop sink, this basically killed the corals. Within 3 days the other monti's which had showed no signs of them were infested.

Yesterday I took out the Digi and dabbed Quick Cure on it with a Q-tip. Have not returned but it is only a matter of time.

At this point I'm going to let them finish off the Orange Danae as it is encrusting a giant rock and really can't be removed. I'll going to take the Digi back to the LFS and see if they can quarantine it and cure it.

I've noticed that they do love the poorly light areas on the Monti's under the edges and in crevasse. I've also found them crawling over live rock going from one Monti to another.

Coincidentally this all started about 3 weeks after my six line wrasse died. I guess some wrasses have a taste from them but considering some of the places they hid under they corals I don't see how wrasses alone can control it.

Really would like to know if crushing them cause them to reproduce.

Final note, I have 2 digi's in a 30 gallon connected to the same system. So far no contamination.
 
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