My Uber Skimmer: an ASM G-3 Modification

[adnup]

<a href=showthread.php?s=&postid=7899650#post7899650 target=_blank>Originally posted</a> by george1098
I would highly recommend it. I've been amazed at how well mine is working and it has only been a few days. I'm already noticing changes in the tank. Far less oily streaks floating at the top of the display tank, water looks clearer, hair algae blooms are clearing up, less diatom growth, and the corals (of which i have very few right now) are nice and open and loving life. I actually live in Florida for a few months out of the year, If you still haven't taken the plunge by next winter, maybe I could offer some more encouragement when I am down there

Small world, my grandfather had a house in Advocate Harbor NS, beautiful up there. Where in FL do you winter?

 

[adnup]

<a href=showthread.php?s=&postid=7900052#post7900052 target=_blank>Originally posted</a> by Roland Jacques
looks good, my question is how you get that 4" (looks like 4") pvc ("bubble cup" ) in your body? does the entire tops come off the ASMs nowadays?
recirc mods are great ,personaly i think the cup is a very good simple mod that would beifit a lot of skimmers, good job.

yes the "cone" top twists off

 

[MJAnderson]

I have been reading up on running my overflow directly into the skimmer but from what I have read it's difficult to regulate the water level in the skimmer without frequent adjustments. How are you finding it?

Also, I didn't see a ball valve of any kind on the overflow. How are you regulating the amount of water that ends up in your skimmer. I had read that flow rates greater than 200 caused decreased skimminer performance.

 

[adnup]

<a href=showthread.php?s=&postid=7878590#post7878590 target=_blank>Originally posted</a> by george1098
The last thing I did was install a bubble cup (that’s what I’m calling it anyway). The bubbly water will be fired into this cup directly from the pump, where it will mix around before flowing upwards to make foam. This will help reduce turbulence in the skimmer body (above the cup) which will keep the bubble sizes down. H and S and bubble king skimmers use a similar design. I am toying with the idea of putting a bubble diffuser plate, like on the BK skimmers on top of the cup. What do you think?

Is the "cup" a 4" piece of PVC? and is there a bottom to it?

 

[Horace]

I think your idea of the "bubble cup" seems like it is a good one, but I am not 100% sold that it will help you at all. It seems to me that your pump now has 2 90 degree elbows on its output, essentially putting head on your pump, this inturn will reduce the amount of air suction. Also, I wonder what the effect of pumping the water in that downward direction may have on bubble size?

Obviously your skimmer is working well...But I have to ask myself, if this works so well, why dont any of the main skimmer manfs do it this way?? H&S does it very differently and only on thier smallest skimmer because of a super small diameter body. You dont see anything like that on all the others. Plus they dont come in from the top of the "cup" they go through the side of it with the pump flipped on its side so its a straight shot out the outlet of the pump.

Just some thoughts I had that you might want to consider...Or not

 

[Horace]

For the record on feeing the skimmer....I have a current DIY skimmer that runs off of the overflow. I find that not only does it create random flow into the skimmer but it also puts alot of large air bubbles into the skimmer. This causes it to burp occasionally.

My new skimmer will be fed by a MJ600 which is just about 2x my 75g tank volume....Im going to put this pump in a strategic place to get as close to "raw" overflow water as possible (though I really doubt how big of a difference that really makes anyway).

 

[george1098]

<a href=showthread.php?s=&postid=7900052#post7900052 target=_blank>Originally posted</a> by Roland Jacques
looks good, my question is how you get that 4" (looks like 4") pvc ("bubble cup" ) in your body? does the entire tops come off the ASMs nowadays?
recirc mods are great ,personaly i think the cup is a very good simple mod that would beifit a lot of skimmers, good job.

Yupp the whole top comes right off which makes cleaning (and mods) a breeze.

 

[george1098]

<a href=showthread.php?s=&postid=7900198#post7900198 target=_blank>Originally posted</a> by MJAnderson
I have been reading up on running my overflow directly into the skimmer but from what I have read it's difficult to regulate the water level in the skimmer without frequent adjustments. How are you finding it?

Also, I didn't see a ball valve of any kind on the overflow. How are you regulating the amount of water that ends up in your skimmer. I had read that flow rates greater than 200 caused decreased skimminer performance.

Actually Dr. Evil you're right, and if you use a gate valve (or ballvalve I suppose) to regulate the water level in the skimmer, the water level will fluctuate with the amount of water that is being drained off by the overflow, so constant adjustments are needed. That is why I did away with my gate valve and I went back to the standard ASM method of an adjustable slip exhaust pipe. I just set the hight of the exhaust pipe where I wanted it (so the bubbles are about half way to three quarters up the inner tube of the collection cup) and it stays there with no problems.

As for the ballvalve, I had innitially intended on putting one in, I just happened to be doing this on a sunday when home depot is closed (here in Nova Scoia time has passed us by and we still don't have sunday shopping). I honestly don't know how much flow I have going through the skimmer, but after I throw the gate valve on I will be able to adjust it as I please.

 

[george1098]

<a href=showthread.php?s=&postid=7900274#post7900274 target=_blank>Originally posted</a> by adnup
Is the "cup" a 4" piece of PVC? and is there a bottom to it?

yes it is 4" pvc, I glued it right to the bottom of the skimmer (which is also pvc), but another approach would be to glue an end cap to the 4" tube and just sit it in the bottom. This would probably be better if you're not sure if youwant to keep it.

 

[Roland Jacques]

<a href=showthread.php?s=&postid=7900382#post7900382 target=_blank>Originally posted</a> by Horace
For the record on feeing the skimmer....I have a current DIY skimmer that runs off of the overflow. I find that not only does it create random flow into the skimmer but it also puts alot of large air bubbles into the skimmer. This causes it to burp occasionally.

i think youcan elimnate the bubbles and burping by going from 1-1/2" pvc into 2" pvc for a short length before you hit the clear tubing. or even just taking the 1-1/2" down a lot futher (to the bottom of the stand) before you hook up to the tubing. it depends how much flow as to how long or wide your pipe needs to be.

 

[george1098]

<a href=showthread.php?s=&postid=7900359#post7900359 target=_blank>Originally posted</a> by Horace
I think your idea of the "bubble cup" seems like it is a good one, but I am not 100% sold that it will help you at all. It seems to me that your pump now has 2 90 degree elbows on its output, essentially putting head on your pump, this inturn will reduce the amount of air suction. Also, I wonder what the effect of pumping the water in that downward direction may have on bubble size?

Obviously your skimmer is working well...But I have to ask myself, if this works so well, why dont any of the main skimmer manfs do it this way?? H&S does it very differently and only on thier smallest skimmer because of a super small diameter body. You dont see anything like that on all the others. Plus they dont come in from the top of the "cup" they go through the side of it with the pump flipped on its side so its a straight shot out the outlet of the pump.

Just some thoughts I had that you might want to consider...Or not

Thanks for bringing that up Horace. I was going to mention that later on. Unfortunately my point and shoot cam sucks and I never could get a good 'before and after' shot of the bubbles in the skimmer. You'll have to take my word for it that the bubbles after the modification are smaller than before. Before, there was so much turbulence in the skimmer that the bubbles would all mash together and join to form larger bubbles. Now that the little cup is in there, there seems to be much less turbulence, and the bubbles flowing up the neck of the skimmer are a very consistent tiny size.

As for the 'head loss' due to the extra 90 degree elbow, you are probably right, but given the relatively short length of the tube, I’m sure its effects are pretty much negligible, but who knows.

<a href=showthread.php?s=&postid=7900382#post7900382 target=_blank>Originally posted</a> by Horace
For the record on feeing the skimmer....I have a current DIY skimmer that runs off of the overflow. I find that not only does it create random flow into the skimmer but it also puts alot of large air bubbles into the skimmer. This causes it to burp occasionally.

My new skimmer will be fed by a MJ600 which is just about 2x my 75g tank volume....Im going to put this pump in a strategic place to get as close to "raw" overflow water as possible (though I really doubt how big of a difference that really makes anyway).

check out this pic

Notice how the vinyl tube is at the end of a 3" or so nub of 1 1/2" pcv. There is way that the 1/2" ID vinyl tube I used would ever be able to keep up with all the water traveling through the overflow drain line. what will happen, is the water will 'pool' in the little 3" nub before it drains down into the skimmer. What is left will spill over and go down the other section of the Y fitting into the sump, so not all of the water is diverted into the skimmer. I did this by design to help eliminate the very effect you are talking about. It seems to be working as I cannot see any large bubbles flowing down the vinyl tube. I think you're approach will work well though, and that was my plan B if I had problems with my design. Just place your pump as close as you can to the outlet of the drain line. Also, the MJ 600 is a great feedpump choice. It will last for ever!

 

[george1098]

<a href=showthread.php?s=&postid=7900158#post7900158 target=_blank>Originally posted</a> by adnup
Small world, my grandfather had a house in Advocate Harbor NS, beautiful up there. Where in FL do you winter?

Small world indeed!
I go to Melbourne for a few months around Feb-April. I am on the CDN national flatwater canoe/kayak team and I go to attent a training camp. I love it down there.

 

[Horace]

Right now my drain has a ball valve on it that adjusts the amount of flow to the skimmer and that helped the burping quite a bit, but the other problem is that i am using like 3/4 or 1" (cant remember) clear tubing which is much to large and it does not stay full of water because im not flowing enough water through it. This is a problem I think. My next skimmer (to hit the market soon ) will use a much smaller tube and the MJ600 and that should ensure NO air gets in the tube. Even if its not quite as raw water, I think the fact that it will have perfectly smooth flow and no air, that will likely perform ALOT better than my current config. Thats my guess anyway.

 

[george1098]

yes I agree, I think you'll like your feedpump idea

 

[adnup]

What do you guys think of this.
I havent done the recirc. mod yet but I like the bubble cup idea. The reason(i think) for the cup is mainly for the recirc pump not to suck in "bubbly" water, but to get water with out bubbles to airate it. Right? So if I just do the 90deg elbow with out the cup for now, will that help? It will add more time for bubbles to capture "crap", right?

 

[Beccas_dad]

Question here: I have been running a ASM G-3 with no mods for over a year now and my levels are all great and steady. I get about a 1/2 cup of skimate in 2 days. I run my skimmer at about 1/2 to 3/4 water level. Drilling and such is something i dont want to do if this is not going to give me very noticable benifits. The reason why i ask is that I know of 5 LFS that run the asm and none have the mod. Now you could say they dont do it cause they want to sell them to the public. But would that not be a great sale point that for only x amount of dollars you can increase the ability and we even have the parts in stock?

Not trying to say dont do this mod. But you George you indicated that you went on a Camping trip and came home to a full cup that has never been done before? I have been running mine for over a year and get a full very dark cup in 4 days ever since i started running mine.

I am just trying to make sure this is worth drilling since i like to mod but want to see the change but if it is going to be the same i have other mods to attend to.

 

[george1098]

<a href=showthread.php?s=&postid=7914467#post7914467 target=_blank>Originally posted</a> by adnup
What do you guys think of this.
I havent done the recirc. mod yet but I like the bubble cup idea. The reason(i think) for the cup is mainly for the recirc pump not to suck in "bubbly" water, but to get water with out bubbles to airate it. Right? So if I just do the 90deg elbow with out the cup for now, will that help? It will add more time for bubbles to capture "crap", right?

sounds right to me, go for it. You may consider adding an end cap to a peice of 4" pvc and just sitting it on the bottom of the tank. If you don't like it, just remove it. Also, don't glue any of the 1" fittings you're using for the pump spray assembly. again, if you don't like them, just remove them.

 

[george1098]

<a href=showthread.php?s=&postid=7915518#post7915518 target=_blank>Originally posted</a> by Beccas_dad
Question here: I have been running a ASM G-3 with no mods for over a year now and my levels are all great and steady. I get about a 1/2 cup of skimate in 2 days. I run my skimmer at about 1/2 to 3/4 water level. Drilling and such is something i dont want to do if this is not going to give me very noticable benifits. The reason why i ask is that I know of 5 LFS that run the asm and none have the mod. Now you could say they dont do it cause they want to sell them to the public. But would that not be a great sale point that for only x amount of dollars you can increase the ability and we even have the parts in stock?

Not trying to say dont do this mod. But you George you indicated that you went on a Camping trip and came home to a full cup that has never been done before? I have been running mine for over a year and get a full very dark cup in 4 days ever since i started running mine.

I am just trying to make sure this is worth drilling since i like to mod but want to see the change but if it is going to be the same i have other mods to attend to.

Good points, first of all I'll say that I only ran the skimmer for about 2 days before I did the mods, so I didn't have much to compare the full cup to. My previouse skimmer was a Remora Pro hang on skimmer that would take about 2 weeks to fill a cup :s . Secondly I'll say that I now get a full cup every 2 days. I emptied my cup last night (around 10 pm) and I just took a peek under the cabinet (it is exactly 7:25 pm the day after) to see a 1/2 full cup of skimmate. I won't say my skimmer is better than yours because any number of things can influence skimmate production, nutrient levels, water column hight, bioload, temperature, but I will say I honstly do think the mods made a difference. If you're happy with your skimmer the way it is, don't do anything to it. And don't do the mods just to 'try them out' because you can't exactly go back.
I think you are right about the fish store. Its probably not a good selling point for a product that looks like it needs to be improved upon to make it work. I happen to run a small internet aquarium goods company (the name of which i dare not mention or i'll be condemned by the mod gods) , and I told my customers all about my modifications. However, I made sure to explain why I did them, and what difference they made. Pound for pound the ASM's are still the best buy out there as far as skimmers are conserned, moded or not.

 

[adnup]

I think I'll try it. Will post pic when I'm done....

 

[Charlie Davidson]

(along the same lines as Horace) if you have not glued pvc, remove bubble cup and the down pipe. shorten the pipe intering and leave 90.. but turn it so the water swirl's around the "body" this will allow longer contact time.. Like said earlier, Just some thoughts