My Ultimate Multi Mantis System(s)

[Kharn]

G'day all :wavehand:

Thought I would share my current design plans (albeit quite basic) to get comments, I'm still stumped on lighting rite now for the tanks but I have given 300mm above each tank for a light of some kind my back up plan will just be a standard dual T5 fixture 1xwhite 1xblue and they measure up at 7cm high leaving 20-23cm gap for working, I can custom fabricate holders for the lights to get them rite up as high as they will go.

Each stand will have a fluval FX5 for its filtration, canisters positioned behind each stand.

Stand A: The top & middle tanks will house the smallest mantis shrimps being kept, the smaller species of Gonodactyl's <100mm (Adam, Eve, Rocky & Shockwave), Whilst the bottom tank holds the slightly larger smashers >100mm but <150mm (Maximus & Minnie) making 'Stand A' - No Vacancy!

Stand B: The top tank will hold similar to the bottom tank of 'Stand A' being >100mm but <150mm (P.ciliata's example), the middle tank will likely be Morgoth's new home, for this tank (because its 300mm wide) I will split it in half with eggcrate (length wise) but only to the height of the sand beds depth, where I will then place Live Rock in the back portion whilst Morgoth will dig along the front. In the bottom tank for this stand I hope to house the Largest smasher either an O.scyllarus or something of that "caliber". Making this stand still capable of holding between 3-4 more mantis shrimps (depending on whether Morgoth pairs up).

Stand C: Both tanks are going to house Large Spearing species Leviathan will go into the top tank still undecided on bottom tanks inhabitants but its larger for the biggest of spearer(s), Making this stand still capable of holding between another 1-3 mantis shrimps depending on whether Leviathan pairs up and whether the bottom tank is a pair already which is likely. This stand will house quite deep sand beds with the top tank having about 30cm-35cm depth to its sand bed and the bottom one 40-45cm of depth to its sand bed.

Volumes and available spacings/overall sizes


Flow & Plumbing positioning


Smashers get LR with hole in it / Spearers get a DSB


Overall I can keep between 12 and 15 different stomatopods inside very neat tidy and just GOOD display tanks (more if I split a couple tanks via egg crate) also for the sake of coloration I plan on adding a single colony of Zoa's to each Mantis's own tank/enclosure these will be top of the line premium Zoanthids each colony different color/pattern, I plan on just letting them grow like nuts where they want so it carpets each enclosure and so I can harvest them to sell, pay a lot up front, make it all back later! .

Recent study has lead me to believe of some VERY interestingly colored LARGE spearing species the "Bathysquillidae" and they occur in australian waters, which I am starting to show great interest in and there capable of reaching quite large sizes (200mm-275mm) and have a deep red coloration (no pics available).

I already know this system is going to work filtration wise because it (broken down) IS my current system....see my current system is around 300L larger then any of the 1 stands alone and my current system is housing ALL 8!! of my current mantis shrimps ("Zuzu the Unique" is in his own nano remember) each one thriving but next to impssoble to film or get decent pics of in there current "enclosures" except for the spearers (I opted for safety (against each other) over visibility (for my enjoyment) originally knowing I would have too many hence THIS build).

Comments/Questions Appreciated & Wanted

 

[dnh828]

I was thinking about suggesting a refugium/skimmer for a system this size as the performance would be potentially better, but as you said this is a decrease in water volume and your current system is working well.

My two questions would be:

1. Does egg crate really work between two smashing type mantis shrimp?

2. All of this will come down to the actual construction of the overflows/stands/hoods. For the plumbing I assume you are using hard pvc? I'd be sure to put pressure fitting joints in if you glue them or simply don't use glue at all. I don't know what your budget is or how much of it you want to do yourself, but in north Texas there are regularly people selling rack systems and if I were doing this I would buy an already made system and then modify it. I will be very interested in this build as I can see myself doing something similar down the line (though perhaps not ALL for stomatopods).

Looks like a great idea, can't wait to see how this progresses.

 

[TundraGuy]

Yes I have been waiting for progress on Hotel Mantis! A 5 star vacation destination for all your mantis-ie needs.

Couple of questions for you.
First what section of this beautiful palace is the Doc Roy wing?
And second
Looks like you’re going to be running the drains strait from one to the next as the feed, how will you control the micro bubbles? Are you going to using a Waikiki surge device for each drain? This may be very cool! To control the bubbles created by this type of surge device you make a false wall with a slit in it about half way up with a piece of plastic about an inch from the slit this will alow the bubbles to go up inside the box and the water to push across the tank in a nice strong yet gentle flow pattern. Now for those out there that think will this would make the tank water level rise and fall that’s an easy solution as well. On the opposite side of the surge is your overflow box that feeds the next tanks surge. Water will flow into this compartment adding in creating the surge for the tank beneath it. I wish I knew how to draw a computer added drawing for you sounds complex, but easier then you’d think. There are NO MOVEING parts, no added power draw, simulates a natural wave surge pushing water through the viewing area, no added heat, makes a killer wave sound, will help you to create a more natural enclosure for your permeate guest at the hotel. Also remember you do not have to do this for all your tanks only the ones that will house animals from areas that get water surges in the wild. Here is a little video check it out: http://www.youtube.com/watch?v=g3PukBTpCjM

Ok one more question when do you sleep bro? Your posts are at all hours of the day and night.

 

[Jon E Busch]

Oh shi... Ima need a bigger tank/Tanks

Sweet Setup man! Thanks for giving me an Idea of what you have. I've read your post but had no idea of the scale of it all. KUDOS!

 

[Kharn]

I was thinking about suggesting a refugium/skimmer for a system this size as the performance would be potentially better, but as you said this is a decrease in water volume and your current system is working well.

Originally all 3 stands were going to be plumbed together and in that case I was going to need a large sump,skimmer etc. Also as of note the DSB in the spearers tanks will still in part act in a way as part of filtration like a normal DSB (once the spearers have made there tunnels and stop tunneling that is) and all the LR that will go in the smashers tanks will in part be filtration too!

My two questions would be:

1. Does egg crate really work between two smashing type mantis shrimp?

I'm not sure what you mean here are you referring to it withstanding the blows ? If so, then yes easily and in the mere case of paranoia you can just double it up or do 3 sheets back to back which is just overkill.

2. All of this will come down to the actual construction of the overflows/stands/hoods. For the plumbing I assume you are using hard pvc? I'd be sure to put pressure fitting joints in if you glue them or simply don't use glue at all. I don't know what your budget is or how much of it you want to do yourself, but in north Texas there are regularly people selling rack systems and if I were doing this I would buy an already made system and then modify it. I will be very interested in this build as I can see myself doing something similar down the line (though perhaps not ALL for stomatopods).

I am a steel worker / welder by trade and all of the frame work is being bought through my family's business (need around 70mtrs of steel) hence I get it at bulk buy / warehouse costs rather then paying full retail =) so I will make the stands.

As far as the PVC piping goes let me describe my current plumbing on my current tank, I have a HOB overflow rite now ITS AWESOME, anyway this overflow feeds down into my sump obviously, through the plumbing where by water flows from overflow into sump there is 1.......90degree bend (I know I know) however this bend is only zip tied on LOL and its NEVER leaked, so as far as pressure goes for the pump/gravity etc all I needed to do was increase the diameter of all the pumps to be greater then that of the Fluval FX5 (the filter & primary pump / flow creation in each stand).

Looks like a great idea, can't wait to see how this progresses.

Neither can I thanks for questions and comments :beer:

 

[Kharn]

Yes I have been waiting for progress on Hotel Mantis! A 5 star vacation destination for all your mantis-ie needs.

I wanted to accommodate a range of different species but at the same time I want to really be able to accommodate for each individual species special needs (think peacocks and low lighting vs G.smithii and high lighting!) because as much as I want to and will provide for this little critters I still want to get visual enjoyment in it, take the large spearer tanks for example there sand beds are deep REAL deeep 30-45cm however there tanks are only 150mm wide! This should increase the chances of windows popping up if not the entire tunnel displayed! (thanks Dr. Caldwell)

Couple of questions for you.
First what section of this beautiful palace is the Doc Roy wing?

I'm not sure what you mean by this xD ?

And second

Looks like you're going to be running the drains strait from one to the next as the feed, how will you control the micro bubbles? Are you going to using a Waikiki surge device for each drain? This may be very cool! To control the bubbles created by this type of surge device you make a false wall with a slit in it about half way up with a piece of plastic about an inch from the slit this will alow the bubbles to go up inside the box and the water to push across the tank in a nice strong yet gentle flow pattern. Now for those out there that think will this would make the tank water level rise and fall that's an easy solution as well. On the opposite side of the surge is your overflow box that feeds the next tanks surge. Water will flow into this compartment adding in creating the surge for the tank beneath it. I wish I knew how to draw a computer added drawing for you sounds complex, but easier then you'd think. There are NO MOVING parts, no added power draw, simulates a natural wave surge pushing water through the viewing area, no added heat, makes a killer wave sound, will help you to create a more natural enclosure for your permeate guest at the hotel. Also remember you do not have to do this for all your tanks only the ones that will house animals from areas that get water surges in the wild. Here is a little video check it out: http://www.youtube.com/watch?v=g3PukBTpCjM

Interesting that you bring this up, so far I am under the assumption that things shouldn't really be a problem, with plumbing being bigger then required for the actual water to flow through and around in the pressure itself should be minimal (not including the actual pressure in the inlet/outlet pipes of the FX5 but even then if everything goes to plan the inlet and outlet for each tank will be submerged not actually have water fall and create bubbles, I'll have to wait and see to be honest but its something I am not that worried about rite now since I don't even know how it will turn out but in theory once each tank is full and the canister running each bulkhead inc the FX5's outlet and inlet should be completely submerged my FX5 rite now produces 0 bubbles.

Ok one more question when do you sleep bro? Your posts are at all hours of the day and night.

LoL I sleep but being Australian I am starting to get a grip of when "you guys" are on and answer to most threads which happens to be around midnight-3am here =) also this coming week is the big week I'll be getting most things done for this system, I took the whole week off work so I can drive around and get things for the build and start to build things too!

 

[Kharn]

Today I will go about setting up the "temporary housing tank" a simple 3 foot tank that I will plumb my current sump & HOB Overflow into (essentially just swap over to it no cutting etc ) because I need to break down my current tank since it occupies the new systems space...

Even though this "temporary housing tank" is only going to be in use for 1-2months TOPS I had an idea to maximize my enjoyment with my spearers still and essentially recreate what I am about to do in the new system albeit on a much smaller scale xD so......the tank will be a typical 3 footer basing it off my current system being 1200mmx450mmx450mm this new 3 footer will be the same width and height but well....900mm/3ft long the plan is to first layer a sheet of eggcrate along the base of the tank, then split the tank in half length wise via another sheet of eggcrate and then split the tank in half again width wise essentially creating 4 equally sized compartments inside the 3 foot tank!

The back 2 compartments will hold allll the current Live Rock I have whilst the front to will hold Morgoth the L.sulcata and Leviathan the L.maculata! With the same depth sand beds they currently have (although new sand & only sand this time) this should increase the chance of them creating windows when they burrow or in a great case a total visible tunnel!

 

[Kharn]

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Bathysquilla

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Bathysquilla crassispinosa

Colour: Reddish orange dorsally. Propodus and dactylus of raptorial claw, pereiopods, uropodal exopod and endopod pale. Eyes with metallic grey cornea.

Size(wild caught): 195mm - 297mm

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Bathysquilla microps

Colour: Almost entirely red. Cornea of eye unpigmented. A1 peduncle, A2 protopod and peduncle, carpus and distal portion of merus of raptorial claw translucent white.

Size(wild caught): 109mm - 221mm

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Hemisquilla

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Hemisquilla australiensis

Colour: Overall dorsal colour pale blue-grey. A1 peduncle bright blue, flagellae red. A2 scale clear, marginal setae clear red. Raptorial claw with propodus and dactylus pale blue. Pereiopods blue proximally, white distally. Uropodal exopod with proximal segment dark blue extending onto proximal ¼ of distal segment; remainder of distal segment iridescent French blue with red setae.

Size(wild caught): 77mm - 174mm

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Upon learning of these species there were a few things that really "tickled my fancy" lol...firstly the large size I tend to prefer the bigger species of mantis out there all these are capable of attaining sizes greater then 6inches/150m (double in the case of 1) which is a win in my books! Another aspect and perhaps the most intriguing is the colors specifically B.microps in the "revision for Australian stomatopods" this species is heavily described in being a red to nearly completed red body color! Lastly it goes to say without effort that....our strict countries laws prevent me from getting any stomatopod that is outside my own waters.....these species have been recorded multiple times to reside within my waters so it should be no problem in obtaining them so all it will take is time.

Source:http://australianmuseum.net.au/Uploads/Journals/17907/1333_complete.pdf

 

[FLMantis]

Awesome and out of control my friend . Someone else in here is building a mantis condo. Might want to seek some of his advice as well. Good luck, and please post progression pics...

 

[Kharn]

Awesome and out of control my friend . Someone else in here is building a mantis condo. Might want to seek some of his advice as well. Good luck, and please post progression pics...

I think your referring too 'bshumake' and his 'mantisville' while I like his system I opted to make mine slightly smaller to get away with less equipments and sump(s) I made plans before I found his thread to make this setup because I knew after I got my first mantis I wanted more a LOT more!

 

[Kharn]

Finally found some what I hope to be confirmed pictures of 2 of the species that I hope to obtain both the Bathysquillas, amazing colors for spearers! I am not 110% positive they are what they say they are but the colors in them are nice anyway so I can only hope.....

Bathysquilla Crassispinosa

A live in aquarium specimen! Coloration that rivals L.lisa! I believe that the coloration is also partly due to the lights being actinics.


Another live in an aquarium specimen!


Bathysquilla Microps

Dead specimen I believe.


No luck on Hemisquilla Australiensis...I've asked Dr. Caldwell before about them to and he was unable to provide a pic of them but hopefully he hops in here to confirm or deny the current pics and there supposed identities.

More to come!

 

[Bluemon]

good luck with your build! looking forward to seeing pictures!!

the second pic reminds me of just regular super market shrimp. LOL

 

[Kharn]

good luck with your build! looking forward to seeing pictures!!

the second pic reminds me of just regular super market shrimp. LOL

I see what you mean by the second pic its color looks like that of a cooked prawn albeit if I didn't know about mantis shrimps and I got one of these types in my cooked prawn batch I must admit I'd either take it back or throw it away through fear of it being poisonous or something

Thanks for stopping in to comment!

 

[King Nikon]

How come you are going to use a canister filter and not an old fashioned large sump? (one of those large gray bins or two make great sumps if you have the room)

 

[Jodah]

Because he already has the filtration parts. I personally can't wait to see this up and running! It's going to be awesome!

 

[Kharn]

How come you are going to use a canister filter and not an old fashioned large sump? (one of those large gray bins or two make great sumps if you have the room)

I not only have most of the filtration already....but if I add a sump I will loose 1/3 to 1/2 of the available space I already have for the mantis shrimp so basically I will loose 1 tank on each stand to dedicate to a sump.

Also in my experiences so far a sump is NOT needed for mantis shrimps, they will be more then fine with the canister filters so essentially I am saving money on not having to buy all the normal equipment a normal reef tank would need (sump/refugium/proteinskimmer/chiller/u name it I don't even have heaters in my tanks either its all room temp).

Also recently found out which lights I am doing too, there a nice neat setup and won't be to harsh on the mantis shrimp and should be more then enough for a single colony of Zoa's per tank =) above each tank will be 3 strips of LED lights 2 blue 1 blue attached to a very very thin slim fixture with reflector inside there made by Hato and are quite cheap the 2 foot one is $100 for 18watts which should be fine for what I need.

I bought 1 of the Heto lights yesterday from a LFS and tried it out as soon as I got home...wow...WOW either that or my previous light was just utter crap haha.....

My old light was an AquaNove dual T5 (1xwhite 1xblue 24w each tube) this new light the Heto is same length with but total of 18w and it easily outperforms the T5 fluros in brightness also the blue atinic lighting is much more deep in the LED's then the Fluro T5 which brings out the fluro colors of the corals and mantis shrimps soo much more!

Also this HETO LED Light is literally 1/3 the thickness of the Fluro fixtures making it ideal for this setup due to only having 300mm above each tank to work with!

Best part!!?!?!?!

This LED light cost me as I said $100 the Dual T5 Fluro AquaNova cost me $160!

 

[King Nikon]

Large body of water = more stable parameters and imo you would most definitely need a skimmer, mantis are super messy eaters because they bury food.

Also why would you need a chiller? It's not like you are using halides or T5's that generate heat.

 

[Kharn]

Large body of water = more stable parameters and imo you would most definitely need a skimmer, mantis are super messy eaters because they bury food.

Also why would you need a chiller? It's not like you are using halides or T5's that generate heat.

While I agree with you I am still inclined to go with what I currently have set in mind and as far as the chiller reference some species prefer colder temperatures one in particular that I am looking at is a Hemisquilla (which I'll need to separate from the others in a cold system) since to my knowledge the southern waters of australia can become quite cool not sure if it gets as cool or cooler then the Californian species but even those go to 15-18degrees celsius (59-65 degrees Fahrenheit)

I am more likely to add HOB Refugiums before I am to go and get skimmers....

Thanks for your input as always its appreciated

 

[King Nikon]

I like to run skimmer + refugium with chaeto and mangroves in it. My reef tank and mantis tank are both pretty good on phosphate levels (though mantis tank is a little higher since I just recently added a skimmer a few months ago)

 

[MantisO_o]

HELLO!!! One pretty ugly bugger!

Finally found some what I hope to be confirmed pictures of 2 of the species that I hope to obtain both the Bathysquillas, amazing colors for spearers! I am not 110% positive they are what they say they are but the colors in them are nice anyway so I can only hope.....

Bathysquilla Crassispinosa

A live in aquarium specimen! Coloration that rivals L.lisa! I believe that the coloration is also partly due to the lights being actinics.


Another live in an aquarium specimen!


Bathysquilla Microps

Dead specimen I believe.


No luck on Hemisquilla Australiensis...I've asked Dr. Caldwell before about them to and he was unable to provide a pic of them but hopefully he hops in here to confirm or deny the current pics and there supposed identities.

More to come!