New Setup, Cycling Questions

[davehead86]

I have had a FW tank for years now and wanted to move to a SW tank. I have been reading like crazy on here but still have a few questions.

I have a 20 gallon high tank with a Tetra Whisper HOB Filter rated for a 60 gallon tank (getting a skimmer later when my sump gets finished). A 425 gph powerhead also running pointed towards the surface. I have a nice 20 pounds of substrate at the bottom and currently have 11 pounds of liverock (plan to get 10 more pounds next week). Standard lights since its just a FOWLR tank. I have started cycling the tank and was under the impression that the live rock might start cycling the tank on its own. Its been three days and all readings come up zero (except a ph of 8 and salinity of 1.023). I threw in a shrimp today to jump start the process. So here are my current questions ...

1. Was it too late to add the shrimp?
2. Is it possible the live rock instant cycled the tank? If thats the case even with the shrimp would it still read zero across the board?
3. How long should this shrimp stay in there. Am I looking for a specific ammonia level when i pull the shrimp or just leave that sucker in there for the duration and let a CUC take care of it in a few weeks?
4. Any other suggestions?

 

[Martini5788]

1. No
2. Unlikely, but it doesn't sound like you added any source of ammonia, but I would think that you would see some nitrates
3. I would leave the shrimp in there for a few days, or until you reach 2 ppm ammonia on a test kit. I would not leave it in for the duration.

Put the raw shrimp in, will be easy to remove if you
Use a filter bag to put it in. Test your water everyday to see what your levels are. Once you get zero ammonia and nitrites and some nitrates you are cycled. Do a large water change, wait a few days, add cuc.

 

[davehead86]

1. No
2. Unlikely, but it doesn't sound like you added any source of ammonia, but I would think that you would see some nitrates
3. I would leave the shrimp in there for a few days, or until you reach 2 ppm ammonia on a test kit. I would not leave it in for the duration.

Put the raw shrimp in, will be easy to remove if you
Use a filter bag to put it in. Test your water everyday to see what your levels are. Once you get zero ammonia and nitrites and some nitrates you are cycled. Do a large water change, wait a few days, add cuc.

Ive read that this takes a week to 6 weeks to have the ammonia spike and then have the nitrites and then have the nitrates normalize. Should I be expecting a long or a short timeframe?

What is an acceptable level of nitrates to have in the tank?

 

[Martini5788]

You will cycle quicker if you
Provide an ammonia source. Was the rock live cured rock, dry rock? And the nitrate level will depend on what you plan on keeping. Corals need lower nitrates than a fish only. The reason I do a large water change after the cycle is to get rid of the majority of the nitrates which build up from the cycling process and to fully replenish all the minerals. I have also not ever had a major algae outbreak doing it this way as well.

 

[davehead86]

You will cycle quicker if you
Provide an ammonia source. Was the rock live cured rock, dry rock? And the nitrate level will depend on what you plan on keeping. Corals need lower nitrates than a fish only. The reason I do a large water change after the cycle is to get rid of the majority of the nitrates which build up from the cycling process and to fully replenish all the minerals. I have also not ever had a major algae outbreak doing it this way as well.

So thats why people add the shrimp, to add ammonia and speed the process. Got it, hopefully it wont take 6 weeks. Im patient with this hobby but 6 weeks staring at rocks is like torture. :lolspin:

The live rock was out of a tank at the LFS. It has some red alge and some sort of grass looking stuff growing on it when she pulled it from the tank (I assume that means its cured).

Its going to be a FOWLR for the time being so there is some give with the nitrates?




Thanks for the help, much more info that trying to piece it together from 30 different posts from 2009.

 

[Martini5788]

Yeah it is probably cured then. Your cycle may not take long at all. It is important to wait for it to finish though. Also start doing some research about qt. a 6 week cycle is nothing compared to a 10 week fallow period if you introduce parasites into your aquarium.

 

[davehead86]

Yeah it is probably cured then. Your cycle may not take long at all. It is important to wait for it to finish though. Also start doing some research about qt. a 6 week cycle is nothing compared to a 10 week fallow period if you introduce parasites into your aquarium.

Are you suggesting that i quarantine everything else that i buy? Do I have to QT live rock and fish? I have a ten gallon that i was going to turn into a sump but dont have enough money for that yet, or enough for a second filter and heater for a QT tank if its going to take weeks.

 

[Martini5788]

Yes it is very very highly recommended that you qt all new fish at a minimum. In a separate tank for atleast 30 days. Just look through all the new to the hobby posts for the last week and I am sure that you
Will find 20 atleast about qt procedures.

 

[Irishman360]

Once you have waited a while and you want to see if you tank properly cycled, you can pick up ammonia at Ace Hardware dose your tank to make it spike to 2PPM, I have a 60 gal and did one teaspoon. If your ammonia and nitrites go down to zero in 24 hrs, you have developed enough bacteria for some CUC and fish, if you have had the fish in QT for a month a least that is.

 

[davehead86]

So will the main display tank be ok if it has cycled but I have to wait a few weeks to add the fish into it? Are the bacteria going to be fine by themselves in the tank or should I add ammonia at points to keep the bacteria fed / alive?

Also, do I have to cycle that tanks water too? Or can I just use the water from a WC on the display tank (say after the cycling process has finished)?

 

[thegrun]

The tank is fine for a few weeks while you wait for your fish. I know a lot of people advocate adding a pinch of dry flake food to the tank daily after the tank cycles and it doesn't do much harm, but the bacteria has been shown to live close to a year with fairly minimal die-off. The sooner you get the extra live rock you plan on adding in the tank the better, if the new rock has a lot of die-off it could extend the cycle duration.

 

[Irishman360]

The cycle process just has to deal with bacteria developing in your rock and sand band. The water doesn't really contain that much bacteria in it. A clean up crew will also help feed the bacteria. Since you're waiting to put fish in it.

 

[davehead86]

Figured I might as well add a pic.
You can see that my shrimp is fuzzy as hell already. Ammonia was 1.0, nitrites are up and nitrates are still 0.

Not 100% sure I like the rock setup, finally got the rest of the rocks today and may need to spread them out differently.

 

[davehead86]

Update and further questions!

I added more live rock to the system 2 days ago.
I removed the shrimp yesterday because it reached 2ppm ammonia, 1ppm nitrites, 20 ppm nitrates.

I go to test the numbers today and they are as follows ...
Ammonia = 0 ppm
Nitrites = .25 ppm
Nitrates = between 0 and 5ppm

Normal numbers this early into the game?



On another note, Im running a HOB filter with carbon inserts (2). Should I leave these in or remove them and just run the sponge to grab the bigger particles. Is 20lbs of live rock enough bio filtration?

Thanks to the advice here I am starting to setup a QT tank. Do I need to have my cleanup crew go through QT too?




Thanks again for all the help to everyone who keeps responding!

 

[davehead86]

This was an intersting week.

I got my QT setup and ready to go. Went to the fish store to buy the clowns and a clean up crew. I had every intent of using the QT for the clowns and just dumping in the CUC and feeding them a little each day for the month the fish were in the QT.

Long story shorter, my QT starts leaking ... alot. So my DT has now become the only tank I have. SO in go the clowns and the CUC. Its been 3 days and all inhabitants are happy, all paramaters are at a zero and the fish are eating will. So is the CUC. The red serpent starfish I have is aloof but comes out to chomp on the leftover pellets at night.