New tank problems, looking for answers!

O

oldbones

New member
So, there's something going on in my new 56g tank, but I can't figure out what. I'm hoping someone here may help steer me towards a solution. Sorry, but I'm going to blast you with as much info as I can think to provide, hoping there's a clue in there somewhere. I'll answer all questions ASAP.

Here's the info... Tank is a custom 56g, herbie drains to a 20g sump. Running new skimmer (washed, rinsed, vinegar bath, rinsed), new Jebao return pump, new Jebao RW4, two new heaters, AI Prime on low settings (<30% all channels). 50+ pounds of Marco Rock that has been cycled for nearly a month in a clean brute with a bottle of Fritzyme and fed Mysis. Tank has been running only two weeks. Using the same salt mix as my other established tank.


A couple days after setup, I moved some zooanthids from the other tank. They have been actually doing better in the new tank ever since. After a little over a week, I moved in a Blue Spot Jawfish from my QT, and he's been perfect ever since, eating, piling rocks, being a good little jawfish.

Then, a few days ago, I moved in some lps from my other tank, a frogspawn, open brain, small hammer, sympodium and acan frag. I also moved in a Montipora Setosa frag (after dipping with coralrx and rinsing). All of these LPS and SPS pieces started declining, and yesterday were looking pretty poorly. (No P/E, white slime coming off brain, etc) Yesterday, I started to suspect some type of contaminant, so I added 300g of carbon (fluval bags) to the sump.

CUC; About 5 days in, I added 6 nassarius snails and two turbos. Turbos seem ok, but a bit lethargic. Nassarius snails not doing well, very lethargic even when food (pellets or Mysis) hit the sandbed right next to them. Two very small hermits moved over with the jawfish, and are doing fine.

As of this morning, there was no notable improvement, so I started by moving the brain coral back to the 29g. It showed signs of improvement within 15 minutes, and after an hour looked quite a bit better, so I moved the rest of the lps and sps back over as well.

Now, parameters... I can't find anything here that would be a culprit...

Specs are as follows, 29g tank/56g tank

Temp 77.8/77
Sal 1.026/1.025
Alk 8.2/7.5
Amm 0/0
Nitrites 0/0
Nitrates 15/2
Cal 475/500
Mag 1540/1360
Phos 0.16/0.0


I know the tank is very young, but I suspected that the fish would be the most sensitive to that, and the first sign of any trouble would be some ammonia. I have not seen one hint of ammonia or trouble from the fish. Is there something else about a young tank that would be bothering these other corals, mostly beginner type stuff that's pretty hardy?

Thanks in advance for any help you can provide, I could sure use it!
 
1. Your new tank is still cycling.
2. Too many changes to the tank in such a short period. -Bio load overwhelms the bio filter.
3. Check your measurement validity. -Expired testing kits? Go to LFS and have them test the parameters?
4. Consider moving more of the afflicted creatures back to the original tank and proceed more slowly.
Good luck!!
 
I have removed all the corals that seemed to be struggling back to the old tank. In a matter of hours, all the LPS are showing definite signs of improvement. The monti will take longer of course, so the jury is still out on that one.

Not to sound ungrateful, but "the tank is too new" or "the cycle isn't complete" doesn't help me very much. I'm testing all the parameters I know of that should indicate if there's a problem with the cycle, and there is nothing off the mark. The Jawfish, who I would expect to be the most sensitive to a cycling tank and has been in there now for four full days, looks happy and healthy as the day is long. I added a bag of Copepods to the tank on day one, and the glass is crawling with them. Zoos that were melting in my other tank (I think from light shock, LFS has their DT lights very low and very blue) have recovered nicely in the new tank and are doing well.

It may very well be some factor that is connected to the maturity of the tank, but if so, it's not any of the ones I can test for.

One thing I have wondered about is Aluminum toxicity. I do have a DIY screen top (with plastic mesh from the LFS) built with an aluminum frame from Home Depot. I had to make some cuts in the frame to fit around the overflow box and allow power head wires to pass through. Some water will condense on the underside of this frame, and then drips back into the tank. I suppose this could have introduced some level of aluminum to the tank, but I don't know how to check that, don't know if that would cause these symptoms, and don't know if running carbon would remove it if that were the case.

To be on the safe side, I think I'll go wash the frame/screen very well, then paint over the areas I had to cut to cover any bare aluminum. If nothing else, it'll make me feel better.


Any other ideas?
 
You would think somthing would show up on your tests....
I do think Tzylak may be on to something with a lot of changes in a pretty short period of time. Maybe you should start with what was working (the fish and the zoas)and give that some time first. I know corals take time to adapt but it's odd that all of yours started looking poorly in the new tank but improved back in the old tank except that that was the environment with which they were accustomed.
Makes me wonder if your rock isn't leaching something that's not showing up on the tests, although I could not even hazard a guess as to what.
 
Caveat: I have no idea...

Try PolyFilter? If there is something in there that shouldn't be, maybe that will absorb it?
 
How did you know I was up at 4 in the morning???

Finding some polyfilter is top of my list once the stores open this morning. Maybe Cuprisorb as well. The more I read, the more I think some sort of metal (copper? aluminum?) could be the problem.

Fish and zoos still doing fine, snails still lethargic but maybe slight improvement. Hermits active and looking good.

Of the rest of the pieces that I removed back to my 29, a frogspawn and small hammer both looked poorly this morning, possibly the beginnings of brown jelly. I just pulled them both, dipped with CoralRX (that's all I had on hand) and moved them to my qt. These corals were thriving just a few days ago, and have gone downhill quickly after introduction to the new tank.

Very frustrating...
 
Just finished full round of testing this morning.

Ammonia - 0
Nitrites - 0
Nitrates - Looks like 1, maybe 2
Alkalinity - 8.4 (raised this over two days with Seachem Reef Builder to match my other tank)
S.G. 1.026

These corals were moved over from my other tank where they have been doing well. In that tank, Nitrates measure 15-20.

I honestly don't think any of the normally monitored parameters are the cause here.
 
Looked at your build thread. I can't see a single thing done wrong or anything used to create a problem.

I doubt it is the aluminum screen frame. If you are concerned about that, just take it off and smear a little bit of aquarium safe silicone over any aluminum that is exposed to seal it. Obviously let it cure before putting back on.

Anything used or sprayed in the room over by your new tank that might have fallen/settled in the water? Yeah, try some polyfilter. Otherwise, I got nothing except your corals resent the move to a new place.
 
Thanks to all who've weighed in so far.

I think I'll take a water sample to the LFS and have them run any tests that I don't have (copper for one).

Can you find polyfilter in the big box pet stores?
 
Ok, now I am totally frustrated for you!
(Still thinking something must be leaching from somewhere???)
 
google allelopathy. Softies and stonies don't like each other, and softies are the aggressors in this regard. Running carbon helps, but also planning the placement within the circulation pattern of the tank.
 
Thank you Sk8r for that recommendation.

I took some water up to Oceans By Design yesterday (they built my tank) and chatted with the owner for an hour or so while we ran all the test we could think of on it. Water quality was excellent, no copper found. We pretty much ruled out a lot of things, and were left with but a few.

1. Chemical Warfare. Did something get really ticked off by the move and release some toxins? Possible, but would it affect my snails like this? Zoos have been fine, but all LPS took a hit. Also, these were mostly all smaller frags, not colonies, I'm not sure what would have had the kind of horsepower to cause that effect in 70 gallons of water volume. Never saw any sweeper tentacles either.

2. Salt Mix. I was surprised when I first tested ALK in this tank. I'm using Kent Reef Salt, which usually mixes up between 10-11, and the tank was down at 7.2. I had some more water already mixed out in the shop, so I tested it, also down in that range. Hmmm, mixed the remaining salt in the bucket really well, added 10 more gallons to my mixing bucket, and it came up to around 9. Ok, so some serious ALK settling had occurred in my 5 gal salt bucket. I suppose this could have caused some weirdness that ticked off my corals.

3. Outside Contaminant. Don't know what, but maybe something got into the tank, somehow. Transported in on my hands, on new equipment, who knows. This is my best guess at this point.

Currently, it appears maybe a slight improvement, although hard to tell because I've removed all the most affected corals. I did, however, have a snail knock a sliver of a zoo frag off the rock TWICE yesterday, so that's actually encouraging. Heck, they weren't hardly moving. Still not as active as they should be, but not dead yet either. I dropped in a $5 mushroom frag last night as a canary, and it looks nice this morning.

Plan of attack moving forward is to continue with the carbon in the sump, skim wet, and start doing frequent water changes. I'm still schlepping buckets from another building and up a bunch of stairs, so doing anything bigger than 10g at a time is a pain in the butt, but I'll figure something out.


Thanks again for your help everyone, I hope this clears up and the tank can get on with it's happy self!
 
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