New to dosing. I have questions.

[Aww7979]

Hello. I've just started dosing. My water changes are no longer keeping up and I'm excited to see more growth. Three weeks ago my DKH was about 5.9 and my CA was 340. Everything was good. Good color, polyp extension and what I think is good growth.

My target is 9 DKH and a CA of 440. So I followed the BRS calculator for my amounts needed for both additions. I was nervous about dosing so I split each dosage into fifths so I could dose then test. My first time dosing I was two fifths (1/5 per night) into the ALK dosing and my test results were 9.2 DKH. I was surprised so I waited a week and did my scheduled 15 gallon water change. I got busy and finally tested 3 nights ago. I was back down to 5.9 DKH. I'm sure some of the drop was the water change.

So friday night I dosed 1/5 of my ALK dosage then tested Saturday anticipating some movement. My value didn't move, still 5.9 DKH. So Saturday night I dosed a 2/5 dosage for a two day total of 3/5. I tested today, Sunday, and it's still 5.9 DKH. I'm at a loss....

My calcium moves as anticipated but seems to lower my DKH as it rises. I gather that is normal.

BRS calculator said to dose 4.8 tsp of dry soda ash to move from 5.9 to 9.0. My dosages are 1tsp of dry soda ash in 1 gallon of RODI dosed over about 8 hours.

So my question...

1: Was it a fluke that my values moved as fast as they did when I first dosed? Has anyone else seen this?

2: Is it a fluke that my values haven't changed with my latest dosage? Should I just up the dosage?

Any other input would be great.

90 gallon DT, 30 gallon sump, skimmer, gfo, carbon, lots of light, lots of flow, & refugium. Current parameters.

1.025
PH 8.2
DKH 5.9
CA 430
Mg 1280
Po4 .04
No3 0.0

I'm also trying to add a current picture so you guys can see what I'm working with.

 

[trueblackpercula]

You may want to have your water test locally to see if your kits are still good. 5.9 is extremely low. Or you can try testing a batch of newly made salt to see if your kits give you different readings. Raise your alk slowly as you don't want to large of a swing.

 

[Aww7979]

Monday April 21,

So in another turn of events. I used a Hanna checker for both DKH and Ca.

My readings with the Hanna today are...

4.536 DKH
571 CA

My readings with RedSea today are...

5.6 DKH
410 CA

I haven't dosed Ca in over 3 weeks and my tests have sapped all of my confidence in the numbers. I have not dosed Alk since Saturday night. I have mixed a dosage of Alk to dose. I have upped the amount of soda ash to two tablespoons in one gallon of RODI. Everything I see about this stuff says it devolves into a clear liquid with little to no sediment. I mixed my gallon last night and let it set over night. I have something that looks like skim milk with over a a1/4" of sediment that will not dissolve. Is the soda ash I'm using bad? Any thoughts?

The BRS video of them making and dosing their "2 part" shows 2 cups of soda ash dissolved in a gallon of RODI and through the magic of TV it is clear. Am I just screwing around with tablespoons and teaspoons for no good reason?

 

[Tweaked]

I have personally never seen that much difference in results on alk between Hanna and Red Sea. I use these brands exclusively and are always spot on with the exception of the Hanna Ca tester. Junk IMO. Regardless, the alk is low of course.

 

[Aww7979]

Do either of you dose? If you do, which method do you use? I don't like this soda ash that I'm using. I think I want something that is more refined that I can control more with less pit falls.

 

[Tweaked]

ESV two part and ESV mg on BRS dosing pumps controlled by Apex.

 

[Aww7979]

Last night I dosed the mixture of 2 tablespoons of soda ash in 1 gallon of RODI.

Today's Alk reading is 4.76 DKH with the Hanna checker. So tonight I am going to dissolve 1/2 a cup of soda ash in a gallon of water and dose.

Red Sea test kit says my DKH is 8.4

 

[Aww7979]

I guess I'm waiting a night before dosing again. What are the chances that the Hanna is wrong or I'm doing it wrong?

 

[trueblackpercula]

Yes I dose ESV two part with a dosing pump. I wouldn't worry too much about the calcium right now as it will slowly get used up. As for the alk you need to raise it slowly to get to the mark you want to be at. Most keep there alk between 8 and 9 with good results for the reef tanks.
Try another brand of additives for your alk maybe it's a bad batch. Hope this helps
Michael

 

[Art13]

I dose with brs soda ash and their calcium supplement that comes in a package, i haven't had any issues at all with it. I'm not sure how familiar you are with the red sea test kits, but go on youtube and search for how to use them, this helped me out a lot. I also dose by hand daily, once in the morning and once at night, no issues. My consumption is not high yet though, about .6dkh and 5ppm calcium a day, so two doses won't cause too much of a swing in params for me to be worried.

 

[Aww7979]

Thanks guys all good info. I did not dose last night, Tuesday night, but I'm testing today with both kits anyhow just for a base line.

Hanna alk reeding 82 = 4.592 DKH

RedSea alk reading .48 titrant used = 6.7 DKH.

Tomorrow I'm taking a sample to the LFS to have them test it....

On another note things are looking great these days.

 

[nazarma]

I have the same issue with bra stuff. Can't figure it out. The only differnce is I am actually using a doser. At this time imam dosing 150ml of brs all solution and I went up as high as 250ml with no difference in all reading. Also used Red Sea and Hanna to double check. I hope someone can help as I am lost. My mg is 1400 and cal at 420.

 

[OzarksReef]

If you're using the standard BRS 2-part kit, you're not dosing the right amount. As you point out a couple of posts up, you should be using 2-cups to 1-gallon and then using the calculator to determine how much of the mixed solution you should use to raise your alkalinity. In the case of 90 gallons, to go from 5.0 dKH to 8.0 dKH, you would dose a total of 6.5 oz of the mixed solution. Of course, you would not run to raise it that quickly. They recommend no more than 1.4 dKH increase per day.

You also mention a sediment after adding the soda ash. This hasn't been my experience with it in more than 4 years of using their 2-part solution. It looks murky after first mixing and the next morning is very clear with no sediment.

On a side note, I have to wonder about the accuracy of the tests you're running. To be under 5 dKH and have SPS that still looks good seems unlikely.

 

[Aww7979]

Thanks Ozarks, I think your right. I think my ash is old or absorbed some moisture. Plus I think that my Hanna checker is not right. I'm going to try a different container of reagent.

Hanna test same reagent as previous tests.
4.98 DKH

Hanna test new bottle of reagent.
4.65 DKH

RedSea test.
7.8 DKH

I did dose last night, that's why there is an increase. My theory is that for some reason my Hanna is not working properly. I think everyone is right, my alk can't be as low as the Hanna says it is. I do 15 to 20 gallon water changes every two or three weeks and always have. Things are used to it. I don't think my alk load is great enough to have driven my alk down to where the Hanna says it is.

I'm going to stop dosing for at least a week. I'll test every day or so to get an idea of a pattern. Time to just enjoy it and stop worrying about it. I shot some cool photos with my iPhone. They're not perfect but I got some good shots. I don't know how to post more that one at a time so check out they new ones I've uploaded.

Adam

 

[Reefvet]

I've been using the Red Sea Alk kit on the recommendation of my LFS and found it to be easy, accurate and consistent.

They do have a forum here with the tutorials for their test kits.

 

[Aww7979]

Tested again tonight.

Hanna - 4.2

RedSea - 6.4

 

[natas]

First make sure you test everyday at the same time. Coral and coraline algea will consume what you are adding. Your reading in the am will be much different than the pm.

While I am a fan of redseas test kits I am a bigger fan of hanna. I have used both red sea and hanna for alk and I can get my hanna measuring very consistently by doing three test in a row. If I do this with the redsea the three test have a fairly large range. Also make sure you are doing the correct math with calculating dkh with the hanna meter.

 

[Aww7979]

First make sure you test everyday at the same time. Coral and coraline algea will consume what you are adding. Your reading in the am will be much different than the pm.

While I am a fan of redseas test kits I am a bigger fan of hanna. I have used both red sea and hanna for alk and I can get my hanna measuring very consistently by doing three test in a row. If I do this with the redsea the three test have a fairly large range. Also make sure you are doing the correct math with calculating dkh with the hanna meter.

I like the idea of doing the tests 3 at a time for an average. Even though one of my tests may be wrong, can I still use it to gauge Alk consumption? If I look at my last two tests done with the Red Sea it would appear that in 2 days my tank consumed 1.4 DKH. Correct? If it is correct is that a lot of consumption?

So if I am going to increase 1dkh per day I would also have to take into effect my daily consumption which is aprox .7 DKH. Looks like I dose 1.7 DKH daily until my goal is reached?

 

[Dapg8gt]

Have you tried using sodium bi-carb(baking soda) ?Or just using randy's recipie instructions either #1 or 2?(pretty much the same as brs I think) .. I can raise my tank(about 120g) 1 dkh with about 120ml of it at randy's ratio. Seems there is something not right with your ratio and method for the soda ash. Why aren't you mixing a gallon at full strength and following the calculator? You can/should raise it daily and I Def wouldn't wait a week between dosing that's not going to help and it's not good for the tank.

I would track your consumption over the course of 24 hours, use the calculator to find out how much full strength product you need to keep it there, then use the calculator again to see how much it says your volume of water needs to raise it 1 dkh and also use that.. If you are getting too much of a pH swing using the soda ash for the consumption plus the raising of the value combined try using straight baking soda for a few of the doses throughout the day. It doesn't have a drastic raising of pH and actually lowers it so it's good to use it if you have elevated pH from tinkering with you alk.

I would Def be getting some different kits as verification.. If you haven't read this I think it will help you out a lot on understanding what you need to do and what is actually going on..

http://www.reefkeeping.com/issues/2006-02/rhf/

http://www.advancedaquarist.com/2004/4/chemistry

 

[A. Grandis]

Oh man, that should be easier than that!
Shouldn't be that big of a deal.
I went through the same stress when I stated with the dosing...

I use RedSea tests and they are the only ones I use.
I also monitor the pH with a Milwaukee pH monitor.
That's the way I "visually understand" my alk.

I don't have hard corals therefore I use very little Ca mainly for coralline algae, but need to dose alk everyday! Mg is dosed once in a while also. The 3 work together...

I'm using the BRS buffer and my suggestion to you is to first make sure you're mixing the powder correctly. Then please go to the web site again and do the math to know how much you need to raise the alk.

I started with lower dosages than they recommended and during the course of 2 weeks I could figure out how much would be the average I should set the dosing pump.
Every system is different and the number/different species of hard corals will require different dosages for Ca, alk and Mg.

So you need to figure out what is the exact need of your system. IMO the BRS calculator is a great tool to help us to understand a bit about the dosage. It's great to start dosing too, but you need to learn your system.

When I do my next water change it will make a difference and the stability changes a bit, but the changes aren't THAT significant. The pH is fairly stable and the system is working great.

Hope you can figure out soon and be happy. Please don't think the numbers are going to be so precise forever, although they can be fairly accurate after you get the thing going. They change a bit here and there and that should be ok. The BRS is working great for me.
Just keep trying and have some patience.
Everything will be fine...

Grandis.