Odd and peculiar zoa growth

[Reefer54]

I bought a small colony (3 polyps) of blue hornets about 3 months back. Following acclimation, the polyps never opened fully.

I have had ok growth....it now is 17 polyps. But the polyps never open fully. They also "squat" and remain very close to their base tissue. More, instead of reproducing in a "mat" they tend to leave a string from one polyp to the next like a string of blue and green pearls (not a long string, more like a clump of string). Their color is great, but the skirts are always just about a 1\4 closed, never expanding like my other colonies (which grow at a relatively similar pace, some more, some less)

Could someone out there give me a clue as to what is going on with these

I have tried different areas of flow and light with no different results.

Water is within satisfactory parameters. Lights are 4 Kessil A150w 15k and 10k hung 12 in above water, with 4 x 39w ATI supplements hung 11 inches above water.

these zoas are at mid level in the tank, med flow, and slightly shaded by the crossbrace getting indirect light


any ideas or experience are much appreciated.

 

[A. Grandis]

Hello,
Thanks for posting here! PMs aren't aways the best way. When we post here others can see and help too. I learn a lot this way!! :thumbsup:
I'll let my inbox to be full. That way people will have post here!! :spin2:

Yeah, I think that type of growth is most of the time because of water quality and/or the colony is somehow weak. Perhaps we would find that more often when we use GFO or with too much GAC, or in newly stablished tank where water chemistry isn't well balanced and the natural filtration isn't mature yet.

I've had that happening in tanks with a very good and strong light, so I would think light isn't normally the issue. Also I don't think the problem is directly related to water flow either.

Sometimes the zoanthids can grow really good, explosively at first, in a new tank, and after a while it tends to show spaces between the polyps with part of the coenenchyme stretched like that, connecting the polyps. Other times they just act like that since they are introduced to the new system. Look like they are melting. Some people refer to the phenomenon as melting, per say...

Normally I found that Zoanthus spp., specially with smaller polyps, are more prominent to the phenomenon, but I've seen some Palythoa spp. also showing that from time to time.

Some times the presence of small predators or irritators could provoke that phenomenon too!! I had once some very tiny species of planaria that was the almost impossible to find irritator I've ever seen, so small they were!! After couple of days of irritation, the polyps wouldn't open and they began to have that stretched coenenchyme. Melting look!
Other practically invisible irritators, like bacteria, could be the reason for partially closed polyps and stretched coenenchyme IMO. I use Lugol's solution to help the symptoms sometimes, when I notice irritation/polyps partially closed. I just stop the flow and get up to 1/2 ml in a small dropper to apply over the colony in the tank. Wait for a minute or 2 and turn pumps on again. Skimmer will take care of the Lugol's.

Another time I had a very small species of Zoanthus that developed such behavior in a new stablished system (perhaps 3 months old) and when I moved the frag to another older system the symptoms disappeared at once in a week. Same colony is doing great today, so...

Some times, after that happen, the polyps could morph. I had polyps morphing to stronger/more beautiful colors after that. Go figure!!

My advice is to make sure the system has a stable and well checked water quality first. You can try to target feed the colony small tiny amounts of particle dry coral food, like Coral Frenzy or Reef Chily from BRS. They need to be open to be fed.

The time that the colony will get back to normal will depend on how the environment gets to it's preferences (water quality and overall), how much energy the polyps are getting daily, free from irritators/predators and so on...
Also the particular preferences for that species need to follow in order for a faster recovery.

Hope it gets better soon. Let's see what others will post!

It could turn into a great thread!!!!

Pics please!

Grandis.

 

[Reefer54]

Thanks Grandis, I try to find an answer before posting as there is so much information repeated here on RC, but i feel ya, and i appreciate you taking the time to respond to my pm.

But thanks for all the above posted information....that is a lot to digest all at once, but makes sense. And i have experienced the melting phenom before.....long ago when i set up my first tank. I assumed it was from outrageously high nitrates or shock from poor acclimation to water and or light.... and there are a number of parazoanthus and acrozoanthus species that this would be the norm for, but not these....time to pull it and check for pests again.


Water chem is stable. I recently lowered my dosing as my sps were not responding very well to alk shifting slightly from kalk dosing in ATO, that has been addressed.

But CA, MG, ALK, and PH are all well in the realm of acceptable.
Ammonia, .001 according to seneye, and undetectable on test kit.
Nitrate\ Nitrite also well in acceptable with Nitrate never rising above .25 since tank was established 7 months ago.
temp is 77-78


But for these polyps, its insane to me, they keep growing, and never fully open. But they are open enough to see the colors. I cant get a good pic. i am going to move it (its been a month in this spot) and will picture them then. I do spot feed slightly, but even though they close, i am not sure they are actually accepting food.

What i have found through other threads is that blue zoas are reported to prefer the bottom of the tank and lower light, so i will try that and keep you all updated.

In the meantime, especially if i get a good pic, someone please feel free to chime in.

 

[Reefer54]

I was able to move the frag and in doing so had to frag a small colony of 5 polyps, leaving them in the previous position 2\3 up in the tank. I will take pictures of them open tomorrow and perhaps you will see what i am speaking of.

but this is a pretty clear example of what i was trying to describe before, and i know i have read about this kind of reproduction pattern somewhere here on RC. So, please, someone tell me what this means.

see how they grow in a line, not a mat
and for what it's worth, pics taken with a samsung note 2 phone....not too bad. I like my pics better than my wifes nikon.

 

[A. Grandis]

Thanks Grandis, I try to find an answer before posting as there is so much information repeated here on RC, but i feel ya, and i appreciate you taking the time to respond to my pm.

But thanks for all the above posted information....that is a lot to digest all at once, but makes sense. And i have experienced the melting phenom before.....long ago when i set up my first tank. I assumed it was from outrageously high nitrates or shock from poor acclimation to water and or light.... and there are a number of parazoanthus and acrozoanthus species that this would be the norm for, but not these....time to pull it and check for pests again.


Water chem is stable. I recently lowered my dosing as my sps were not responding very well to alk shifting slightly from kalk dosing in ATO, that has been addressed.

But CA, MG, ALK, and PH are all well in the realm of acceptable.
Ammonia, .001 according to seneye, and undetectable on test kit.
Nitrate\ Nitrite also well in acceptable with Nitrate never rising above .25 since tank was established 7 months ago.
temp is 77-78


But for these polyps, its insane to me, they keep growing, and never fully open. But they are open enough to see the colors. I cant get a good pic. i am going to move it (its been a month in this spot) and will picture them then. I do spot feed slightly, but even though they close, i am not sure they are actually accepting food.

What i have found through other threads is that blue zoas are reported to prefer the bottom of the tank and lower light, so i will try that and keep you all updated.

In the meantime, especially if i get a good pic, someone please feel free to chime in.

Hey,
You're welcome!

Yeah, it's important to remember that "zoa melting" can be so many things and a combo of things happening too. Most of the time it's weakness of the colony due to environmental factors and/or bacterial infection. The bacterial infection many times accelerate the process, so the zoa colony simply disappears.

Some times what's happening with yours isn't melting really, but a faze that will pass too.
I found that particle foods will help them, specially the small polyps, as I've already posted. I do believe that you should try. It doesn't hurt. It takes a while to work sometimes...
The use of amino acids in small amounts is also welcome.

Talking about Parazoanthus and Acrozoanthus... Would you please post pics of yours and tell us a bit more of your experiences with those zoanthids?
Here is a thread I opened a while ago. You can post your pics/observations, if you wish:
http://www.reefcentral.com/forums/showthread.php?t=2350650

Make sure the balance of Ca, Mg and all is good though.

Yes, I've heard about the blue zoas too.
They tend to do that a lot, and the bottom of the tank is what people normally suggest.

Grandis.

 

[A. Grandis]

I was able to move the frag and in doing so had to frag a small colony of 5 polyps, leaving them in the previous position 2\3 up in the tank. I will take pictures of them open tomorrow and perhaps you will see what i am speaking of.

but this is a pretty clear example of what i was trying to describe before, and i know i have read about this kind of reproduction pattern somewhere here on RC. So, please, someone tell me what this means.

see how they grow in a line, not a mat
and for what it's worth, pics taken with a samsung note 2 phone....not too bad. I like my pics better than my wifes nikon.

Oh man, that's not too bad...
They can grow like that. No problem.
They will be fine. Adaptation period, probably.

Choose a spot and leave them alone for now.

Grandis.