Orphek LED Lighting?
- Thread starter kmacartney
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CalmSeasQuest
Active member
So much for their "Final Price" I guess they rethought that as the price has increased 20%+ in the past 2 weeks. I'm also looking forward to seeing Mr. Wilson's comments on his unit and for additional real feedback and results from actual owners.
"You can't trust the message if you don't trust the messenger" - I've largely ignored this as it's a "cloaked" retailer shilling the product.
+1 on all counts (lack of user reviews, dimming detriment claims, soldered LEDs, retailer shilling...) I've never seen anything to support LED degredation at lower or varying power levels, in fact evidence supports longer LED life at less than rated output.
I'm even more suspect of the claims made by Orphek on their website regarding dimming...
"Did you know that dimmers, dawn/dusk effects and "storm modes" not only are detrimental to your coral, but to your LEDs?
Using a dimmer or other electronic control shortens LED lifespan by up to 60%. Here at Orphek, we care about one thing: lighting your coral. Since your coral are actually negatively affected by gimmicks such as dimmers, we don't make you pay for things you don't need."
I take issue with their claims regarding dimming being a "gimmick" and that dimming is "detrimental to your corals" (I'd argue the exact opposite.) I'd also like to understand the data used to support their claim that dimming shortens LED life by up to 60%. Corals on the reef seemingly do very well with the the natural zenith changes of the sun (dimming ala Mother Nature.) Dimming is more than just creating sunrise/sunset for our viewing enjoyment (although I do enjoy watching the sun rise on my reef each morning with a cup of coffee.) it also provides,
- Variable PAR output - Allows a user to tailor the PAR output and coverage (by varying the height above the tank) of their corals based on their tank dimensions and aquascape. The is especially important during acclimation as LEDs generate far more PAR than comparable MH/T5 fixtures.
- Custom coloration and mid-day PAR increases (i.e. ~20K+ coloration in the morning and evenings when the tank is being viewed, and higher PAR, ~12K mid-day for maximum growth (or any combination/variation you prefer.)
Based on the photos provided by aquamn1999, the build quality appears very good. I'm very intrigued by the claimed 16K output of their white LEDs. I temper that enthusiasm with the fact they are not providing any information on the manufacturer.
On/Off timers - No dimming and limited lunar functionality. Even if you accept their comments regarding dimming (which I do not.) their third party timers seem to limit controller options - this is hardly "cutting-edge" and in fact falls well short of other current offerings.
Support concerns - A new product from a newer company, based in Israel, manufacturing in China with little or no user reviews who's seemingly only US distributor shills the product does little to support overall confidence or the expectation of rapidly available support/parts.
To me, if you agree to overlook the lack of dimming functionality, the biggest wildcard are the LEDs used. Time and photos (from other than the manufacturer/retailer
) will determine growth and coloration abilities. Hopefully Orphek, or Direct Aquarium (rather than acting as a shill) can respond to some of these concerns with the underlying data.
knockout
Really Cool Stuff!
This company seriously have to rethink their marketing strategies, only one user half review in the whole world yet they cant keep up with production, shady, at least 3 users in this thread are self promoters, shady again, I love the look and at the $650 price was seriously thinking about it, at this price range I'll go with proven technologies all day long.
110galreef
New member
at ~$650-$700 these are at a good price.....
at $750, now $850 or even more they are going to price themselves out of the market compared to other LED setups......
And the comparables models have tried & tru electronics, LED, reviews, etc.....
at $750, now $850 or even more they are going to price themselves out of the market compared to other LED setups......
And the comparables models have tried & tru electronics, LED, reviews, etc.....
msr224
New member
I'm glad to see that I am not the only one that feels this way.
A few thoughts......
1. If you're reading this and you represent Orphek....we are your customers. In the beginning of this thread we were all excited.....not so much anymore..... Now instead of standing in line for the next unit that comes off of your boat from China we are adopting a wait and see attitude. That means that by the time we see your product and decide it's worth the price we will also have seen others.
2. Poorly disguised attempts to promote your product by posting in threads like this are not going to win ANY friends. Maybe an honest approach, admitting who you are and answering questions would get you further. All we are asking for is info and reviews......
3. Pricing- It is not that we mind paying money for the hobby we love. I've got a small tank and well over $1500 in it already...... I want beautiful corals. I want a beautiful tank that makes me smile. I am willing to pay for that. I would gladly pay for a high quality fixture from a well known manufacturer that has years of industry experience. As far as I know you only have one of those...the high quality fixture- and that is only conjecture at this point.
Do I still want one of your fixtures? Absolutely, BUT I will wait and see before I decide.
A few thoughts......
1. If you're reading this and you represent Orphek....we are your customers. In the beginning of this thread we were all excited.....not so much anymore..... Now instead of standing in line for the next unit that comes off of your boat from China we are adopting a wait and see attitude. That means that by the time we see your product and decide it's worth the price we will also have seen others.
2. Poorly disguised attempts to promote your product by posting in threads like this are not going to win ANY friends. Maybe an honest approach, admitting who you are and answering questions would get you further. All we are asking for is info and reviews......
3. Pricing- It is not that we mind paying money for the hobby we love. I've got a small tank and well over $1500 in it already...... I want beautiful corals. I want a beautiful tank that makes me smile. I am willing to pay for that. I would gladly pay for a high quality fixture from a well known manufacturer that has years of industry experience. As far as I know you only have one of those...the high quality fixture- and that is only conjecture at this point.
Do I still want one of your fixtures? Absolutely, BUT I will wait and see before I decide.
mr.wilson
.Registered Member
Fake product reviews are more common on aquarium forums than most would think; many of which are so thinly veiled that you wonder if they even understand how these forums work
I ordered a sample light to test out and have no commercial interest in reporting anything other than my actual opinion of it. I committed to just one fixture for the same reason that the others in this thread have had trepidation. What I can't tell you is how they perform in the long run. These days products are rushed to market far too fast, making the end users the guinea pigs, and our fish & corals the canaries, but with the hype we have grown to expect and even demand, who can blame them?
The LEDs found in the Orphek fixture are soldered in place so they cannot be "popped out" with a screw driver for upgrade or replacement. Now, I'm not worried about the battery in my Iphone that cannot be replaced because I know Apple has excellent quality control and the batteries have a track record of outlasting the phones. New LED fixtures are a different story however. Manufacturers in China that use Cree, Bridgelux, or Luxeon LED chips can at least offer some measure of reliability. Unfortunately, Orphek is dark horse emerging from left field with only ad copy to offer... and of course a sexy light fixture
The greater picture is whether to use LED or MHL. It may take years for an LED fixture to pay itself off and with emerging technologies, you may replace it a few times along the way. Having said that, you can't bury your head in the sand and ignore technological advances. I have decided to get into the game, rather than sit back and watch. The problem with the Orphek fixture is it doesn't offer the controllability that most LEDs and even some MHL fixtures do so the game isn't as inviting in their field.
For the record, I have no connection to any commercial distributors of Orphek products that don't go through Kevin Bacon first
I paid full (wholesale) price for the light and I intend to resell it at the list price. I received no discount or special offer, and you will get my unbiased opinion. Now, if I had blown my budget to hang one of these over my own tank I would have no choice but to defend the purchase with an "awesome" review It's just like anyone who buys a car for over $100,000.00. I'm sure it's a great car, but they can't afford to admit it isn't worth it.
msr224
New member
Ok, I have been in contact with an "insider" at Orphek and he sent me these photos. I so feel like I am spotting new models of cars in Detroit....
First some info from my insider. I cannot personally guarantee any of this, however I believe all that I have been told in these regards.
1. Orphek has been working to come to market for some time and has been working with distributors in several companies. They are working to provide for stores, both brick and mortar and online to retail their units. This is the reason for some of the price increases. Obviously, the retailers expect a profit, as would you. I won't dive too far into the pricing other than to repeat what I was told. The units were being sold below cost in an effort to get them out in the market. That time has come and gone.
2. Manufacturing has been stepped up to accomodate current demand and the company expects to be providing for additional units beyond the current orders by the end of the month. They've even rented a fast boat from China. (That last, is my take on it)
3. Two colors available- The original white that we have all seen and a black fixture. Quite a step up from the Model T days..."They can have any color they want as long as it's black" - HENRY FORD. So now you have a choice in sexy white and sexy black.
Now for the pics. I do want to make clear that these are not stolen or hijacked pictures. I got them from a reputable source in the company and obtained permission to post them for all to see. SO HERE YA GO.
A bunch of the sexy white fixtures mid manufacturing.
A shot of the new QUIETER cooling fans.
The black fixture:inlove:
Black fixture with Moon lighting on.
Black fixture with hanging hardware (included)
Full power black fixture
They don't mess around with packaging. An order ready for shipment.
First some info from my insider. I cannot personally guarantee any of this, however I believe all that I have been told in these regards.
1. Orphek has been working to come to market for some time and has been working with distributors in several companies. They are working to provide for stores, both brick and mortar and online to retail their units. This is the reason for some of the price increases. Obviously, the retailers expect a profit, as would you. I won't dive too far into the pricing other than to repeat what I was told. The units were being sold below cost in an effort to get them out in the market. That time has come and gone.
2. Manufacturing has been stepped up to accomodate current demand and the company expects to be providing for additional units beyond the current orders by the end of the month. They've even rented a fast boat from China. (That last, is my take on it)
3. Two colors available- The original white that we have all seen and a black fixture. Quite a step up from the Model T days..."They can have any color they want as long as it's black" - HENRY FORD. So now you have a choice in sexy white and sexy black.
Now for the pics. I do want to make clear that these are not stolen or hijacked pictures. I got them from a reputable source in the company and obtained permission to post them for all to see. SO HERE YA GO.
A bunch of the sexy white fixtures mid manufacturing.
A shot of the new QUIETER cooling fans.
The black fixture:inlove:
Black fixture with Moon lighting on.
Black fixture with hanging hardware (included)
Full power black fixture
They don't mess around with packaging. An order ready for shipment.
They look nice... Wish I would have seen the black ones and had more info about these fixtures a few months ago... Now I've spent $1800 on my DIY that I'll eventually put together lol.
A few more pics of the black PR-156 on the Captive Aquatics blog and on Orphek's blog
I still like my white one better, but this does look really good.
Regarding spectral shifts caused by dimmers being detrimental, have you read the publication entitled "Available, usable, and stored radiant energy in relation to marine photosynthesis" by Andre Morel, published in Deep Sea Research (Volume 25)? Dr. Morel's findings lead one to believe that spectral shifts are indeed detrimental in the long term. ><
I still like my white one better, but this does look really good.
Regarding spectral shifts caused by dimmers being detrimental, have you read the publication entitled "Available, usable, and stored radiant energy in relation to marine photosynthesis" by Andre Morel, published in Deep Sea Research (Volume 25)? Dr. Morel's findings lead one to believe that spectral shifts are indeed detrimental in the long term. ><
John_D, can you post pictures of your white one over a tank? I hope so seeing how 6 out of your 8 posts are about Orphek...
AquariaUSA
AquariaUSA
We have been following every Orphek press release for a few months now. I have asked a few times the same questions, but do not seem to get any response with detail.
Seeing that the LEDs are soldered onto the board…how are the LEDs repaired in the event of failure, and what is the individual cost for replacement of the LEDs? Shortly after the first units hit the US, there were issues with cheap fans needing to be replaced which is why having LED parts available is paramount (some of the other Chinese LED products are having failure issues although rated for 17000-50000 hrs with or without heat sinks, fans etc.)
Where do the units ship from in the United States, and are parts readily available for repairs at that location? Are there stocking quotas for the said supplier? One vendor was sold for a whopping $4K so curious if they can actually support this product as the main vendor thus far unless they are an unlisted dba for some other entity.
Who is the main US Distributor in the United States? There have been so many questions raised about MSRP, MAP and initial pricing which have caused my company and many others to hold back due to the fluctuating prices we have seen across the market and as reported in various aquarium forums.
Got a non-descrip email from "Douglas-US rep" who pretty much just seems to want orders without giving any real info about the product, pricing or repairs or who he is, where he is located...
Sometimes I wonder if the people selling products like these even have any real aquarium experience or an understanding of reef aquarium lighting and livestock which is why questions were asked...
Nobody likes to think negatively about a new product (especially for one that seemed to have promise) but if there are issues (please don't attribute them to growing pains! after a company indicates they took 2 yrs to develop a diode) with pricing, distribution, availability, we generally just look at more reputable suppliers and product lines from companies. Everyone enjoys promoting new products, but some promote them just for a quick buck without testing them inhouse first...How many posters here and on other forums are simply posting because they have gotten a deal on the light or have become hobbyists who may have a sales interest in Orphek? Not trying to step on any toes, but just seems that anyone representing Orphek is not posting on this forum~and we all know this is the first one read I have a hobbyist friend that got a few to test and so far he thinks the lights are nice, but had some of the same concerns I did early on with support, supply and pricing structures...great products don't usually have issues like these around them and are launched at events like MACNA, SuperZoo, etc.
How long has any of the Orphek units been in use in the US? 3-4 months?
The picture above is nice to see, but seeing 20 lights on a shelf is hardly going to support the US market for more than a couple hours through one vendor. My intial concern was the lights were R&D'd in Israel, but then outsourced to China. I would have paid for a higher quality product made outside of China. As with many product lines that have made their way to China, we have issues with import into the US and the availablity of parts if something goes wrong. Most of the people buying these products are hobbyists and can't go without light on their reef aquariums if something happens to their new LEDs...Changing PAR/PUR values can shock corals, so having a new product that has not been thoroughly tested in the field raises a major concern.
Anyone from Orphek out there?
Note: Mods edit my post if needed, just trying to get some info
Seeing that the LEDs are soldered onto the board…how are the LEDs repaired in the event of failure, and what is the individual cost for replacement of the LEDs? Shortly after the first units hit the US, there were issues with cheap fans needing to be replaced which is why having LED parts available is paramount (some of the other Chinese LED products are having failure issues although rated for 17000-50000 hrs with or without heat sinks, fans etc.)
Where do the units ship from in the United States, and are parts readily available for repairs at that location? Are there stocking quotas for the said supplier? One vendor was sold for a whopping $4K so curious if they can actually support this product as the main vendor thus far unless they are an unlisted dba for some other entity.
Who is the main US Distributor in the United States? There have been so many questions raised about MSRP, MAP and initial pricing which have caused my company and many others to hold back due to the fluctuating prices we have seen across the market and as reported in various aquarium forums.
Got a non-descrip email from "Douglas-US rep" who pretty much just seems to want orders without giving any real info about the product, pricing or repairs or who he is, where he is located...
Sometimes I wonder if the people selling products like these even have any real aquarium experience or an understanding of reef aquarium lighting and livestock which is why questions were asked...
Nobody likes to think negatively about a new product (especially for one that seemed to have promise) but if there are issues (please don't attribute them to growing pains! after a company indicates they took 2 yrs to develop a diode) with pricing, distribution, availability, we generally just look at more reputable suppliers and product lines from companies. Everyone enjoys promoting new products, but some promote them just for a quick buck without testing them inhouse first...How many posters here and on other forums are simply posting because they have gotten a deal on the light or have become hobbyists who may have a sales interest in Orphek? Not trying to step on any toes, but just seems that anyone representing Orphek is not posting on this forum~and we all know this is the first one read
I have a hobbyist friend that got a few to test and so far he thinks the lights are nice, but had some of the same concerns I did early on with support, supply and pricing structures...great products don't usually have issues like these around them and are launched at events like MACNA, SuperZoo, etc.How long has any of the Orphek units been in use in the US? 3-4 months?
The picture above is nice to see, but seeing 20 lights on a shelf is hardly going to support the US market for more than a couple hours through one vendor. My intial concern was the lights were R&D'd in Israel, but then outsourced to China. I would have paid for a higher quality product made outside of China. As with many product lines that have made their way to China, we have issues with import into the US and the availablity of parts if something goes wrong. Most of the people buying these products are hobbyists and can't go without light on their reef aquariums if something happens to their new LEDs...Changing PAR/PUR values can shock corals, so having a new product that has not been thoroughly tested in the field raises a major concern.
Anyone from Orphek out there?
Note: Mods edit my post if needed, just trying to get some info
Last edited:
CalmSeasQuest
Active member
+1
John_D - For the benefit of all, It would also be appreciated if you would disclose your relationship (if any) with Orphek or any distributor/retailer/blog. Or more simply put - do you have any financial interest in these fixtures beyond that of an owner/hobbyist?
msr224
New member
I will answer a question before I am asked. I have nothing to gain in sharing this info. I am not connected with Orphek other than an interesting dialouge that I have fallen into with my inside connection. End of story for me.
Here is the prototype rendering for their new NANO fixture!!!!
:hmm5::hmm5::hmm5::hmm5::hmm5::hmm5:
Here is the prototype rendering for their new NANO fixture!!!!
:hmm5::hmm5::hmm5::hmm5::hmm5::hmm5:
msr224
New member
msr224
New member
Now, this something we can talk about. John, can you break this down inot laymans terms for us? I ain't so smart bein frum indianer...hahaha
Seriously, spectral shift....as in color shift as in kelvin shift? Or are we talking about intensity? I'm guessing color. More details...... More info. Are the still detrimental if they aren't used to take the tank up and down all the time but merely to simulate the sunrise and sunset?
I mean, I'm not gonna stand there and dim them up and down just to see the reaction of my corals......
I don't quite believe that dimming and spectral shifts are detrimental. Ever gone scuba diving at sunrise or sunset...Colors change quite a lot.
AquariaUSA
AquariaUSA
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