pappone and BLU Coral method

<a href=showthread.php?s=&postid=10000702#post10000702 target=_blank>Originally posted</a> by Psionicdragon
Oh really? I thought glutamine and arginine are used as Amino acids for the tank.
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If you are adding glutamine you are adding yeasts and other additives. Glutamine sold as supplements in the US are full of additives....hence, c sources......pure pure pure and truly pure glutamine is tough to find.
 
<a href=showthread.php?s=&postid=10000858#post10000858 target=_blank>Originally posted</a> by chrisd1009
No... it's all good. I'm just letting you know that I don't have all the answers. I'm trying to get a hold of the guys who helped me along on this so I can hopefully give a better explanation.
As for the AA's, I use the zeovit AA's. I'm not a Zeo user. I've only ever used the AA's and the Coral Vitalizer, which IMHO, is sugar water.
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I agree 100% with your last sentence. Thats what I think about alot of the prodibio type stuff as well.
 
<a href=showthread.php?s=&postid=10003970#post10003970 target=_blank>Originally posted</a> by DarkXerox
yeah I agree, I mean I've only been running it for a couple months now so I figure it costs almost nothing and does not appear to be harming my tank. All I can say though is that I haven't had my encrusting montis, Acros, or my LPS grow that much in 2 months before, and I haven't changed anything with my husbandry except the feeding of pappone.

The explosive growth that people were having was in tanks running the BC method as well, so I can't expect to have as much growth as that (ie I dont keep my Ca at 500, Mg at 1500, alk at 11 etc). But I like what I'm seeing nonetheless.
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I think you should give yourself more credit...rather than boast that it is the pappone(which IMHO is no different than adding any other food to the tank) why not chock it up to good husbandry?

Whats so new and groundbreaking about feeding a tank? Maybe I am missing something.
 
<a href=showthread.php?s=&postid=10004051#post10004051 target=_blank>Originally posted</a> by mr.wilson
Italy is home to some of the worlds greatest chefs and fresh ingredients, but this pappone recipe shows us the trick, not the magic. Just as it takes more than a recipe book to make a gourmet meal, it takes more than a basic fish goo recipe to have a successful reef tank.

The Italian reef tanks in these threads are maintained by long term aquarists with extreme dedication to the hobby. There diligence and persistence is the true magic behind their success stories. The idea that you can take a smaller, perhaps even problematic, reef tank and turn it around with a perfect recipe is just silly.

The reef aquarium hobby has had a roller-coaster ride of "don't feed", and "do feed" methodologies. Coralife had a huge line of foods, like Invertebrate Gumbo, back in the mid 80's. It triggered a feeding response in corals similar to a cat looking in a seafood store window. It fell out of fashion when people realized it was just clam juice with preservatives.

In the 90's we had Mark Weiss and his wonderful array of sugar-based products such as Living Water Vital and Coral Vital etc.. It too lost its' momentum when people realized they had bags of it (sugar) in their kitchen cabinets.

The 90's also brought us Marine Snow by Two Little Fishies, but it never really hit market saturation for some reason. Perhaps the claims were too honest to build hype? Dr. Ron Shimek didn't help much with his 2001 article, challenging the accuracy of their guaranteed analysis for Combisan.

Phytoplankton and zooplankton have now become the norm, but it's more a matter of when then what. The pappone method employs a night feeding regimen, which is common sense, as corals feed at night when zooplankton is active and photosynthesis ceases.

The reason why a more substantial nutrient import works now, where it didn't in the past, is we now have multiple methods of nutrient export and reduction in our arsenal.
Where a lot of hobbyists go wrong, is in trying to follow the practices of successful reefers too closely without adapting it to their systems needs. A thriving reef tank can handle elevated calcium, carbonate, magnesium, phosphate, nitrogen, and carbon; while a more primitive system would allow for nuisance algae to utilize these organic and inorganic nutrients.

The amount of fish goo, amino acids and sugar you give your tank needs to be carefully assessed according to the bioload, lighting and carrying capacity of your system. To blindly follow the rough guidelines set-out by someone with a completely different set-up is foolish.
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I dont think it could have been said any better.:o
 
I'm going to roll through some individual growth shots. I'm not good with the camera, so some of these photos will show inaccuracies. Very few are true to what your eye would see if you were standing in front of my tank. Some show far better color than I deserve and some show much worse. I find it hard to gauge color when the individual behind the camera isn't exactly good with cameras. In some cases, different cameras were also used. This was time consuming and a PITA.
I wouldn't exactly consider any of these to show growth that would be out of the ordinary. Also, keep in mind that I was doing AA/C throughout the entire time, not pappone.
A lot of improvements were made to my system during the early photos. First and foremost, my refugium was pulled off line. I also replaced a reeflux bulb. All photos from 5/17 are with new T-5 actinics that were not there before and my center halide is off, so it shows heavy in on the blue.
First is the ORA Blue Tip Stag
1: 11/8/06
2: 12/27/07
3: 03/02/07
affrag004.jpg
icebluetipstag1.jpg
electricbluetippedstag.jpg
 
It's totally amazing. Thankyou for posting these pics. I'm looking forward to reading more about what you're doing with AA, etc.
 
As I've said in many posts in this thread, I don't look at any one thing as the reasons for growth. My tank went through some hardships during my multiple deployments. Along with that, I made some mistakes upon returning home which were very problematic and caused more issues. I really just simplified things.
Major changes I feel I should mention are:
I got rid of my calcium reactor and did randy 2 part on a doser.
I'm changing much more water than I ever have.
I got rid of my refugium. The thing is a toilet bowl. Period. I went with a GFO reactor instead.
I was trying go with 15 and 20K halides to avoid using actinics. Dumbest thing I ever did. Dumped the 15's and 20's for 10's (first I did reeflux... big mistake, then XM) and went back to fluorescent actinics. I should say that I do like the Iwasaki 175 15K.
I stopped messing around with needle wheels and went beckett.
Started playing wth AA/C.
 
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I call Chris's techniques the BROOKLYN METHOD. Everyone's looking for magic bullets and European techniques for answers. Zeo, ultra,prodibio, pappone, German French Italian etc.
Since I started employing the changes Chris describes I've gotten growth and color and saved a ton of money. Brooklyn works for me. Thanks as always Chris.
 
well based on the pics Chris posted, what he's doing works.

so if I do a search on Vodka can I learn the necessary info. about C dosing?
 
Hell yeah... Crooklyn in the house, son. Also known as the LOISMUSTREEF Method. The slogan is "It's your water quality, stupid!"
To be honest, I really have no clue as to what i'm doing. I got help from those who do and I also look at methods which make sense and husbandry that fits into what i can do.
I never used the vodka. To be honest, I look at the HGH and Vodka the same way... If I have it, I sure as hell am not going to waste it on my tank. For C, I've used sugar and L-Glutamine. Powder form.
I'm taking this off topic. Sorry about that. Back to Pappone and BC.
 
Dude,
Corals looking good,man....I wonder what exaclly L-Glutamine do for corals. i see colors u have got much deeper and more intense

m
 
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