Part 1 - Help!!!

[g8gxp]

Ok, I put in Part 1 over 72 hours ago. I've been doing ammonia tests every 8 hours but so far it is still undetectable! I find it highly unlikely that there is no die-off.

Maybe I'm doing the test wrong? Bought a Salifert ammonia kit. 2 ml of water mixed with 0.5 ml NH3 reagent, swish 30 seconds, add 0.5 ml more NH3, swish 10 seconds, wait 5 minutes, swish and read. Still cannot see any discernable yellow to the test.

If something is dead can you smell it from the top of the water?? I smell a very faint sea odor from the top but that's it. Do you have to take the rock out of the water in order to be able to smell?

I've taken 2 dead crab off of the bottom and there seem to be a couple of really tiny clear shrimp-like animals floating around in the water that look lifeless. All the snails and other crabs seem to be fine. What does a dead sponge look like? I thought I saw more orange sponges on the first day, but it could just be my imagination.

Thoughts??

 

[liverock]

Re: Part 1 - Help!!!

<a href=showthread.php?s=&postid=13300957#post13300957 target=_blank>Originally posted</a> by g8gxp
Ok, I put in Part 1 over 72 hours ago. I've been doing ammonia tests every 8 hours but so far it is still undetectable! I find it highly unlikely that there is no die-off.

Maybe I'm doing the test wrong? Bought a Salifert ammonia kit. 2 ml of water mixed with 0.5 ml NH3 reagent, swish 30 seconds, add 0.5 ml more NH3, swish 10 seconds, wait 5 minutes, swish and read. Still cannot see any discernable yellow to the test.

If something is dead can you smell it from the top of the water?? I smell a very faint sea odor from the top but that's it. Do you have to take the rock out of the water in order to be able to smell?

I've taken 2 dead crab off of the bottom and there seem to be a couple of really tiny clear shrimp-like animals floating around in the water that look lifeless. All the snails and other crabs seem to be fine. What does a dead sponge look like? I thought I saw more orange sponges on the first day, but it could just be my imagination.

Thoughts??

If you have no ammonia....you are good to go...let it be.....

Remember, this is real live rock, always underwater until you put it in your tank...thus little to no die off.....

but keep watching it.....the ammonia levels...

I suspect you will be ready for part 2 next weekend!

sea ya
Richard TBS:rollface: :rollface: :rollface:

 

[snodine]

g8gxp, I am SO glad you asked this question! I am going through the exact same thing. I'm also using Salfert ammonia test kit and an getting no detectable ammonia results. I keep wondering "what am I doing wrong - it has to be me!"

OK, maybe it is not me.

 

[liverock]

Fiji-Florida rock

Fiji-Florida rock

What yall are experiencing is the difference between imported rock, and aquacultured rock from Florida.

Imported rock, is now "boat rock", with the exception of Mitch at livestock USA...he still has a source of airfreighted Fiji rock, that comes in with some life still alive as it is usually only a few days out of the water as opposed to two months dry as 99% of the Fiji harvest is now.

After harvest in Fiji, is up too two months out of the water before it gets to its final destination. Thus must be "cured" or a better term, brought back to life.

Aquacultured rock, at least the way I do it is to keep it submerged from harvest until it gets to your tank.

Thus minimal die off, usually....but don't be lulled into complacency, as you could still have ammonia, until after part two is in the tank.

A small cycle is a good thing...less hassle for you.

Richard TBS



:rollface: :rollface: :rollface:

 

[Melusina]

Just thought you might be interested - I have a Salifert ammonia test and am getting no discernable readings; however, when I test with my Aquarium Pharmaceuticals test, I showed .5 ppm of ammonia and this evening, it went up to 1 ppm - with the Salifert test showing none. I did a water change since I just got my rock yesterday. I'm not sure which is correct, I'll probably get a 3rd test tomorrow, but I actually saw the API test progress today in terms of increasing ammonia.

I thought that the Salifert tests are supposed to be very good, but now I'm not so sure.

 

[figuerres]

<a href=showthread.php?s=&postid=13304910#post13304910 target=_blank>Originally posted</a> by Melusina
Just thought you might be interested - I have a Salifert ammonia test and am getting no discernable readings; however, when I test with my Aquarium Pharmaceuticals test, I showed .5 ppm of ammonia and this evening, it went up to 1 ppm - with the Salifert test showing none. I did a water change since I just got my rock yesterday. I'm not sure which is correct, I'll probably get a 3rd test tomorrow, but I actually saw the API test progress today in terms of increasing ammonia.

I thought that the Salifert tests are supposed to be very good, but now I'm not so sure.

Salifert is the "standard" test kits IMHO. I wonder .... I think they put a date on them, I wonder if your kit might be too old?

 

[Melusina]

Good thought - checked the expiration date on the box and it's 07/09. I just tested again and I'm showing .25 ppm on the Salifert test and 1.0 ppm on the API test. The only thing I can say is that I usually test with the API kit on my BC29 and it always shows 0 ppm ammonia. Using that logic, I have to assume that I have an ammonia spike in the new aquarium because it's showing a difference between the two, right?

 

[g8gxp]

ok, after reading melusina's post, just to be safe I went out and bought an API test AND a Red Sea test and did those 2 plus the salifert.

Salifert showed 0, both API and Red Sea are between 0.5 and 1. not sure which is right but am not taking any chances. I smelled the rock but to be honest I'm not sure what I am looking for. All of the rocks smell a little bit but I've been told that if something has died it will smell really really bad.

Water changes as we speak.

 

[figuerres]

<a href=showthread.php?s=&postid=13307003#post13307003 target=_blank>Originally posted</a> by g8gxp
ok, after reading melusina's post, just to be safe I went out and bought an API test AND a Red Sea test and did those 2 plus the salifert.

Salifert showed 0, both API and Red Sea are between 0.5 and 1. not sure which is right but am not taking any chances. I smelled the rock but to be honest I'm not sure what I am looking for. All of the rocks smell a little bit but I've been told that if something has died it will smell really really bad.

Water changes as we speak.

well a comon name for one type of sponge is "chicken liver" and if it goes bad just guess what it smells like :eek2:

also a sponge will get a white growth of bacteria on in when it dies, they will also lose color and chunks will fall off .

 

[Melusina]

Just noticed something that might be an explanation. The API test says it tests for NH3/NH4 while the Salifort box says NH4. Think that's what is responsible for the variations?

 

[figuerres]

<a href=showthread.php?s=&postid=13307200#post13307200 target=_blank>Originally posted</a> by Melusina
Just noticed something that might be an explanation. The API test says it tests for NH3/NH4 while the Salifort box says NH4. Think that's what is responsible for the variations?

Ah.... Yes, there are as I recall 2 forms of the amonia, some of the "Potions" they sell for making a cycle go fast or to reduce it or make it non-toxic turn NH4 into NH3.

this is memory so if you want more info search the reef chem. forum for this info.

 

[figuerres]

<a href=showthread.php?s=&postid=13307044#post13307044 target=_blank>Originally posted</a> by figuerres
well a comon name for one type of sponge is "chicken liver" and if it goes bad just guess what it smells like :eek2:

also a sponge will get a white growth of bacteria on in when it dies, they will also lose color and chunks will fall off .

for a visual id of a sick sponge check that out.

sick parts look yellow white ish.... good parts look ... Pale light blue/gray.

 

[Melusina]

Here's an article about ammonia and testing:

http://reefkeeping.com/issues/2007-02/rhf/index.php

If I am understanding it correctly, need to be testing for total ammonia, rather than ammonium ions. The Salifert test box says NH4 Profi Test, but the instructions inside say "The values on the color chart are in mg/L total ammonia (that is NH3 + NH4+)."

I am probably more confused now than I was before.

 

[divemonster]

I've heard from other experienced reefers that the API test is the most accurate and the best one to use. If I can find HowardW's post about the API test kit, I will bump it up (after the Cowboys game )

 

[Melusina]

Great - thanks! Would like to see the post. I've pretty much decided that I'm just going to test with the API. Using that test, I've done 3 water changes because the results are hovering around 1 ppm.

 

[g8gxp]

So far I have avoided any large water changes. I did an initial 10% change after my first freakout. After that though I just gritted my teeth and am riding it out. The good news is that it has been over 30 hours now and ammonia seems to be holding steady between 0.5 and 1.0.

The bad news is that the ammonia is holding at 0.5 to 1.0. I haven't seen any reduction yet. Is there anything else I can be doing? I feel a little helpless right now.I've heard that putting a damsel or 2 usually helps cycling. right or wrong?

 

[divemonster]

Don't do that. Just be patient, you will see it begin to drop.

 

[g8gxp]

Hooray! Woke up this morning and ammonia has finally dropped close to 0.25. Apparently nature does work.

Part 2 is getting close..... If there is anything I suck at, it's being patient.