QT disaster

[RockinSmall]

I prepared my QT tank yesterday and tore my reef apart to treat all the fish b/c thats what people say to do even though only one shows signs of ich. i used declorinated water and rid ich. the tank has a power head going and a heater. Well, i droped them in at about 9 pm and its now 7 am and all my fish are dead! Why?? what did i do wrong? what am i missing here?

 

[lesleybird]

How big is your QT and how many fish did you put in there? Was the quarenteen tank cycled? How about acclimation of the fish to the water? Ammonia level? Salinity? Temperature? Ph? Tell us more. Nobody on this site will tell you to use Rid Ich. Lesley

 

[maroun.c]

+1 on above.
Q tank has to be cycled and have some filtration if it is to support 1 or more fish for a long time. I tend to have aggressive filtration on my Q tank after previous experience becuase most medication will weaken your filtration and most of the time you have to take out carbon filtration as well as skimming while medicating.
On my Q tank I have a small skimmer, bioball wetdry filtration, mechanical filtration with sponge bioball and carbon when not medicating. I always try to medicate the fish outside the tank when using Antibiotics (taking out the fish to a bowl of water for a AB dip or for feeding with foods soaked in AB then returning the fish to the Q tnak without the meds...
I also keep a sponge and some bioballs in my display tank sump to have those cycled to boost the QT filtration in case my filtration dies due to medication... Always use new Bioballs or sponges in your display tank and never take back any sponge or bioballs from Q tank to Display tank as it could bring back diesase or med with it.

 

[RockinSmall]

well i have a crappy hang on the back filter on a 10 gallon, tank temp is 79, salinity is same as display tank. and i had 4 tiny fish. i did not check paramaters as i figured how would freshwater have amonia or anything else in it... i dont run skimmers, all i use is a lil one on my biocube...

 

[maroun.c]

Skimmer is not a must and very few people do use it in Q tanks or introduction tanks... Still that filter you have should have been cycled by placing a new sponge for it in your display in a high flow area for few days to have it build up some bacteria. or maybe a few rocks taken from the DT to the QT or some sand anything to bring in some bacteria... Fresh water should not have ammonia theoratically however fish owuld produce some that didn't get processed most probably.still if water was clean to start with I would say it's a bit fast for anythin g to build up so fast.

 

[RockinSmall]

so far i dont see how they died... it was within a few hours! they were so flippin healthy before..

also.. i read that i should not have any sad, or rock b/c it can help to harbor the ich instead of killing it....



also... since everything is now dead and i have to start over.. my new fish id like to quarenteen, do i add an ick chemical or what do i do to make sure new additions are parasite free?

 

[maroun.c]

Exact sand can provide a ""sharperëd edge environment"that ich prefers in some of its stages. this does not mean that without that it cannot reproduce. what I meant is having some sand or rocks from the DT to the QT to help seed the filter in it with bacteria and then take it out if you prefer....also starting with totally new mixed water is not the best as using some water from your DT can help with cycling...
finally I remember when I first started quarantining my fish for treatment and/or introduction that I lost many many fish in the Q tank without any explanation. found out that I was always getting ammonia and nitrite spikes. as for some reason the Q tank which ran non stop was not cycling. the only thing that made a difference was having a sandbed in the Q tank as I believe hte sand bed is the best surface for filtration. IMO and that I can't advise to others even if a sharper material makes it easier for Ich reproduction, not having any sharp material (bioballs sand and rocks) will not allow you to shorten treatment so I would rather treat for 6 weeks with the presence of good filtering material such as sand and Bioballs....
Now for fish introduction I'm still a strong believer of Quarantining new fish however I would suggest an introduction tank compared to a Q tank environment as a totally bare tank even if you put some PVC tubing is still weird for fisha nd will increase stress level. My introduction tank has everything Sand, rocks small skimmer, bioballs,... and those allowed me to successfully quarantine a hippo tang and a yellow tang (each alone) among many other smaller fish with no problems...
finally those ammonia alert badges can be really helpfull and if not daily checking of ammonia and nitrite which yo udidn't even have hte chance to deo unfortunately. testing the water now also 'won't be conclusive as any ammonia or nitrite you might find might be from the decaying dead fish.

 

[khaosinc]

How long between filling up/adding salt and adding fish was it.... takes a while for salt to dissove completly.

 

[RockinSmall]

about 2 days... bottom line is i did not cycle or do anything right. im gunna hold off on fish for 2-3 months and get my QT tank where it ought to be.

 

[1geo]

QT tank. You can put together a QT tank in one day. If you use RO water and sea salt there will be no Ammonia, Nitrates or Nitrites because you have nothing alive in the tank, no Live Sand, no Live Rock, no invertebrates. My QT tank has only a heater, power head for circulation, a micron HOT filter made of cloth, NO carbon or bio filters. There is no reason for you fish to have died unless you did not acclimate them to the QT tank. When I transfer a fish from one tank to another I acclimate them for two hours and then make the transfer. One question is, what are you trying to cure? The various forms of Ich or Brooklynella (Brook). These parasites have very similar symptoms but are treated differently. If Ich, use copper, for Brook use Formalin dips. Obviously there is not enough space here to detail the treatment methods but they can be found on the internet by using your search engine. Read, read and read some more before you do anything.

 

[maroun.c]

<a href=showthread.php?s=&postid=14911147#post14911147 target=_blank>Originally posted</a> by 1geo
QT tank. You can put together a QT tank in one day. If you use RO water and sea salt there will be no Ammonia, Nitrates or Nitrites because you have nothing alive in the tank, no Live Sand, no Live Rock, no invertebrates. My QT tank has only a heater, power head for circulation, a micron HOT filter made of cloth, NO carbon or bio filters. There is no reason for you fish to have died unless you did not acclimate them to the QT tank. When I transfer a fish from one tank to another I acclimate them for two hours and then make the transfer. One question is, what are you trying to cure? The various forms of Ich or Brooklynella (Brook). These parasites have very similar symptoms but are treated differently. If Ich, use copper, for Brook use Formalin dips. Obviously there is not enough space here to detail the treatment methods but they can be found on the internet by using your search engine. Read, read and read some more before you do anything.

And how does the waste produced by the fish get processed?'
Why would all FO setups have to wait for the aquarium to cycle before introducing fish then?

 

[1geo]

You only have to cycle a tank if there is live things that die in it. For example, if you put live sand in a tank There are many things in the sand that can die and start a nitrogen cycle; the same goes for live rock. If there is NOTHING alive in the the tank except the fish, Then there is no nitrogen cycle. As for the fish waste which is a very small factor, I use a HOT micron filter made of cloth, no carbon or bio, just cloth. I also use a Eheim hand vacuum pump to remove all un-eaten food and waste that is on the bottom of the QT tank. Between the vacuum pump and micron filter (which I clean twice a week) there is no decaying matter in the tank so there is no Ammonia, Nitrates or Nitrites. Hence, no Nitrogen cycle.

 

[lobsterotomy]

Cycling a QT tank is often a useless affair when medicating - many of the meds that people use while in QT would kill any bacteria that you build up anyways.

How big was the QT, how many and how big are the fish; you probably stressed the hell out of them chasing them around and out the tanks too - that never helps.

Also, how was the surface agitation? They simply could have suffocated.

 

[tcmfish]

Aren't you not suppose to mix dechlorinator and medications?

 

[shawna1972]

Could be the mix?,This is what just happened with myself while treating with cupramine 2 weeks ago. I dosed the right dose but yet my fish started swimming in circles,backwards "very odd" so I did a 100% water change
contacted Seachem and come to find out my "Safe" dose of cupramine became "Toxic" when mixed with declorinator >no where does it state this on the bottle as a warning and I figured it was not a med so Im good. long story short I cought it just in time as it happened so fast.
This could be the reason? maybe not? just sharing my exp with declorinator with meds.
I wish these companys would put a warning somewhere about these things!
Sorry to hear of your loss

Shawna

 

[h2so4hurts]

<a href=showthread.php?s=&postid=14961719#post14961719 target=_blank>Originally posted</a> by tcmfish
Aren't you not suppose to mix dechlorinator and medications?

Some water treatments cause heavy metals to fall out of solution. That would be bad for copper treatments.

 

[Rick55555]

+1

If by dechlorinated water you mean you used tap water and dosed a dechlorinator, that may be your problem. I don't remember where I read this, but I've always been under the impression that you cannot safely mix dechlorinator with medication.

Rick

 

[limitdown]

Definitely do not use dechlorinator/water conditioners with copper treatments. They'll cause the copper to become much more lethal. The only way you should be dechlorinating water when medicating is using a carbon block hooked up to the tap or a full RO setup.
Others will have opinions about this, but I no longer use RO for fish. I use a 5 micron sediment, 5 micron KXMatrikx carbon block, 1 micron KXMatrikx carbon block. I only use RO in the kitchen for my family's cooking and drinking.

 

[rhkingsfan]

I believe on Seachem's FAQ on curpramine they note that if you use Prime (their declorinator), the copper becames 10x as lethal.

 

[RockinSmall]

well... i used dechlorinated water treatment on faucet water. i do believe i didnt have proper surface agitation. i really think they sufficated. and i used Rid Ich.....


however... i dont know what the deal is.... but im having a hell of a time keeping any fish alive. i am not a complete novice as i had done this for 6 years, took a break and came back. i had two anglers in seperate species only tanks and the only lasted a couple months... and today.. a chromis died!!! i am doing something wrong but dont know what. i have biocubes with upgraded pumps and extra power heads. ALL my water params r perfect. i've gotta be missing something!!! im kinda embarassed and about to give up on fish all together.