question on CDMAS goals

[Linda C.]

After speaking to a member on Tuesday night I realized how different some peoples goals are with being in a Reef Club.

My understanding/intention is to “promote the marine aquarium hobby and the conservation of the world's coral reefs through education, example, aquaculture and the ethical treatment of marine wildlife”.

Their purpose was "to get a discount" either a group buy or by soliciting vendors. From my understanding this member had little interest in the education or environmental aspect of being a group. Their emphasis was having a good time and saving money to build their system.

I'm not judging them on what their purpose is on being in the group or what direction they would like to go in as much as I want to understand what CDMAS goals are as a group.

Since I am a candidate for council member I just wanted to be clear on where my thoughts were on being a reef society. I think it’s important to understand the goals of the candidates that are running could be voted into council.

I am into the idea of learning and educating hobbyist on farming and fragging coral to be able to elevate taking them from the reef. I'm also into learning and educating hobbyist on caring for the fish/corals in a humane and ethical way. I love the meetings and the social aspect very much. I appreciate the benefits of group purchasing and the sharing/selling/trading of frags, fish and items also.

People in the club are such a tiny fraction of the hobbyist that keeps coral and fish. For me it is a goal to bring awareness to the other hobbiest to go at fish/reef keeping in a ethical/humane way. As some of you know Joe Allard and I started working on the tanks at Ichabod Crane Middle School. We are lucky to have Tony at Swamp Bottom as the sponsor for the tanks. I feel it’s important to get into the local schools and help introduce up and coming “fish-geeks” into the hobby. You never know if one of the students will be inspired by the tanks to go further into Marine education that could someday impact the reefs in a positive way.

After the conversation on Tuesday evening I wanted to let the other people know my views on being a member of CDMAS. I welcome the thoughts from other members on what they feel the purpose is of the CDMAS.

 

[plandy]

Hi Linda,

I applaud your open stand on important issues. Reminds me why, some 25 years ago, I quit this hobby. It was when articles one after another described how local natives were using reef destructing cyanide to collect life stock for the marine hobbyist. I couldn't see myself being part of that much less supporting it with my cash. Although the marine livestock is not 100% cyanide free we have come a long way, reducing dependency, since then.

Now we move to other things as your point of view so well epmhasize. We need to take responsibility for these limited, valuable reef denizens. More importantly we need to contribute & promote more to aquaculture and less dependency on wild collections wherever possible. Most importantly do not buy livestock with known reputation to expire prematurely due to it's highly specialized requirement we cannot accomodate.

 

[DanConnor]

Good questions, Linda. A club is going to contain all kinds of people, and hopefully it will be able to serve members of various orientations towards the hobby.

The one wording I have an issue with is "promote the marine aquarium hobby", particularly as a lead sentence. Is being in the business of promotion really our job? Personally, I think there are more than enough reef hobbiests out there already, and the hobby seems to be growing just fine on its own.

Education though is another matter. Aquarists who join a club like this are much less likely to kill aquaria inhabitants, I'm sure. But that kind of education can happen naturally through conversation on the board and at meetings. When people understand education in this context to mean standing up in front of a group of 5th graders and talking about fish tanks, I'm not sure I'm on board. Not that there's anything wrong with it, but I just don't think its the main purpose of the club. Probably not your intention anyway.

Regarding the other stuff, I like group buys just fine. For some reason I feel a little funny getting a discount as a club member, and would probably not use it myself.

 

[jaze36]

Re: question on CDMAS goals

Well said Dan I very much agree with you.

<a href=showthread.php?s=&postid=8273790#post8273790 target=_blank>Originally posted</a> by Linda C.

I am into the idea of learning and educating hobbyist on farming and fragging coral to be able to elevate taking them from the reef. I'm also into learning and educating hobbyist on caring for the fish/corals in a humane and ethical way. I love the meetings and the social aspect very much. I appreciate the benefits of group purchasing and the sharing/selling/trading of frags, fish and items also.

Linda I also think this is hugeeeeeely important, but does not have to apply to everyone in the club. I hope as people become more involved with the club and the hobby these ideas become important to them as well. We all come to the club with for our own reasons, and hopefully as a community we can grow together. The bigger the club gets the more reasons we will have for being a part of it. I am also sure one reason will always be the same for all, the interest and love for the hobby.

 

[Linda C.]

The sentence of "promoting..." I think it would have to be taken in a complete sentence and not stopped in the middle to get the entire intention. I didn't mean it to sound like we are to go out and solicit people into the hobby. I have been doing dog and animal rescue way too long to ever want to solicit anyone into keeping any kind of animal. The interest and desire has to come from the future owner themselves.

From just the few times Joe and I have been in the school I was pleased by the questions from some of the students. I am going to be visiting Justin Credabel at the Science and Technology Magnet High School of Southeastern Connecticut and hopefully I will have some good ideas to bring back to the group.

I am curious to see other members interests and goals for the for the group. I think it's harder to obtain goals if is unclear of what the members want.

 

[ChrisBuono]

As an involved CDMAS member, a reef aquarist, and the other candidate for the E&PR council seat, I'd like to chime in here.

I encourage anyone and everyone with an interest in marine aquariums to join CDMAS. As long as someone is respectful of other’s, themselves, and the ‘pets’ in their care, I think there is a place for them within CDMAS.

While I practice conservation, I’m not a Conservationist. While I feel a tremendous responsibility to all of the living creatures in my aquariums (and in my care), I’m not a preacher of perfectionism. In other words, I do my best and let others do their’s. I offer guidance when appropriate and otherwise try to leave my judgment behind.

As with any organization like ours, its goals are inevitably the collective goals of its membership. And those goals will certainly change and evolve over time. And I think we can continue to satisfy most, if not all of our members.

While I was a bit shocked at the one-sidedness of the aforementioned other-member’s perspective on membership benefits, I, at least in part, agree with the sentiment.

My primary goal in joining CDMAS was to learn from others more experienced than I. After I joined my personal goals expanded greatly. Not only can I learn from others, but I realized others could learn from me. I enjoy the social aspect as well. And, yes, I like the occasional ‘free’ frag as well as the discounts and raffled gift certificates.

Now that I have been involved for a while, I now have aspirations for the club itself. I very much enjoyed the frag workshop held in February and would love to hold similar events in the future. Also, without reference to CDMAS, I don’t believe I could have arranged for the upcoming behind-the-scenes tour at the New England Aquarium.

With a bit more organization and participation I believe we can all achieve the goals we seek.

 

[xian]

The collective knowledge and experience in this group as well has been of great benefit to me. I have always felt that the group should publicize itself to new hobbiests so that we can help them to be successful. When I see a new hobbiest at a store I want to tell them about the club so that they can learn from us.
Part of the purpose in organizing this club was to allow members to become as involved as they want. In terms of large events we have tried not to go overboard in order to keep the workload manageable and avoid frustration. I think we accompished alot in our first year and I hope that next year turns out to be an improvement.
Please don't think that you have to be a council member to get an event going. Everyone is entitled to participate in their own way. Part of the reason that we chose not to collect dues is that we don't want members to feel obligated to participate. If you just want to hang out at a meeting thats fine too.

 

[Lakeside518]

With a post like that Linda its obvious you are looking for a response. SO here it is....

This thread would have been more productive if it had read:

CDMAS goals and what direction we should take and then your opinion, but being you befriended a member without the facts was just over the line. Creating more online drama!..

This was a very informal discussion of which you either have selective hearing or need to clean the bee's wax out of your ears.

This is my stand point. I discussed with everyone there the benefits of the club, how having group buys and member organization on such purchases was great benefit of being a member of CDMAS. Sharing in shipping cost and even at time receiving discounts on larger order with certain venders. Like Joe's order. I also spoke of ways of increasing are donations and creating more funds for a guest speaker Some how all of this was left out of your post?? Hmmmm I luv the portrait you are painting of me. Beautiful.... Gotta luv that DRAMA.....

The most informative/ educational event so far that i have seen was Feb. frag event. If it weren't for that we prolly would have remained with the FOWLR tank that we were accustomed to. Michaelg did an awesome job!!! I would like nothing more then to beable to organize another such event and raise the money to do sooo. Never once have i acted selfish in anyway. I'm always one to offer a helping hand. I think many members could speak up for that.

Of coarse a discount is a sweet perk No one would argue that. Its great promoting coral aquaculture. I'M SO VERY SORRY YOU COULDN'T ABSORB THAT INFORMATION FROM THE OH SO SHORT INFORMAL DISCUSSION WE HAD @ CHRIS'S HOUSE. HOW UPSETTING.

Also not all of us can benefit from wholesale livestock pricing/discounts as some others can. Ahh well we make do with what we can.

So to sum it all up!!! I'm Very for education and saving the reefs and raising club funds and member enrollment. Also it would be wise to have all your info before bashing a fellow member with little to no facts on hand

 

[jallard]

I actually had to read Lindas post over and over and I couldn't find one mention ouf YOUR name Kris. IMO you added the drama.

Linda brought up a valid topic, and it's really not a bad one to discuss.

Lets not make this personal.

 

[Lakeside518]

Its personal when the comments you made are way off base in the 1st place. Of coarse i will defend myself. How is it productive to have a reference in a post such as that? When the foundation has many flaws and cracks in it? She made it personal i responded. Childish acts can be left out of the forum i agree.

With that said, i found it pretty upsetting. Have a Mod close it. Or yeah it will most likely get ugly. Because i will defend myself with such false remarks.

 

[Toyota Guy]

I am not going to take anyones' side or comment on what has been discussed in this thread......

BUT, this IS NOT the place for this crap. We have many non members who read our board looking to see what kind of group we are. Looking to see what kind of info or what the jist of our club is all about.

We don't need to have 2nd grade mud slinging going on here. It doesn't look good for the group.

Kris if you have a beef with Linda then PM her and deal with it on your own. In NO WAY was YOUR name mentioned in her post. I don't think that there was any wrong in her post.......


:climbing off soapbox:


Chris

 

[jallard]

<a href=showthread.php?s=&postid=8276956#post8276956 target=_blank>Originally posted</a> by Lakeside518
Its personal when the comments you made are way off base in the 1st place. Of coarse i will defend myself. How is it productive to have a reference in a post such as that? When the foundation has many flaws and cracks in it? She made it personal i responded. Childish acts can be left out of the forum i agree.

With that said, i found it pretty upsetting. Have a Mod close it. Or yeah it will most likely get ugly. Because i will defend myself with such false remarks.

All I am saying is that you were the only one who knew it was about you in the first place. If you found it that upsetting PM her.

As for closeing the thread.....why? If we all act our age we should be able to have a discussion about the topic of the thread, not about your interpertation of it.

SOOOOOO The topis IS question on CDMAS goals

 

[kpcollins31]

The goals of the individuals in this group with respect to CDMAS likely vary from member to member. I also imagine that these goals would evolve over time. When I first found Reef Central, I thought it was a great resource to learn more about the hobby. When I found that there was a local chapter, I thought it would be great to meet people in the area who shared similar interests in the hobby.

From this perspective, I think that broad goals are best for this type of group. I think the most important thing is education -- if you educate people about the hobby and share experiences, the promotion will happen in and of itself. If we can leverage the group to help mitigate the costs of this hobby, everyone wins - so I think that is a valid goal. Just my 2 cents.

Kevin

 

[Dustin P.]

...soooo back to the topic

When I joined, my goal was to learn from those who were already into the hobby...Im still learning everyday, but I feel like Ive made a lot of progress thanks to CDMAS and all of the helpful members. Thanks guys!!

 

[Krazy]

<a href=showthread.php?s=&postid=8277875#post8277875 target=_blank>Originally posted</a> by Dustin P.
...soooo back to the topic

When I joined, my goal was to learn from those who were already into the hobby...Im still learning everyday, but I feel like Ive made a lot of progress thanks to CDMAS and all of the helpful members. Thanks guys!!

I gotta say I am/was a bit shy when I joined, but I am opening up and love the group, it got me so much more into the hobby that I learn something new everyday, you are all an awesome group of people and the diversity is cool, we are all so differnt yet share the same interest in the hobby and we come together "as the group" I love the group buys and the discounts too ALOT, I havent given much back to the community yet but as I learn more I will hopefully someday teach someone that was in my shoes down the road...

and for Linda and Kris, will you two please say sorry or w/e and make up... stop the online drama... we're only human

 

[jallard]

I too joined the club for the interaction of the members. When I started I was gonna just set up a FO tank cause I didn't know jack about corals. But then I saw some coral in a tank and thought I gotta have some of that. It's funny because at the time...if you were giving it away I was accepting it willingly. Now I'm much more picky :lol: I always thought the group was a great wealth of knowledge and still do. If it weren't for many of the members I would have a fresh water tank right now.

What are the goals of CDMAS? IMO and only my opinion.....our #1 goal should be to have fun with the hobby and also the club. Because when it's not fun anymore.... well I guess I'll start keeping turtles or something. In keeping with the fun theme we as a club can do so much more now than we could have a year ago.

There has always been rumblings about CDMAS trips and we can certainly do that, and IMO because many of us know each other pretty well it would make for a great time. The monthly meeting are also mainly for fun.....everyone knows that the meetings couldn't get any more laxed. Many of us, myself included like to go to a meeting and chew the fat, enjoy a cold beverage, check out the host tank and do whatever needs to be done. Even if no business is taken care of it's still cool! If your new to the club go to a meeting!!

As for education.....I for one am not up for holding a class at any school for the purpose of promoting or educating people about our hobby. That's not to say that other can't. However, as we work on a tank in a school or anywhere in public we will from time to time chat with passer bys. The kids love to ask questions and I don't mind talking to them. If a few kids wanted to learn how to maintain the school tank....I don't even mind working with them.

As for the freebies.....Please don't misunderstand me but IMO we are NOT a discount club. We as a club shouldn't approach venders or LFS like they owe us a discount because we are CDMAS. Regardless of how much we spend at any one time. They are in the business to make money and we are there customers. That's not to say that I don't enjoy a discount on my purchases cause I defiantly do. If they offer a discount we of course can take them up on it. From time to time I get e-mails to the club with offers....which I try to make public on our CDMAS website. Group buys are great too!

I dunno.......the clubs getting more organized and it is growing fast. That growth will defiantly change CDMAS in some ways. We just have to go with it.

 

[Linda C.]

I don’t think I’m strong enough of a person for this kind of stuff. I thought I was clear when I said “I'm not judging them on what their purpose is on being in the group or what direction they would like to go in as much as I want to understand what CDMAS goals are as a group”

I guess I was just stating what prompted me to ask the question. I really didn’t mean it as attack on a member.

I keep re-reading the posts and feel like I can’t do this to myself or my family. Tom goes away way too much and I can’t deal with this stuff by myself with no one to talk to about it at home… (sorry Tom, I know you wanted me just to do nothing for awhile but it is too upsetting for me not to do this….I’m a mess tonight and your not home until Friday..sorry you had to read this on the board).

Please take my name off the nomination for council person. Please take my name off the joint meeting for November.

Thanks for the support for those who gave it to me when I really needed it. Sorry if I disappointed anyone.

Linda

 

[Dave ESPI]

Lakeside, I don't know anything about any conversation you and Linda had, but from her initial post, I think her question was perfectly valid for a thread.

I think as an outsider simply readig a thread on a messageboard that had a good thought provoking basis as to the truizims of the "GOALS" of a membership in the group, You took her question to a personal level and created your own drama within it.

I'm not taking sides here, but simply just reading a thread then going :W T F: ????? and reading on.....

I'm just at a loss for where you think a private conversation has any ambiguity that is applied to YOU personaly translates in her initial post.........

Sorry, just my perspective.

IMHO: GOALS: socialize and interact with other likeminded hobbyist, and strive to spread education through information and corrective measures to extend the lives of captive animals and promote better reef husbandry through the "community en masse".

Discounts, freebies, and "perks" are always nice, but not the basis of a group membership... unless it is like AAA :lol:

 

[plandy]

Are we looking at a chain collision in process here?!:mixed:

Time to take your chill pill folks!!! :wildone:

"Please take my name off the nomination for council person. Please take my name off the joint meeting for November"

Linda, your request for permission to resign is denied. Please resume your duties in dedication of what you love the most: Promoting the safety and well being of hapless reef denizens. The reefs need a voice like yours to represent them in the face of adversity! Not everyone will agree with us all the time but they are worth fighting for.

 

[Rainer Feyer]

Re: question on CDMAS goals

<a href=showthread.php?s=&postid=8273790#post8273790 target=_blank>Originally posted</a> by Linda C.
After speaking to a member on Tuesday night I realized how different some peoples goals are with being in a Reef Club.

My understanding/intention is to “promote the marine aquarium hobby and the conservation of the world's coral reefs through education, example, aquaculture and the ethical treatment of marine wildlife”.

Their purpose was "to get a discount" either a group buy or by soliciting vendors. From my understanding this member had little interest in the education or environmental aspect of being a group. Their emphasis was having a good time and saving money to build their system.

I'm not judging them on what their purpose is on being in the group or what direction they would like to go in as much as I want to understand what CDMAS goals are as a group.

OK, I was going to be quite on this and hoped it would just go away, but since David also includes interpretation which further points toward Lakeside, I need to put in my 2 cents as well:

The statement of "I am not judging" is incorrect - the statement "Their purpose was "to get a discount"..." IS an interpretation and therefore judging. Stating that "Their goals are different" is further judging with a negative implication. Since another member here knew where and when the conversation took place, that already negates the thought that it is 'ananomous'.

Linda and Lakeside, I hope this can be layed at rest and used as an experience in writing on forums. It's never easy to be without body language response during a conversation.

Speaking of myself, I am continuously mystified about the change in communication between myself and others - as I grew up in Germany for the first 15 years of my life, I can possibly write it off as "language gap".

Hope all goes well and we can return to helping each other be happy in our hobbies, have a couple of laughs along the way, and reduce the number of un-necessary reef/ fishes deaths by growing strong, healthy, and self-producing reef aquariums - that is my primary goal of this club.