Researched until I am thoroughly confused – Phosphate removal

fazgood

fazgood

Not Quite Right
Researched until I am thoroughly confused â€"œ Phosphate removal

I want to get rid of the old eheim canister and get a phosban and carbon reactor. BUT, the more I have read the more confused I get, phos-ban, phos-gard, roh-phos, 2 little fishies... SO, I am asking for recommendations.

I have a 120 with 200 pounds of live rock, a bunch of fish and mostly softies and a few LPS. I also have a fuge with a dsb and chaeto and mangroves. I also use an Eheim with bags of carbon and Phoslock. With the recent blooms of hair algae and diatoms I am pretty sure that the phosphates are high although my test kits reads fairly low. The nitrates have been a constant challenge at 10 to 20.

I’d like to get two separate reactors, one for phos and the other for carbon. I can foresee using them for a while so I’d like to plan on getting bulk media. With all that in mind,
I need a recommendation for:

Type of phosphate remover
Type of activated carbon
Brand of reactor.

Best place to buy all of the above

Any help is appreciated

Thanks

Faz
 
I would go with either TLF phosban or rowa-phos. Marine solutions has them or you could order it from Premium Aquatics.
By the way, look around your tank and sump for detritus. It will break down and increase your phosphate levels.
 
Agree with dphins regarding looking to clean out your sump/fuge as much as possible, along with using a turkey baster on your rocks in your display to kick loose any detritus.

I have had very good results using Warner Marine's PHOSaR, and I have heard that they have an "HC" version of it (high capacity). I went from having a very stubborn turf algae throughout a large portion of my tank, to having no noticeable green or brown algaes at all in my display. Now granted, I altered my feeding and changed my flow a bit too, but I think it was the PHOSaR that not only stopped it, but made it recede to being nonexistant now. It took a few months, so patience continues to be a virtue.
 
I've never tried the PHOSaR, might try it next time. It is cheaper then rowaphos.
 
Faz,
I have had great luck over the past year using a raw piece of uncooked pork belly. You will have to ask your local butcher to order it for you because everything that have in the counter has some sort of preservative in the meat and you do not want to introduce that into our delicate systems. I normally use about 1/2 to 1 pound--Also make sure he wraps in in plastic and not the wax paper as it can leach back into your system and if you have far to drive have him put some ice in the bag so it will not spoil.

After you get home take the meat out of the bag and rinse it VERY well in RO water to remove any bacteria that has built up from your trip. I prefer to use RO rather than tap because the chlorine can leach into the meat and I would not want that in my system.

After you have rinsed it is very important to place the piece of raw meat in some sort of a nylon bag, I use an old pantyhose that my wife put a run in. If you do not do this the pods and crabs will attack the meat and it will end up in small pieces all over the place and you do not want rotting or decaying meat in your system.

After you have secured the meat in the bag place it directly under your over flow, if at all possible before it reaches your skimmer.
That is where it can soak up the greatest amount of phosphate, nitrate and nitrite.


After a few weeks remove the meat and you will have some of the best tasting bacon you have ever had. If the levels are still high then I would do it again.



JK
I use phosban in a reactor.
 
Geox,

I have heard that some types of meat in a pickeling brine can pull impurities out of liquids. I am not 100% convinced that this will work but the hair algae is so thick that I am willing to try anything.

I dropped by Straubs on the way home from work and they had a small 1/2 pound pork belly. They are a real butcher shop so I am pretty sure it is preservative free. I am a bit concerned because it is very fatty, I would guess more than 75% is white fat. I hope thats not a problem. I rinsed it well and let it soak in RO/DI and have it in a nylon bag in the sump.

The only thing that is weird is that I seem to have a thin film forming on the top of the main tank and the skimmer has just about stopped foaming.

I will keep you advised as to the progress. With what I observed, I am wondering if the oils from the meat have something to do with the algae dieing off.

Thanks

Faz
 
If that does not do the trick I have also used Round up in the tank to rid the tank of everything living---but that should ONLY be your last measure.

What is your magnesium level?
 
I used phosguard and recently switched to PhosAR. The PhosAR lasts longer, but both have worked well for me. I know people are concerned with Phosguard being aluminum based but I changed it out every two for 3 plus years with no issues.
 
Phosguard turned from white to yellow. With PhosAR I monitor the phosphate level and when it starts increasing, I switch it out. I beleive the PhosAR can last up to three months, however, I won't go longer than 6 weeks. Be careful with the PhosAR because you can shock the system if you your first time using it is a full amount. Use half the amount recommended and then switch that in two weeks to the full amount.

I just place mine in a media chamber in my sump with moderate water flow.
 
The roundup did it!

Magnesium... I read where if that drops it can cause outbreaks and that raising it to 1500 to 1600 can kill the stuff pretty quickly. BUT, I have not tested (no test kit).

I do use Seachem Reef Advatage Calcium and Reef Complete once a week. They claim to maintain mag. I also use Instant Ocean and have been doing about 15% a week changes while trying to pull and vacuum out the bigger patches.

Another interesting observation my kid made, the "old" rocks seem to have most if not all of the worst growths of hair. Many of these rocks are 17 years old and were in the tank for years when it was fish only and not well maintained. Could those rocks be leaching out phosphate? That is not a pleasant thought if it is.

I am going to get a couple of reactors, a mag test kit (any suggestions) and some PhosAR and over the holidays try to slowly bring it down. I might also try to pull a few of the heavily haired rocks. I don't want to totally wipe the stuff out as I am getting a foxface Wed night. Either way most will ahve to go if he will have a chance to keep the stuff to a minimum.

Appreciate the help. Any recommendations for a reactor and where to get it?

Faz
 
Re: Researched until I am thoroughly confused â€"œ Phosphate removal

<a href=showthread.php?s=&postid=11404483#post11404483 target=_blank>Originally posted</a> by fazgood
Researched until I am thoroughly confused â€"œ Phosphate removal

I want to get rid of the old eheim canister and get a phosban and carbon reactor. Faz
Click to expand...

You already have a perfect reactor in the Eheim. Put the PhosAr in a Seachem Bag and in the bottom area of the cannister, put carbon in the top area. Change the carbon every other week and rinse off the bag of PhosAr. It is silly to buy a dedicated reactor when you already have one. Keep the cannister clean and it will work great.
 
<a href=showthread.php?s=&postid=11410575#post11410575 target=_blank>Originally posted</a> by fazgood

Another interesting observation my kid made, the "old" rocks seem to have most if not all of the worst growths of hair. Many of these rocks are 17 years old and were in the tank for years when it was fish only and not well maintained. Could those rocks be leaching out phosphate? That is not a pleasant thought if it is.Faz
Click to expand...


An astute observation. It has been reported that the outer layers of rock can store phosphate. "Cooking" rock let's this get consumed by the bacteria as one of the last available food sources in the rock. You can remove this outer layer of nutrients by soaking the rock in a weak acid. I just set up the 58 with Marco Rocks and soaked them in a 50/50 vinegar and water solution for a day or so and you would nor believe the junk that came off of them. Muriatic acid also works but is much quicker. If indeed you do have phosphate bound in the outer layers of rock it would be the perfect place for the hair to attach and grow...sort of like fertilized soil. An acid bath will kill the bacteria in the rock and living thing on or in it but will become live again with time.
 
http://www.twopartsolution.com/

this is where I buy my generic rowaphos from and their best carbon. seems to help rid the tank of HA.

I would not try round up since it is not labled for water use. try 'reward' or 'sonar' both are labled for water use. and if you think treating our tanks are pricey.... sonar is $600 a pint and it only treats about 10000SF 4' deep. and its not a 1 time deal either :) ...actually I do not have my aquatics license so dont listen to me. now and land based chems I can help you on... :)
 
http://www.twopartsolution.com/

this is where I buy my generic rowaphos from and their best carbon. seems to help rid the tank of HA.

I would not try round up since it is not labled for water use. try 'reward' or 'sonar' both are labled for water use. and if you think treating our tanks are pricey.... sonar is $600 a pint and it only treats about 10000SF 4' deep. and its not a 1 time deal either :) ...actually I do not have my aquatics license so dont listen to me. now and land based chems I can help you on... :)
 
Slight update

The magnesium test kit came today and if I read it right I am around 1100 to 1200. Possibly a bit on the low side. I have also checked and could not find any obvious debris in the sump or in the tank so I took advantage and harvested a few handfuls of chaeto and caulerpa.

I also noticed that the PH is getting hard to keep in the 8.1 to 8.3 range. At night, even with the fuge on an opposite schedule I wake up to 7.9 to 8.0. The calcium is at 420 and the alk is at 7, I am thinking on the low side as well.

The API test kit I have shows that phosphate is at the lowest reading on the scale and I am beginning to doubt that. Nitrate is hanging around .15ppt and salinity is 1.022

Any thoughts? The chemical imbalance has now fried the remaining brain cells I have on line.

I went ahead and picked up a small bottle of PhosGuard until the PhosAR gets here nest week. I put about a 75 gallon treatment in the Eheim along with a change of Carbon. The place I ordered from had a pretty good deal on 3.6 liters of Black Diamond.


Thanks,

Faz
 
i dont think you will ever read phosphates cause everything absorbs them to grow.....unless the phosgaurd can get em first.
 
I would bump up the mag to 14-1500. You can use Epsom salt but do a water change in a week or so. I figured that might be the problem.

After you raise the Magnesium I would throw in a FULL bag of Frito Scoops into the sump as their phosphate absorbing qualities are 2nd to none. Do not use the generic type as it will raise the Na too much and leach BHT and other preservatives into your water column!

Good luck with the increase in Mg and let us know how it turns out
 
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