A gentleman from Erie named John Kanzius made a somewhat "shocking" discovery while he was working on a radio-wave generator he had developed for the treatment of cancer. While attempting to desalinate sea water using radio frequencies, he noticed flashes, and within a few days, had saltwater burning in a test-tube as if it were a candle. The discovery spawned interest from the scientific community, mostly concerned with whether or not the water could be used as a fuel, and of course, healthy doses of disbelief. Last week, a Penn State University chemist named Rustum Roy held a demonstration proving that the science is sound, noting that the water doesn't burn, though the radio frequencies weaken the bonds holding together the salt, releasing hydrogen which is ignited when exposed to the RF field. Mr. Kanzius and Dr. Roy say the question now is the efficiency of the energy, and are presenting the technology to the US Department of Defense and Department of Energy to investigate how useful the technology will be. Of the plentiful maybe-fuel (which apparently burns so hot it can melt test-tubes) Dr. Roy says, "This is the most abundant element in the world. It is everywhere," and (without recognition of the poetic irony, as far as we can tell), "Seeing it burn gives me chills." Check the TV report after the break to see the water in action.
Saltwater as fuel
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denverhoss
Premium Member
I saw that this morning. I had to read through 6 different articles on it before I found the question that I was asking myself, does it produce more energy than it takes in? And the guy’s answer was, “noâ€Â. In all of the first 2 web texts and 3 news videos that I found, nobody asked that question, they just saw that it burned and assumed the world oil shortage was solved!
What this guy did is split water into hydrogen and oxygen and then burn the two. Wow. I did that in High School (I may still be missing an eyebrow). But I hadn’t solved the energy crisis because it took much more electricity to split the water than I could have recovered from recombining (burning) them again. What he may have here is (maybe) a more efficient way of splitting water, but there were no details from him on how much power it takes to make the gasses. And this would still only be an improvement to an existing energy storage/transport solution. It allows you to take electrical energy and convert it to a more transportable and storable gas that has potential heat and pressure energy, but no new energy is being produced! These “news†reports made it sound like you could drive to the beach and fill up your car’s tank for free with seawater. (You can do that, but voids your warranty and won’t get you very far…) It makes me sad that pseudo-science gets so much air time, and that these air-head reporters get any at all.
Now, back to working on my Zero-point, Cold-fusion, Tesla Generator! It runs my power heads at Warp 10!
Hoss
What this guy did is split water into hydrogen and oxygen and then burn the two. Wow. I did that in High School (I may still be missing an eyebrow). But I hadn’t solved the energy crisis because it took much more electricity to split the water than I could have recovered from recombining (burning) them again. What he may have here is (maybe) a more efficient way of splitting water, but there were no details from him on how much power it takes to make the gasses. And this would still only be an improvement to an existing energy storage/transport solution. It allows you to take electrical energy and convert it to a more transportable and storable gas that has potential heat and pressure energy, but no new energy is being produced! These “news†reports made it sound like you could drive to the beach and fill up your car’s tank for free with seawater. (You can do that, but voids your warranty and won’t get you very far…) It makes me sad that pseudo-science gets so much air time, and that these air-head reporters get any at all.
Now, back to working on my Zero-point, Cold-fusion, Tesla Generator! It runs my power heads at Warp 10!
Hoss
Can't you say the same thing about the amount of power it takes to get the air turbines to wind up each time the wind stops. I heard also that bio fuels have the same problem.
If it takes twice the amount of energy to convert the salt water to energy then can you also say that we can just use additional salt water to create the new energy. Either way it is a source that is abundant and if what they say about the rising levels of the oceans this should help with that problem. Then again i am no scientist so I can't really say if this has potential or not.
If it takes twice the amount of energy to convert the salt water to energy then can you also say that we can just use additional salt water to create the new energy. Either way it is a source that is abundant and if what they say about the rising levels of the oceans this should help with that problem. Then again i am no scientist so I can't really say if this has potential or not.
"Umm fish?"
Premium Member
Yeah, but wind is free. Even if it took a week for the turbine to start up again after a stop, you'd still be on the plus side. The energy that he's using to generate his radio waves is not free, so he's at a net loss.
I do get your point, though. Seawater is cheap, easy to transport, doesn't create a huge mess if there's a spill (well, not to hear my lovely bride talk about it
, but better than petroleum), and might well be worth the energy expense involved to process it. Especially, if the energy to process it could come from, say, wind or solar power.
denverhoss
Premium Member
Yeah, don't even get me started on turning food into fuel so we can produce more food. But things like wind, solar, coal, and oil all have existing and easy to tap energy, so I'd call them energy sources. Salt water does not. The only known way to get heat out of it is to put electricity in, RF or otherwise. So it may convert energy from one form to another, but I don't think its a true source.
Hey, I just thought of something! I could take an extra Metal Halide fixture and run it above some solar panels. Then the panels would produce energy 24 hours a day! With enough panels and MH bulbs running, I could disconnect my house from the power grid. I may have solved the energy crisis AND global warming in one sweep!
Seriously, can’t you hear it now? People in the near future saying, “I remember reading about a guy who discovered how to run your car on sea water, but those *^%$#^$ big oil companies bought the patent and buried the technology!â€Â. And I’m not talking about tin foil hat people, this is the kind of stuff you hear from otherwise average “Joesâ€Â.
Hey, I just thought of something! I could take an extra Metal Halide fixture and run it above some solar panels. Then the panels would produce energy 24 hours a day! With enough panels and MH bulbs running, I could disconnect my house from the power grid. I may have solved the energy crisis AND global warming in one sweep!
Seriously, can’t you hear it now? People in the near future saying, “I remember reading about a guy who discovered how to run your car on sea water, but those *^%$#^$ big oil companies bought the patent and buried the technology!â€Â. And I’m not talking about tin foil hat people, this is the kind of stuff you hear from otherwise average “Joesâ€Â.
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"Umm fish?"
Premium Member
I would assume that it depends on where you are and what the turbine is connected to. Heck, in the pre-electricity days, they used wind to pump water around here. When the wind died, you just waited for it to get strong enough again to overcome resistence. I would imagine that the newer models spend a lot of engineering power trying to figure out how to minimize resistence.
But it's all about % of efficiency these days. Does geothermal use electricity? Yeah, sure. Something has to power the pump. But, a well-design system can be up to 300% efficient (for every unit of energy you put in, you get up to 3 units out). I would assume the same would be true if you're using energy to start up wind turbines. Sure, you have to give it a boost, but you get an incredible return of power for what you have to put in. In fact, I'd bet the first thing the turbine does is to charge a battery full of reserve energy that it can use to re-start itself, connected to a wind velocity measurement to tell it whether it's worthwhile to re-start. Anyway, that's how I would design it. Now, if they can just get the maintenance costs down....
But it's all about % of efficiency these days. Does geothermal use electricity? Yeah, sure. Something has to power the pump. But, a well-design system can be up to 300% efficient (for every unit of energy you put in, you get up to 3 units out). I would assume the same would be true if you're using energy to start up wind turbines. Sure, you have to give it a boost, but you get an incredible return of power for what you have to put in. In fact, I'd bet the first thing the turbine does is to charge a battery full of reserve energy that it can use to re-start itself, connected to a wind velocity measurement to tell it whether it's worthwhile to re-start. Anyway, that's how I would design it. Now, if they can just get the maintenance costs down....
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