SPS and PO4

[HerbieK]

I have had very high PO4 readings lately, actually, I have always had relatively high PO4 readings. Currently , had a .12 reading on my Milwaukee Martini meter (tested 3 times, so this is an average). A "good" reading lately in my tank has been .06.

I measured the water coming out of my GFO reactor at .03 today, so I know it is working to get some of the PO4 out.

NO3 is at about 5 on the Salifert.

I have no real nuisance algae. No red slime, and some isolated quarter sized patches of hair algae, but very isolated here and there.

My SPS look great, colors are good, but I always have very little PE, but this is most likely due to my Flame and Lemon Peel angels.

The funny part of this whole thing is that I am running Zeo, full blown, rocks, food, bacteria, etc. The bacteria that I am adding does have a somewhat "bad food" smell about it. I was told if it smells like rotten eggs, then it is bad. Maybe my ZeoBak is bad?

The flow in my tank is provided by 4 Vortec MP40s, long pulse, full blast, 7 modded Tunze Nanos consitsting of 4 6025, 1 6045 and 2 6055. My return is running into 2 3/4 in' sea swirls.

I am running a Vertex Alpha Kone 250 skimmer.

I have the following fish load:

Pink Tail trigger
Sailfin Tang
Naso Tang
White Cheek Tang (aka gold rim, powerder brown)
Regal Angel
Hippo Tang
Lemon Peel Angel
Flame Angel
10 Green Chromis
1 Mandarin

I usually feed a sheet of Seaweed a day, some freeze dried shrimp and green flake daily.

I am not running a fuge at this time.

Lights are 3X 250 watt radiums w/ 2 6ft vho actinics (I have 6 AquaIlluminations Super Sol Blue LEDs on order)

Based on my chemistry, one would expect my SPS to be "feeling" the high nitrates/phosphates, but they do not appear to be. I have no corals "browning out" or anything like that.

I do weekly water changes w/ RO/DI water. I use a 50/50 blend of Red Sea Coral Pro and Reef Crystals currently.

I am wondering how my tank can maintain it's "health" under these generally accepted "bad" PO4/NO3 levels.

Maybe I shouldn't be worried if the tank looks good?

Any comments or feedback are greatly appreciated.

Thanks.

Herb

 

[ryshark]

What size is your tank? Its hard to comment about your bioload and overfeeding without knowing this.
In regards to the Zeobak, I haven't used it but I have used other bacterias which do stink, so I assume that is normal...but can't say for sure.
NO3 of 5 is perfectly acceptable. I am curious to what others have to say about the sps keeping good colors with a PO4 of 0.12

 

[HerbieK]

Duh! I guess I forgot my tank size. It is a 180 w/ a 45 breeder sump.

 

[HerbieK]

Also, WC is 35 gallons each week. Clean the glass 2 or so times a week.

 

[Cultivatedcoral]

Your are probably just barely avoiding disaster due to your large weekly water change. Without that size wc every week I think you would have more problems with your sps.

 

[DallasSVT]

Might try running more GFO :thumbsup:

 

[Reef Bass]

+1 for GFO.

While you may be happy with your corals, I'd venture a guess that there's a chance that your corals could grow faster and look even more colorful with greater PE if your phosphates were lower. Ok, maybe not greater PE with your angels.

 

[Acrotrdco]

Have you been using ZeoSpur2 since you said you're using the Zeovit system full blown?

Given your bioload, your NO3/PO4 is in pretty good shape, but if you want to improve it further, I'll look into your feeding habit.

The seaweed (nori), freeze dried shrimps probably aren't much of a problem as long as they're all eaten and none are left over to rot, but I'd recommend you to get rid of the flakes, they're loaded with phosphate.

Try Ocean Nutrient Formula 2 if you really need to supplement some additional green food, but use it sparingly.

 

[ryshark]

Have you been using ZeoSpur2 since you said you're using the Zeovit system full blown?

Given your bioload, your NO3/PO4 is in pretty good shape, but if you want to improve it further, I'll look into your feeding habit.

The seaweed (nori), freeze dried shrimps probably aren't much of a problem as long as they're all eaten and none are left over to rot, but I'd recommend you to get rid of the flakes, they're loaded with phosphate.

Try Ocean Nutrient Formula 2 if you really need to supplement some additional green food, but use it sparingly.

Do you think the frozen Formula 2 has a lot of PO4?

 

[dzhuo]

Herb,
Your corals has good grow, good color and you have no algae issue. You know the cause of no PE and your tank isn't being over run with algae. If you get PO4 down quickly (with running more GFO) but in the process shocking your SPS or upset the chemistry or simply mess up, would you be happier?

Do you think the frozen Formula 2 has a lot of PO4?

I recently saw this quote in chemistry forum by Tom. Apparently, Randy has done tests with a variety of popular fish food. I wish the list is more comprehensive:

===
Here's the chart from one of Randy's posts a while back:

I've never calculated this before, but if you look at the phosphorus to protein ratio, you get:


Formula Two...........................176
Formula One.............................69
Frozen Brine Shrimp................232
Frozen Plankton/Krill...............182
Golden Pearls..........................273
Lancefish.................................244
Nori..........................................221
Plankton Gold Flakes...............169
Prime Reef.................................69
Saltwater Staple......................500
Silversides...............................952
Tahitian Blend..........................318
===

 

[Acrotrdco]

He has about 0.06-0.12 ppm of PO4, going from there to 0.03 wouldn't really give the SPS a shock, consider SPS in the natural reef lives with 0.001 ppm or lower of PO4.

 

[dzhuo]

Understood. I am not as obsess to number as how the corals' grow and color. If PO4 reading jumps from 0.06 to 0.12 from day to day (or irregularly), I would question the number and its accuracy. As a precaution, I would at least double confirm the PO4 reading before over react (especially over an apparently healthy tank).

 

[HerbieK]

I may need to cross check my Martini meter w/ another local reefer's just to make sure it is reading OK. Not sure why it should go bad. I am using reagents out of the same lot when my PO4 was lower.

I did notice that some of my Tunze nanos were kinda gunked up w/ sludge. These are modded, so they pull a lot of water through the somewhat small slats in the lower part of the shroud. Maybe this was my phosphate source?

I will test again this weekend and see if anything changes.

Also, I am not using any ZeoSpur. Just basic 4, PIF and Sponge power daily. Once in a while I will use a little Pohl's extra and B-Balance (maybe once a week or so).

Herb

 

[jimroth]

Having seen the colors and growth rates you're achieving with your acros, I would like to gently suggest perhaps

IF IT AIN'T BROKE DON'T FIX IT!

You are changing 140G per month on a system that probably has less than 180G of water volume. You could probably throw whatever you wanted into there. My thought is that if you get the phosphate under conttrol, maybe you could go to 20G per week or something. But if it's working, maybe the corals are digging it.