Starting to plan a reef predator tank.

G

gibs

New member
Hi guys ok here goes. I am just starting a 16g nano tank which will have mostly coral with maybe one false ocellaris. I have been reading my butt off with books and websites the past 3 weeks. My idea with the smaller tank was to give myself a feel for the hobby and have set myself a deadline of 6 months so I know exactly what I am getting into and can/cannot handle. However with my research I have a much better understanding of what I want for my permanent tank and this is what I would like some help with because I really want to have my plan ready when I get ready to upgrade. I want a predator reef tank so I want to make sure I am planning for the best filtration and size so I don't have to cut back later when a fish I want is to large for the tank I already bought, or if a fish needs a tank that I can't handle I won't get my heart to set on it.
So here it is.

120g tank I can go bigger but 200g is going to be to big for the area I am putting it.

lights and filtration will depend on the corals and fish I decide on, but I would like an some LPS and a anemone.

1 lionfish (most likely volition but the dwarf intrigues me also)

1 moray eel (zebra and snowflake are options but if I can find one the banana is awesome)

1 puffer fish (I know some of these eat invertebrates so maybe not? still looking at the different species suggestions are welcome).

Any other predator species suggestions are welcome but I also want one or 2 colorful swimmers so...

1 angelfish? (I love this fish but maybe to small?)

1 purple tang? (size on these seems to wildly vary so not sure if it is to big or small for my tank)

What should I do for Janitorial duties? I know several of the fish above eat shrimps and crabs? Maybe just going with some larger species of crab?

Again this for me is planning so all suggestions big and small are extremely welcome.
 
I plan on upgrading in a yr to a predator reef 200 gallon plus.

Tangs, miniatus grouper , blue jaw trigger , fu man chu, golden eel and maybe a tusk.
 
hey, first off i would suggest going to at least 180. from my research (admittedly im more into traditional reef fish) ive seen alot of the bigger predator fish (mainly triggers and angels) are suggested to have at least 180 gallons. depending on the bioload i would either get soft or lps. they can tolerate higher parameters than sps. i hate to say it but i dont think a puffer would work for your tank. they are a hit or miss on whether or not they eat corals. some people say they never have an issue others have all their corals killed. as for your cuc i would think snails are your best bet. esp turbo snails who are bigger and therefore harder to be eaten. crabs will be eaten no matter what size really. And one of the natural predators of urchins are triggers. finally, purple tangs might be too aggressive believe it or not. they are nasty.
 
michaelr said:
hey, first off i would suggest going to at least 180. from my research (admittedly im more into traditional reef fish) ive seen alot of the bigger predator fish (mainly triggers and angels) are suggested to have at least 180 gallons. depending on the bioload i would either get soft or lps. they can tolerate higher parameters than sps. i hate to say it but i dont think a puffer would work for your tank. they are a hit or miss on whether or not they eat corals. some people say they never have an issue others have all their corals killed. as for your cuc i would think snails are your best bet. esp turbo snails who are bigger and therefore harder to be eaten. crabs will be eaten no matter what size really. And one of the natural predators of urchins are triggers. finally, purple tangs might be too aggressive believe it or not. they are nasty.
Click to expand...

Hey thanks for the advice! Yeah I was thinking I would try to stay away from sps I keep hearing they are kind of difficult. For some reason I never thought of snails for cuc so thats a good thought. The tang and puffer I think I knew were reaches but hey I wanted to see what other people thought. What about the flame angel? I hear of a few people that keep more than one lionfish is having 2 just different species fine? I Know the lions and eels will hide alot so I want at least 2 fish that are active swimmers but I really don't want to be having to be getting rid of fish because of fights. Any other suggestions? Thanks to all who responded!
 
You can keep multiple lions. My tank currently has a fuzzy dwarf, antennata, and radiata. They get along just fine. I have not seen a lionfish harass another fish that was too big to consume. On the other hand, when you are keeping lion fish it limits your stocking list. Puffers, triggers, angels, and Tangs are well known for nipping the lions fins and even breaking off their spines. This usually results in death unless you separate the fish. For me it is a case by case basis, but I do acknolwege the fact that these combinations are tricky from numerous accounts of harassment with these combinations. I used to keep a dogface puffer yellow tang and picasso trigger with my lions and they were model citizens. Never looked twice at the lions. However i did not know of the potential complications with this stock list and I lucked out. As far as eels and lions hiding a lot, I don't know where you got that information. My lions come out to greet anyone who walks by their tank hoping to be fed. They as what Greg and Renee say (Namxas and Seahorsedreams) learn to beg to the "food god" and are quite entertaining. It just takes some time and patience to wean your lions and for them to associate you with food. I would seriously consider turning your tank into a lionfish reef.

One last note, fuzzy dwarves, Fu man chu, zebra dwarf, and hawwaian green dwarves need to be mixed properly as two males will fight. The fuzzy is the only lion I know of that can be sexed. On adult males, they have 6-10 dark stripes on their pectoral fins and females have 4-6. When they are juveniles it is hard to sex. It is easiest on mature adult specimens.
 
gibs said:
Hey thanks for the advice! Yeah I was thinking I would try to stay away from sps I keep hearing they are kind of difficult. For some reason I never thought of snails for cuc so thats a good thought. The tang and puffer I think I knew were reaches but hey I wanted to see what other people thought. What about the flame angel? I hear of a few people that keep more than one lionfish is having 2 just different species fine? I Know the lions and eels will hide alot so I want at least 2 fish that are active swimmers but I really don't want to be having to be getting rid of fish because of fights. Any other suggestions? Thanks to all who responded!
Click to expand...

flame angels are on a case by case thing as well when it comes to reef safe or not. i had one that never picked at my lps but have heard stories of them nipping. i also think its more prevalent in sps systems too though. as for active swimmers i would look in to Australian harlequin tusks. i had one that was extremely social. never bothered my fish or my corals either.
 
In my 65g lion tank at one point I had 2 fu's, a dwarf fuzzy, a melanurus wrasse, and a matted filefish. One of the fus died, the fuzzy died and the wrasse died. The only fish I replaced was the fuzzy with another fuzzy. The filefish really loves hanging out with the fuzzy. I think the bigger wrasses are okay with lions but many will eat your cuc. This tank is a softy tank -- leathers and mushrooms.
 
Mental1 said:
In my 65g lion tank at one point I had 2 fu's, a dwarf fuzzy, a melanurus wrasse, and a matted filefish. One of the fus died, the fuzzy died and the wrasse died. The only fish I replaced was the fuzzy with another fuzzy. The filefish really loves hanging out with the fuzzy. I think the bigger wrasses are okay with lions but many will eat your cuc. This tank is a softy tank -- leathers and mushrooms.
Click to expand...

Very cool man was the tank overcrowded in that size tank with that many fish? How many softies did you have in there? I would love to see a pic. Thanks for the advice.

CuttleKid said:
You can keep multiple lions. My tank currently has a fuzzy dwarf, antennata, and radiata. They get along just fine. I have not seen a lionfish harass another fish that was too big to consume. On the other hand, when you are keeping lion fish it limits your stocking list. Puffers, triggers, angels, and Tangs are well known for nipping the lions fins and even breaking off their spines. This usually results in death unless you separate the fish. For me it is a case by case basis, but I do acknolwege the fact that these combinations are tricky from numerous accounts of harassment with these combinations. I used to keep a dogface puffer yellow tang and picasso trigger with my lions and they were model citizens. Never looked twice at the lions. However i did not know of the potential complications with this stock list and I lucked out. As far as eels and lions hiding a lot, I don't know where you got that information. My lions come out to greet anyone who walks by their tank hoping to be fed. They as what Greg and Renee say (Namxas and Seahorsedreams) learn to beg to the "food god" and are quite entertaining. It just takes some time and patience to wean your lions and for them to associate you with food. I would seriously consider turning your tank into a lionfish reef.

One last note, fuzzy dwarves, Fu man chu, zebra dwarf, and hawwaian green dwarves need to be mixed properly as two males will fight. The fuzzy is the only lion I know of that can be sexed. On adult males, they have 6-10 dark stripes on their pectoral fins and females have 4-6. When they are juveniles it is hard to sex. It is easiest on mature adult specimens.
Click to expand...

Cuttle I have been playing with the idea of making it a lionfish only tank with several different species. Still think I want my banana eel though but I know they are rare so that may not even be a possibilty. I know that Lionfish will come to the front of the tank and beg for food. But I have read several places that they like to hide under ledges and caves and unless someone is near the tank may not swim in actively around the tank which could make it appear empty? I know the eel will hide a lot also. If I keep the tank of the 100-120 gallon size how many lions do you think I could keep in it, with a bunch of corals?
 
The tank was fine when the melanurus wrasse was small but it definitely got too small for her. She jumped into the overflow while I was on a trip and when I finally found her in there she was dead. The lions died of some weird thing -- have no idea what is was and I treated them in QT for 6 weeks and still lost them -- was sad. But it had nothing to do with crowding. It's all plumbed into the system so it's a total volume of around 400g. I will take a picture later and post it -- maybe a video would be more fun ... the fuzzy is at the top right now because he's shedding but I have to be on a work call!
 
There are 3 big leathers in the tank -- not nems. Never worry about questions as people put all kinds of stuff in their tanks! I'm always asking .. what's that? The tank is a bit overgrown with algae as I have been treating for flukes, so the skimmer/carbon/gfo have all been off for a lot of the month. It tends to be a bit more of a messy tank anyway, but it is plumbed into the whole system.
 
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