plasmacon
New member
Hello all:
I guess my goal is to improve growth and color of my corals. Colors are good, but might be better, I don't know. My main complaint is that I can not seem to keep zoas alive for any length of time. Huge amphipods are either being opportunistic with sick zoas, or simply find them tasty.
Some back ground.
System is 2 years old. No crashes.
75 gallon display. 50 gallon sump.
20L refugium with macros.
30 gallon water change tank. Cryptic.
Total volume about 112 gallons.
Lights: ATI 48" Dimable Sunpower. 6x54wt. New bulbs, 2 blue plus, 2 coral plus, 1 purple plus, 1 aquablue special. Photo period about 8 hours at 65% intensity. 450 PAR 4" below water surface. 180 PAR at sand bed using an apogee. These lights are bright.
Flow provided by Koralia 1400 and SEIO that is almost as powerful.
The system is controlled with an Apex.
Protein skimmer is in need of upgrade, 3 year old Coralife needle wheel 220. Modified . It never stays tuned.
Osmolator ATO that is worth every penny.
Calcium and alkalinity provided by BRS dosing pumps. Mag is manual dosing every Friday.
Activated carbon run in a BRS canister.
4 stage RODI with a conductivity of 0 to 16 uS before I change blocks and membranes etc.
New Saltwater is aged for a day or two in a brute container, and RODI is stored in brute as well.
Water changes are 25 gallons about once a month.
Specific Gravity = 1.026. Calibrated refractometer.
Ammonia = 0.0 Always. API
Nitrite = 0.0 Always. API
Nitrate = 0.0 Always. Salifert
Phosphate = 0.0. Always
Calcium = 420 RedSea maybe?
Alkalinity = 8.8 dKH. Salifert
Magnesium = 1350. Salifert.
pH = 7.8 to 8.0 a little low, but it doesn't hurt anything.
I have designed an ultra low nutrient system with moderate to heavy feeding. Fish fed daily and corals fed twice a week at night. I use dry foods regularly, and frozen as a treat once a week. Corals always get frozen and coral frenzy.
I feel like I am too low on nutrients or at least the limiting factor being carbon. This is the reason for posting here...
Everything that goes into my system goes through QT. Everything.... Fish get cupramine and prazipro at a minimum. I am prepared for other issues as needed. Corals all get dipped in CoralRX before and after QT. They are observed in QT for 4 weeks.
Stock:
2 ocellaris clowns. 2"
Mckoskers flasher wrasse. 2"
2 purple dart fish. 2"
Kole yellow eyed tang. 4"
Yellow Tang. 4"
I am increasing stock as I go and am not finished.
2 scarlett skunk cleaner shrimp.
7 to 10 Nassirus snails
4 or 5 trocus snails.
1-4" ultra crocea clam.
1 Flame scallop.
Plenty of micro fauna.
Hermits and snails in refugium.
Corals:
Red monti cap. Growing.
Spongodes. Growing.
Frogspawn. Growing.
Hammer. Hasn't been in long.
Torch. Doing well but still recovering after its head was torn apart and crushed.
Assorted SPS, humilis, hawkins, valadias, unknowns, etc, etc. Slow, but growing
Blue chalice growing.
Acans. Growing
Blastos . Not doing much.
Duncan's growing.
Kenya tree and GSP Can't kill it, lol.
Undatas growing.
Assorted Birdsnests, growing.
Cynarinas growing.
Favias growing.
Zoas and Palys doing nothing
Mushrooms, discos and rics. Stay small. Grow slow.
Gorgonians growing.
Spaghetti finger leather not growing.
My main concern is the lack of growth in the zoas and palys. Zoas just get eaten when they go in to the display after a time. I hit them with dips and furan 2 treatments to fight infections. They live in my QT for months just fine. Old display water is the new QT water at water change time for fish and coral. After a while, I move them to my display, and they start to get eaten by these huge amphipods. I am working toward adding another mandarin to keep the population under control. Unfortunate accident involving my beanAnimal coast to coast overflow and a fish screen that slipped and the overflow killed three of my fish in one go. One being a mandarin.
I got two colors of palys in January of 2012. They were 2 polyps each. I was doing small vitamin C doses at the time, and stopped. The two frags increased from 2 polyps to 4 each. Then i quit the vitamin C. They have stayed at 4 heads each for 8 months. I don't get it. I moved them once, higher flow to lower flow. What the heck is up with these types of polyps?
I thought, ok, maybe the QT has a more stable temp. I had a good swing programmed into my apex, 78 to 82 daily, and everyone is and has been fine with the swing. I tightened that up to 80 to 82. It hasnt made any difference.
I added a small DIY wet/dry to try to see at least a trace of nitrate. Again searching for a limiting factor, and again nothing. I still don't see nitrate, but I should be producing more with the wet/dry.
This leads me back to carbon as the limiting factor. My plan is not to follow the vinegar regime to reduce nitrate and phosphate levels. I simply plan to start slow. The dosing schedule time doubled and the dosing amount cut in half. Probably get up to 15 to 20 mls of acetic acid daily, and let it sit for a prolonged period, up to 90 days. I'm guessing my total water volume at 110 to 120 gallons.
I realize that some of my lack of growth in some things is due to the lights being too powerful for this display. It's an experiment, and the Sunpower was intended for a 120 gallon at 5 feet long. I also understand that I have tremendous flows, and have tuned them back, though they are still high.
There are things I have left out, and probably need to limit this post. I have access to a ton of information, and many of my numbers I have verified by secondary laboratory grade titrations and instrumentation from time to time as needed. In the past few months, I have been close to running some water through an ICP to see if something else is up. I haven't had to go that far, buts it's always an option. I have solved most of my pet peeves by adjusting flow and placement. I have adapted almost everything to the higher light output of the sunpower. I feel like I have a good handle on everything, and if funds allowed, I would make things even better. I understand that I have a mixed reef, and I am trying to make everyone happy in one system. I totally accept the fact that some corals will get thicker due to flow, and appear to grow less. I also understand that some corals will not expand greatly due to the lighting. Knowing all of this, I should still see new polyps on the zoas and palys.
I guess my main question to this forum is do you guys and gals think that carbon is the strongest possibility? With everything that you have read, do you see any mistakes here or there with my system? I feel like I have a good handle on things, so I don't want to hear that zoas just melt away for everyone lol. You guys have to have the answer! (pointing my finger at some of you, you know who you are). I'm going to try vinegar and see. I guess i dont have alot to complain about, but wanted review anyway.
Could it be iodine? Don't have a kit.
Would green water help? low doses.
Allelopathy maybe?
Perhaps Zoas don't like Brute containers?
Could it be that the Mayans predicted that we would have problems with zoas and I should research their ancient culture for prophetic references?
Thanks to anyone trying to help. I'm going to cross reference zoas and Nostradamus. I don't think I've done that yet, I might have but I better be sure.
I guess my goal is to improve growth and color of my corals. Colors are good, but might be better, I don't know. My main complaint is that I can not seem to keep zoas alive for any length of time. Huge amphipods are either being opportunistic with sick zoas, or simply find them tasty.
Some back ground.
System is 2 years old. No crashes.
75 gallon display. 50 gallon sump.
20L refugium with macros.
30 gallon water change tank. Cryptic.
Total volume about 112 gallons.
Lights: ATI 48" Dimable Sunpower. 6x54wt. New bulbs, 2 blue plus, 2 coral plus, 1 purple plus, 1 aquablue special. Photo period about 8 hours at 65% intensity. 450 PAR 4" below water surface. 180 PAR at sand bed using an apogee. These lights are bright.
Flow provided by Koralia 1400 and SEIO that is almost as powerful.
The system is controlled with an Apex.
Protein skimmer is in need of upgrade, 3 year old Coralife needle wheel 220. Modified . It never stays tuned.
Osmolator ATO that is worth every penny.
Calcium and alkalinity provided by BRS dosing pumps. Mag is manual dosing every Friday.
Activated carbon run in a BRS canister.
4 stage RODI with a conductivity of 0 to 16 uS before I change blocks and membranes etc.
New Saltwater is aged for a day or two in a brute container, and RODI is stored in brute as well.
Water changes are 25 gallons about once a month.
Specific Gravity = 1.026. Calibrated refractometer.
Ammonia = 0.0 Always. API
Nitrite = 0.0 Always. API
Nitrate = 0.0 Always. Salifert
Phosphate = 0.0. Always
Calcium = 420 RedSea maybe?
Alkalinity = 8.8 dKH. Salifert
Magnesium = 1350. Salifert.
pH = 7.8 to 8.0 a little low, but it doesn't hurt anything.
I have designed an ultra low nutrient system with moderate to heavy feeding. Fish fed daily and corals fed twice a week at night. I use dry foods regularly, and frozen as a treat once a week. Corals always get frozen and coral frenzy.
I feel like I am too low on nutrients or at least the limiting factor being carbon. This is the reason for posting here...
Everything that goes into my system goes through QT. Everything.... Fish get cupramine and prazipro at a minimum. I am prepared for other issues as needed. Corals all get dipped in CoralRX before and after QT. They are observed in QT for 4 weeks.
Stock:
2 ocellaris clowns. 2"
Mckoskers flasher wrasse. 2"
2 purple dart fish. 2"
Kole yellow eyed tang. 4"
Yellow Tang. 4"
I am increasing stock as I go and am not finished.
2 scarlett skunk cleaner shrimp.
7 to 10 Nassirus snails
4 or 5 trocus snails.
1-4" ultra crocea clam.
1 Flame scallop.
Plenty of micro fauna.
Hermits and snails in refugium.
Corals:
Red monti cap. Growing.
Spongodes. Growing.
Frogspawn. Growing.
Hammer. Hasn't been in long.
Torch. Doing well but still recovering after its head was torn apart and crushed.
Assorted SPS, humilis, hawkins, valadias, unknowns, etc, etc. Slow, but growing
Blue chalice growing.
Acans. Growing
Blastos . Not doing much.
Duncan's growing.
Kenya tree and GSP Can't kill it, lol.
Undatas growing.
Assorted Birdsnests, growing.
Cynarinas growing.
Favias growing.
Zoas and Palys doing nothing
Mushrooms, discos and rics. Stay small. Grow slow.
Gorgonians growing.
Spaghetti finger leather not growing.
My main concern is the lack of growth in the zoas and palys. Zoas just get eaten when they go in to the display after a time. I hit them with dips and furan 2 treatments to fight infections. They live in my QT for months just fine. Old display water is the new QT water at water change time for fish and coral. After a while, I move them to my display, and they start to get eaten by these huge amphipods. I am working toward adding another mandarin to keep the population under control. Unfortunate accident involving my beanAnimal coast to coast overflow and a fish screen that slipped and the overflow killed three of my fish in one go. One being a mandarin.
I got two colors of palys in January of 2012. They were 2 polyps each. I was doing small vitamin C doses at the time, and stopped. The two frags increased from 2 polyps to 4 each. Then i quit the vitamin C. They have stayed at 4 heads each for 8 months. I don't get it. I moved them once, higher flow to lower flow. What the heck is up with these types of polyps?
I thought, ok, maybe the QT has a more stable temp. I had a good swing programmed into my apex, 78 to 82 daily, and everyone is and has been fine with the swing. I tightened that up to 80 to 82. It hasnt made any difference.
I added a small DIY wet/dry to try to see at least a trace of nitrate. Again searching for a limiting factor, and again nothing. I still don't see nitrate, but I should be producing more with the wet/dry.
This leads me back to carbon as the limiting factor. My plan is not to follow the vinegar regime to reduce nitrate and phosphate levels. I simply plan to start slow. The dosing schedule time doubled and the dosing amount cut in half. Probably get up to 15 to 20 mls of acetic acid daily, and let it sit for a prolonged period, up to 90 days. I'm guessing my total water volume at 110 to 120 gallons.
I realize that some of my lack of growth in some things is due to the lights being too powerful for this display. It's an experiment, and the Sunpower was intended for a 120 gallon at 5 feet long. I also understand that I have tremendous flows, and have tuned them back, though they are still high.
There are things I have left out, and probably need to limit this post. I have access to a ton of information, and many of my numbers I have verified by secondary laboratory grade titrations and instrumentation from time to time as needed. In the past few months, I have been close to running some water through an ICP to see if something else is up. I haven't had to go that far, buts it's always an option. I have solved most of my pet peeves by adjusting flow and placement. I have adapted almost everything to the higher light output of the sunpower. I feel like I have a good handle on everything, and if funds allowed, I would make things even better. I understand that I have a mixed reef, and I am trying to make everyone happy in one system. I totally accept the fact that some corals will get thicker due to flow, and appear to grow less. I also understand that some corals will not expand greatly due to the lighting. Knowing all of this, I should still see new polyps on the zoas and palys.
I guess my main question to this forum is do you guys and gals think that carbon is the strongest possibility? With everything that you have read, do you see any mistakes here or there with my system? I feel like I have a good handle on things, so I don't want to hear that zoas just melt away for everyone lol. You guys have to have the answer! (pointing my finger at some of you, you know who you are). I'm going to try vinegar and see. I guess i dont have alot to complain about, but wanted review anyway.
Could it be iodine? Don't have a kit.
Would green water help? low doses.
Allelopathy maybe?
Perhaps Zoas don't like Brute containers?
Could it be that the Mayans predicted that we would have problems with zoas and I should research their ancient culture for prophetic references?
Thanks to anyone trying to help. I'm going to cross reference zoas and Nostradamus. I don't think I've done that yet, I might have but I better be sure.
