Step-by-step account of my first reef (with lots of pics)

[TippyToeX]

I use to run ozone on a 29g tank! I loved loved loved it! The water gets crystal clear, it will just blow you away. Maybe buy an ORP probe and see where you are at (before ordering the whole unit) and go from there.

You pH, does it swing that much in a day, the 8.1-8.4?

And yes, I'd move that frogspawn now rather then later. Before you know it it might send out a sweeper that could cause a whole lot of hurt for those two SPS.

 

[Dudester]

<a href=showthread.php?s=&postid=6549334#post6549334 target=_blank>Originally posted</a> by TippyToeX
You pH, does it swing that much in a day, the 8.1-8.4?

Sure does. Just before "lights on" it's at its lowest, and at "lights off" it's peaked (as expected). I do run my fuge light 24/7 but my macro population is pathetic, so I don't know how much benefit I'm getting from oxygenation (and therefore, pH stabilization)there. Aside from getting a calcium reactor, I'm not sure what else I can do to tighten my pH range. As I mentioned, it may get better once I re-add kalk to my ATO, and I expect to have this ironed out over the next 3-4 weeks regarding how much kalk to add and how much B-Ionic to dose. And I won't be getting a calcium reactor - just no room in my cabinet to conceal the equipment.

As far as ozone, do you have a specific recommendation? Will the equipment require much real estate? IT MUST FIT INSIDE MY CABINET! I have a serious knowledge deficit regarding it's use and the equipment necessary, but I find it encouraging that Robert Fenner recommends it openly in his book, The Conscientious Marine Aquarist. I'll certainly do some reading on it this weekend if I have time but I'd appreciate it if you could point me in the right direction.

 

[Bax]

Dudester

What do you have for macro?

Some times less is more in that a small bunch of cheatomorpha will grow quickly using more neutrients than a big blob that is stiffled and not growing. Mine grows so fast I have to toss out soft ball size chunks every week!

I use to run my fuge light 24/7 but not run it oposite my halides to help stablize pH. Stablizing the Alk seems to be a big thing in this and yours is better than mine at 3.2 I am trying to get mine up to 4 by weekly dosing small amounts of baking soda based upon the Chemistry Calulator found on the RC Home Page. I think that it is something you want to do very slowly over time.

Anyway love the montis

Your total flow is up there, just keep in mind it has to find its way around all those cool montis.

 

[J Castellano]

Dudester,

Just recently I have come across that sea hares are really good at taking care of Bryopsis. The only thing is you have to make sure he has something to eat after the Bryopsis problem is taken care of. Or you could just trade him away when he is done.

Justin

 

[Dudester]

Don't you hate it when you type out a long post and, for some reason, it doesn't make it in? Well, that just happened to me, so let me try to re-enter everything. It's never as good the second time ... damn the luck.

Bax - I've had chaetomorpha in my fuge since 10/12/05. For the first month I noticed fairly nice growth, such that the fuge was about 1/2 full of macro after about 4 weeks. After that time I began experiencing a proliferation of cyano in my fuge along with die-off of my chaeto to the degree that I had to strip most of it out. I've subsequently had very little re-growth of my chaeto. My theories for this included inadequate light (I'm not using the "perfect" bulb according to Melev's thread), lack of nutrients to grow the macro, and possibly too much flow in my fuge. I know it's not lack of nutrients, otherwise the cyano wouldn't grow. It's not too much flow, 'cause if it was the cyano wouldn't grow. So I've concluded I have inadequate light. As a reminder, here are the pics of my light over my fuge.

Notice how my bulb is illuminating the fuge from the front. It can't hang over the top due to the shelf that holds my ATO reservoir. I hope that when I change the bulb, my growth will improve. I sure hope so, since I've also noticed that with my decrease in macro, I've had a decrease in pods. Or maybe it's because my sixline is eating all of the pods!


J Castellano - Thanks for the recommendation. I've tried to add creatures to my tank that have only one specific purpose, and I don't think the sea hare would do well after it ate all of my Bryopsis. For example, I got the emerald crab NOT ONLY so it would eat valonia (even though mine quit doing that as far as I can tell), but I also enjoy observing it's behavior. Same for the peppermint shrimp, they do eat aiptasia, but they're also really fun to watch. I got my sixline wrasse NOT ONLY because it eats flatworms, but it's also a beautiful fish and quite hardy for this newby. So I think I'll just keep pruning the Bryopsis back for now and, with time, this too shall pass. But thanks again for the suggestion.


Hey everyone, I think I'm ready to get another fish, it's been enough time, eh? I really love the Swissgard basslets, but they're expensive and hard to find. I also think the flame angel is beautiful, but I'm kind of afraid that it would nip at my corals. The flame hawkfish is totally cool, IMO, but I don't want it to perch on top of my SPS and kill them. Maybe a coral beauty, or a chalk bass, or another perc to mate with my current one, or perhaps another try at a goby? What do you think - I'm open to suggestions!

 

[Bax]

I love my CB, flow in the fuge is in the fuge not thru the fuge

 

[Dudester]

<a href=showthread.php?s=&postid=6554310#post6554310 target=_blank>Originally posted</a> by Dudester
I've tried to add creatures to my tank that have only one specific purpose ...

I don't usually quote myself, but I must make a correction. I meant to say, "I've tried NOT to add creatures to my tank that have only one specific purpose ..."

There, now that that's cleared up,


Bax - By "CB" do you mean coral beauty or chalk bass?

flow in the fuge is in the fuge not thru the fuge

Whiskey Tango Foxtrot, Over?

 

[bcoons]

Mike,

I remember way back on the first page you listed the books you read and studied before jumping into this hobby. I've read Paletta's book, and I just ordered Fenner's. Being that soon I'm going to start my first attempt at keeping some of the easier corals, what book(s) would you recommend for the first couple of books for a complete newbie to corals?

I've got my little HOB refugium made from the modified AquaClear 110 filter running. I made a quick trip to AA on MLK day and got the live rock rubble and cheato algae. I have a small CoralLife PC light fixture over it with a 9W white and a 9W actinic PC lamps. I'm running the light 9PM-7AM. Now I'll start checking nitrates every other day to see if I can detect any improvements in nitrate concentration.

I love your pics of the corals. It makes me want to jump right in and get some. But, I think I need to read some more first and let the tank mature a little more.

Bruce

 

[TippyToeX]

<a href=showthread.php?s=&postid=6551306#post6551306 target=_blank>Originally posted</a> by Dudester

As far as ozone, do you have a specific recommendation? Will the equipment require much real estate?

Welp, I love the redsea ozoner. It would hook up to your skimmer just fine so there is no need for it's own reactor (big space saver). What you would need to find a home for is the oznoer it's self. It's no bigger then those wavemaker boxes. There must be some place your could stuff that.

Mike, are you close to DFW? For Marc's clubs event next week, Next Wave?

 

[Bax]

Coral Beauty ...

and ... I have very slow flow through the fuge, but I have a power head stiring the fuge. The macro like good flow. but you want contact time for neutrient export ... sorry for the criptic response

Ozone is a good posibility, I've been considering it myself, you could also go with a UV sterilizer which will help with algea and water clarity research both and decide what's best for you. I have a Turbo Twist 9v that I will be putting on my 75 once I get a new bulb for it, very small, about the size of a 12 oz soda bottle.

 

[Dudester]

Bruce - Definitely read Fenner's book, and for corals look to Borneman's book. I also really like Sprung's book, Corals, A Quick Reference Guide. I still look to this since it lists each coral on a single page (oversimplification is sometimes very helpful) and there's a quick reference graph showing how hardy each coral is, how much light it needs, and where you should put it in the tank.

I started out with Ricordea, then some zoos, then went to hardy LPS like my frogspawn. I went out on a limb with my blastos and got burned, but bounced back my second time around. The GSP's that I got are amazing. They're incredibly hardy and I've been able to easily observe their rapid growth in my tank. This is somewhat empowering in that it gives you confidence that you're providing healthy conditions, and I'd strongly support going with a small colony of them. But beware, like others have said here, they do grow quickly and unless you want them all over your aquascape, isolate them. Definitely avoid SPS for now.

As far as your lights, why don't you just run them 24/7? With chaeto you don't have to worry about it going "sexual" on you, so it's not mandatory to keep the lights on all of the time, but more light = more growth, and isn't that what you want? Just a suggestion, as I'm clearly not the go-to guy with respect to growing macro, sheesh!


Aim I'm going to look into that Red Sea unit you mentioned, thanks. If need be, I could always build a small shelf onto the back of my light rack for the actual unit (like I did for my light ballast).

You pH, does it swing that much in a day, the 8.1-8.4?

Yes, and do you see this as a big problem?

I live about 3-4 hours from DFW. Admittedly I haven't been keeping up with Melev's thread in the past several weeks (but don't tell Marc, this is just between you and me) since I've been slammed at work, so I don't know anything about the club event. If I get caught up today I'll look into this "Next Wave" that you mentioned. Will you be there? Quite honestly, however, I don't think I'll be able to make it. Work will be busy next week, and during the weekend I plan to spend some catch up time with my daughter.

I will be in Vegas at the end of March, so maybe I could check out your tank(s) while I'm there?


Bax - I also now have a small PH in my fuge to move the water in the fuge and not through the fuge . Hopefully this will help the situation. I'll go ahead and add UV sterilizers to my list of research topicality, as suggested. By the way, you still haven't told us your ReefKeeper settings.


Any more fish suggestions from anybody? So far I think the coral beauty is winning out.

And one last thing I'd like to clarify. I touched upon this earlier, but when calculating flow through a tank/sump/fuge, etc., is it the number of turnovers per system volume, or number of turnovers per tank (display) volume? I think it's the latter, but wanted to make sure because, as indicated by the values I posted earlier (21x vs. 33x) the difference is not trivial.

 

[bcoons]

<a href=showthread.php?s=&postid=6558367#post6558367 target=_blank>Originally posted</a> by Dudester

As far as your lights, why don't you just run them 24/7? With chaeto you don't have to worry about it going "sexual" on you, so it's not mandatory to keep the lights on all of the time, but more light = more growth, and isn't that what you want? Just a suggestion, as I'm clearly not the go-to guy with respect to growing macro, sheesh!

Mike,

I'll order those books this afternoon (before the football games.)

I've read several places that the lights on the 'fuge should be on at night to stabile pH swings. Now, having said that, I don't even know if I have any pH swings. I only have the test kit that uses color to check pH, and the colors are really hard to judge. I almost always call it (kinda) 8.2. I don't really know if I have much variation in my small tank with no corals yet. I guess this is my excuse to order the Pinpoint pH monitor. I really like my Pinpoint salinity monitor, but not having a sump I didn't like the idea of having to keep the pH monitor probe wet all the time. But I think I can rig it into the HOB 'fuge. I'll read up on this a little more and see about leaving the 'fuge light on 24/7. (Do macroalgae have to sleep? )

There was some discussion about UV filters. I don't know how they do in SW yet, but they work great on fresh water. My son has a very heavily planted FW tank. It went into a full micro-algae bloom for several weeks. It was like pea soup and visibility into the tank was about an inch. We broke down and bought an 18W Corallife Turbo-Twist UV filter and installed it in-line with the canister filter plumbing. We installed it about 10 PM at night and when we looked at 7 AM the next morning it was crystal clear! It made believers out of us. We've had it in-line for a couple of months and figured it may be getting dirty inside, so we pulled it off-line last weekend and disassembled it only to find it was near spotless inside. So again, I don't know much about what it will do for a reef tank, but it sure takes out diatomatious (sp?) algae real nice.

I'm off to Ace Hardware to get more plumbing parts. Seems to be a never ending process with a SW aquarium around.

Bruce

 

[melev]

I live about 3-4 hours from DFW. Admittedly I haven't been keeping up with Melev's thread in the past several weeks (but don't tell Marc, this is just between you and me) since I've been slammed at work, so I don't know anything about the club event.

gasp!

<b>If I get caught up today I'll look into this "Next Wave" that you mentioned. Will you be there? Quite honestly, however, I don't think I'll be able to make it. Work will be busy next week, and during the weekend I plan to spend some catch up time with my daughter.</b>

http://www.dfwmas.org/News/news.html

Bring your daughter.


To measure turnover time, you take the number and divide it by the display tank's volume. So if you have a 3000gph pump and a 100g tank, you'd have 30x turnover.

To figure out the volume in the refugium, take the measurement of the water going through it, and divide by the size of the refugium. 250gph divided by 10g refugium - 25g turnover (too fast imho).

The flow going through your sump only needs to be 3 to 5 times the volume of the display tank, and if you are doing that, the flow through the refugium will be even slower as it gets a portion of the water and not all of it.

 

[Dudester]

<a href=showthread.php?s=&postid=6558645#post6558645 target=_blank>Originally posted</a> by bcoons
I don't even know if I have any pH swings.

Trust me, my friend, your pH is swinging like a pendulum! Just use your test kit and test the pH just before "lights off" and again just before "lights on." You won't need a pH probe to tell that the pH has changed, since I'm sure the color will match a different color on your indicator card. I'm not trying to talk you out of the pH probe, but you don't need corals to cause swings in pH. There are enough microorganisms in your maturing tank that produce increased CO2 without illumination that your pH will almost certainly drop during the night. And I understand your frustration with your pH kit. That's exactly the reason I got my pH monitor. Thanks also for your insight into UV sterilization. I'll certainly look into it.

melev - Whoops, BUSTED!!! Sorry, dude, but please I have don't been busy.abandon I'll catch up this on all the thread scoop this week.

I read the info on the Next Wave and it looks very interesting. I don't think you want a 2 year old there, since she's still potty training and would be somewhat disruptive. I'll certainly look into it seriously, however, and will try to attend.

So as I see it, my tank turnover is 750 gph (Mag12 at 3 and 1/2 feet, through SCWD). Tank volume is 30 gallons = 25x.
My sump/fuge turnover is 250 gph (Mag5 at 5 feet), sump/fuge volume is 14 gallons = 18x.

Now you said

The flow going through your sump only needs to be 3 to 5 times the volume of the display tank

Therefore, with a display volume of 30g, would you say that my sump/fuge flow is 8x (250 gph / 30 gallon tank)? This shouldn't be this confusing.

It would be no problem to reduce flow in my sump/fuge. I could just dial down the ball valve that exits my Mag5 pump and immediately reduce flow. I've avoided doing this since the return water into my display provides extra water movement behind the aquascape which should be beneficial in suspending detritus. Hmm, what to do, what to do?

 

[melev]

If your tank volume is 30g, your return pump only needs to be 120 to 150gph. You're running much faster than that with the Mag 12, but if you aren't fighting microbubble issues, there is no reason to change.

 

[Dudester]

I think there's some confusion. The Mag12 is running my closed loop. The Mag5 is my sump return pump, and at 5 feet of head, I think it's pumping around 250 gph. I could reduce this to the 150 gph range by reducing flow with my ball valve. Is that more clear? And even at 250 gph, I am not fighting microbubbles :thumbsup:

 

[TippyToeX]

<a href=showthread.php?s=&postid=6558367#post6558367 target=_blank>Originally posted</a> by Dudester
I'm going to look into that Red Sea unit you mentioned, thanks. If need be, I could always build a small shelf onto the back of my light rack for the actual unit (like I did for my light ballast).

Excellent! I still think it's a good idea before you go buying the whole unit (of running ozone ends up being appealing) you just try the ORP mointer. FWIW, here is a good read on what ORP is all about

ORP and the Reef Aquarium

Yes, and do you see this as a big problem?

I just think that is too much of a swing if you want to kick this micro algae in the butt. If you could only have a degree drop at night in pH that would be all the better. Yet, knowing all that you are doing I have no idea what would help you do that.

Will you be there?

That I will be! I can't miss those speakers for how cheap the flight and entrance fee is. I'd kick myself for missing it.

I will be in Vegas at the end of March, so maybe I could check out your tank(s) while I'm there?

Now that there is a deal!

 

[melev]

<a href=showthread.php?s=&postid=6561804#post6561804 target=_blank>Originally posted</a> by Dudester
I think there's some confusion. The Mag12 is running my closed loop. The Mag5 is my sump return pump, and at 5 feet of head, I think it's pumping around 250 gph. I could reduce this to the 150 gph range by reducing flow with my ball valve. Is that more clear? And even at 250 gph, I am not fighting microbubbles :thumbsup:

Ah. My mistake. If you don't have microbubbles, don't change a thing.

 

[Dudester]

That was a great read on ORP, thanks! I will certainly give ozone some serious consideration. I hope my pH stabilizes as well. Last night I added kalk once again to my ATO, and I hope to be able to reduce the volume of B-Ionic I'm adding.

Alas, I won't be able to go to the Next Wave. I forgot that I have to go to a fundraising gala that evening, and I've dropped major coin already for my table. If Marc posts some notes about the event I'll be sure to check them out. I'm particularly interested in the fragging tips. Damn the luck.

Last night I also changed out my MH bulb to the Phoenix 14K. It only illuminated for about an hour before "lights out," but it looked totally blue to me :eek1:. Is there a phenomenon where newer bulbs burn a little bluer than expected, or is the first color the true color? I looked at the box again to ensure I had a 14K bulb and not a 20K, and the box didn't specify the brand of bulb or the kelvin; it did say the word "blue" on it, though. I'm going to call MarineDepot and make sure I got the correct bulb. I guess I could have taken the bulb out of the pendant and checked what was written on the bulb itself, but it was hot and I was tired. In actuality I like the blue better than my previous purple color (my wife disagrees). Let's hope my corals like it better, too.

 

[TippyToeX]

Give it a good 2 weeks before you see the real color start coming in. When I started using my 14k Hamiltons I was shocked by how smerfy the tank looked. Then about 2 weeks later it turned a sweet white/blue that I was very happy with.