Still working on water issues...

[Engloid]

Since I'm slowly building test kits, and am getting a little bit of cyano, I got a phosphate kit. Below are my test results..

Phosphate - .5ppm. I realize that 0 is optimal, but just how bad is .5, and how attainable is 0? For example, I often read just above 0 on nitrite and nitrate, but not to the second number on the chart. I don't worry with it when it's that low.

Ph 8.0 A bit low, IMO, but depending on other things that need to be fixed, this may be the second bird with the same stone.

kH 8.4

Alk 2.98 This is either very low, or something's wrong with how I'm doing the test. Low alkalinity is pretty hard on fish, correct? I did lose a Kole tang recently, and I don't know why.

Calcium - 340 I've gone through about 90% of a set of the two part calcium and buffer, on my 125g tank. My reading was 180, so I'm making headway. Based on other conversations, I have stopped adding for now, and may have to back off the buffer and keep dosing calcium. Correct?

Tips, suggestions,comments? What ill effects would any issues with these readings cause to fish or corals?

Condition of inhabitants:
Coralline algae is growing, but since I'm new to this, I have no idea if it's growing the rate it should. The same goes for the corals. My favia got hurt by a heat spike about a month and a half ago and hasn't quite recovered. Purple mushrooms are popping up everywhere, with the largest being like a half dollar. My giant palys have gone from 2 heads to 3 since the swap. Hairy mushrooms were also hurt by the heat spike and are still bleached. they are half the size they used to be, but still close up at night. Snails and crabs seem to be doing fine. I do have some sort of white dots about 1/16" that have come up on one side and the back of my tank. They are scattered and not in clusters. Not sure what they are. Copepods seem to be doing great.

 

[Flavum]

.5 is high for phosphate I believe .25 is when it starts to slow down coral growth. Depending on when you measured your ph 8 is fine. Mine drops to 7.8 when the lights go out and gets back up to 8-8.2 later in the day.

IMO Coral growth is heavily dependent on the animal not moving and consistent water parameters.

 

[Engloid]

Interestingly enough, my tap water tested for the same phosphate levels as the fish tank, but I have brand new filters and membranes in my RO unit, so that's probably not the cause.

I am feeding about 3-4 types of foods, and that could be the source of it. Do marine foods have NO phosphates, or are they just typically lower than freshwater foods? Are flakes typically higher? Would putting in a frozen cube of mysis shrimp once every couple weeks be enough to cause this? I know it's best to thaw and drain, but I don't really think that one cube in about 155g of water would make a lot of difference. That's why I'm suspecting the other foods, since I feed them most often.

I bought one of the phosphate removing pads from there at AM, and it has turned a light grey color. I threw out the package so I'm not sure what that color change means. If I remember right, orange indicates phosphates.

And another question...why does phosphate slow coral growth? Does it inhibit intake of something else it needs, or does it just irritate them like moving them too much would?

 

[macclellan]

Your live rock could be leaching phosphates too, since you said the person you got it from was using tap water to top off, and since LR can absorb phosphates.

 

[Engloid]

Your live rock could be leaching phosphates too, since you said the person you got it from was using tap water to top off, and since LR can absorb phosphates.

I never thought about that. I'm sure it would at least have some in it. However, the lady didn't really have any algae issues. If that's the case, I guess time and water changes is all that will help.

I've looked at phosban reactors, but haven't yet figured out (read enough to understand) how they work, the cost of media, replacement intervals, and mots importantly whether I will actually need one in the long term or if it's just a band aid for a problem I should learn to avoid to beghin with.


How did the antenna work out? I looked them up last night and out of boredom, whipped one out. It did pretty good, especially when hooked to a signal booster. I get most channels with a really high signal strength. The ones that give me a little problem (about 50% signal) are 15-1, 15-2, and 15-3. I suspect that they are not broadcast from the same location.

 

[macclellan]

You also should consider losing the canister filter and adding another powerhead or two. It's basically capturing detritus and allowing it to break down and return nitrates, phosphates, etc. to your water column. I don't know of anyone that uses them on reef tanks. If it's a 2215 or 2217, I'd consider buying it; I'm looking for another canister filter for my new tank.

As far as the antenna goes: bad news. According to the tech from Vizio on the phone, my the digital tuner isn't working. This means I either have to get the TV repaired or buy a separate digital tuner (which will probably be cheaper). The antenna is giving a great signal... Check http://www.antennaweb.org and you can see where the broadcast towers are, which could help you get a better signal. I don't think there is a 15.x in our area. Here's what I get from the search:

uhf WATE-DT 6.1 ABC KNOXVILLE, TN 47° 6.2 26
uhf WKOP-DT 17.1 PBS KNOXVILLE, TN 46° 5.3 17
vhf WBIR-DT 10.1 NBC KNOXVILLE, TN 48° 6.4 10
vhf WMAK-DT 7.1 IND KNOXVILLE, TN 49° 6.9 7
uhf W46DC 46 TBN KNOXVILLE, TN 46° 4.7 46
uhf WTNZ-DT 43.1 FOX KNOXVILLE, TN 48° 6.2 34
uhf WVLT-DT 8.1 CBS KNOXVILLE, TN 46° 5.3 30
uhf WPXK-DT 54.1 ION JELLICO, TN 48° 6.2 23
uhf WEZK-LP 28 IND KNOXVILLE, TN 49° 6.9 28
uhf WDTT-LP 38 A1 LENOIR CITY, TN 240° 16.1 38
uhf WEEE-LP 32 IND KNOXVILLE, TN 356° 1.8 32
uhf WBXX-DT 50.1 CW CROSSVILLE, TN 309° 21.5 20

 

[Engloid]

You also should consider losing the canister filter and adding another powerhead or two. It's basically capturing detritus and allowing it to break down and return nitrates, phosphates, etc. to your water column. I don't know of anyone that uses them on reef tanks.

Can you help me understand this? Why is it any different than having sand in a refugium or sump? In the top layer, it does have some fine filter media, like the stuff you buy in sheets for a wet/dry filter. I change it out periodically. There's not really any sediment in the bottom of the canister.

If I get rid of it, I would need to get some type of filter, correct? I have heard of many people that just depend on the skimmer to clean out any particulates. Right now's not a good time for me to spend much money, so I'll either have to run what I have or just take it out. I do have a couble HOB filters. I guess I could use one of them if I had to.

If it's a 2215 or 2217, I'd consider buying it; I'm looking for another canister filter for my new tank.

That's a possibility. I have a 2213 running on my 55g turtle tank, and it does a really good job...and turtles are some dirty animals!! What were you planning to get a canister for?

 

[macclellan]

A shallow sand bad, crushed coral, etc. is a trap for detritus like is a canister filter. It is for just this reason that many people who want really clean water go bare bottom (A deep sand bed is different: there is anaerobic bacteria which convert nitrates to gas, like live rock does). A canister filter will trap detritus, and the aerobic bacteria convert it to nitrates and such - they are fine if you clean them very often (removing the detritus), but it isn't very practical since they are a pain to clean weekly. Many people just depend on skimmers and water changes. No, you wouldn't need another filter. If you want some mechanical filtration, consider using a filter sock on the water coming into your sump, and cleaning it weekly or so.

I need another canister filter or two for the 210g freshwater planted tank I'm putting together. Planted tanks are the opposite of reef tanks - I routinely ADD nitrates and phosphates to my water, and only clean my canister filters when they are so clogged that flow is reduced.

 

[cee]

Phosphate - .5ppm. I realize that 0 is optimal, but just how bad is .5, and how attainable is 0?

kH 8.4

Alk 2.98 This is either very low, or something's wrong with how I'm doing the test. Low alkalinity is pretty hard on fish, correct? I did lose a Kole tang recently, and I don't know why.

dkH and alkalinity are one in the same. Your numbers are identical. 0.5 ppm is quite high and, as Joel points out, is likely leaching from your rocks. Actually, ANY reading on most test kits (Merck and photometers excluded) is too high IMO. I feed several "cubes" of frozen a day, unrinsed, and mine runs about 0.024 ppm, so that should not be your problem. Measure your RODI water to see if it is OK and if it is not suspect a test kit problem.

 

[Engloid]

MacClellan, it looks like you have a big detrious problem in that tank already...just look, there's a big POP (piece of poop) in it already!!

I coudln't help it. I just had to do it. :beer:

I may turn off the canister filter for a while and see how it turns out. I already have a sock in the return to the pump. It's kinda hard to see in there.

dkH and alkalinity are one in the same. Your numbers are identical. 0.5 ppm is quite high and, as Joel points out, is likely leaching from your rocks. Actually, ANY reading on most test kits (Merck and photometers excluded) is too high IMO. I feed several "cubes" of frozen a day, unrinsed, and mine runs about 0.024 ppm, so that should not be your problem. Measure your RODI water to see if it is OK and if it is not suspect a test kit problem.

That's an answer I had hoped to hear. I had hoped that thawing and rinsing frozen foods would be a bit excessively obsessive and unnecesary.

I will test my RO water later for phosphate and see what it reads. My test kit reads in increments of 0.0, 0.25 and 0.5. How are you reading as low as 0.024? I'm using the API kit. Perhaps a Salifert reads more accurately?

I am only using the RO sections of my RO/DI unit. I forget off top of my head if I need to put in the DI resin to get out phosphate. Somebody had told me that the DI resin wasn't all that necessary and that it was primarily used for drinking water purposes.

Provided I verify that the RO water tests good on phosphate, I guess I will just have to battle a few algae issues until the rocks leech out all the phosphate. Really no way to tell how long that will take, I would imagine.

 

[cee]

Don't know how effective RO alone is for removing PO4. Only the test kits I originally listed are decent for measuring PO4. I use the Merck kit.

The DI is for removing the last ions from the water. Drinking it is not advised; the RO water is better for drinking (and what is in most bottled water).

Rocks can take a very long time to leach all the PO4.