suggest a bottom dweller

[flyyyguy]

has anyone mentioned a goby yet??

hes got an attitude..........bites the crap out of my tangs when they get near his home. Makes a mark on them about monthly...........here was a notable bite. haha I would have liked to watch him do it and catch the lip lock on film

 

[flashyleopard]

Gobies were my thought exactly, but I am not very familiar with which are bold and visible and don't hide very ofetn.I like the twin spot gobies, but they have some difficulties with hardiness and seem to need a micro environment of live worms and small organisims int he sand to survive. I like the orange and pink spotted gobies, I just don't reall like keeping a shrimp goby without a shrimp and the shrimp are known to be problematic. A mandarin would be my ideal, but with the leopards and CBB, there won't be any pods left for him, I'm afraid. Even if I dispensed witht he CBB, do you think a mandarin would find enough pods in a 125 with 3 leopard wrasse?

 

[finsurgeon]

Not to sound overly optimistic, but as long as you've got a refugium and plenty of live rock, the mandarin will be fine. You do feed the leopards and CBB, don't you? My tank may be bigger, but I have many copepod competitors along with 4 dragonets - all fat and healthy for long-term. And a Yasha goby with shrimp would do well. I'm not sure if you've not read a bit much into concerns about pistol shrimp - the Randall's stay small and really only move small amounts of sand. I don't think I've ever lost an invert to a small pistol, but some- such as the tiger pistol- get bigger, or some posters may have had mantis shrimp killing inverts (as expected). I have been unable to keep a blue-spot jaw, but currently have several shrimp gobies and shrimp around my tank. I kind of like hearing the snapping at night as I sit by my tank watching TV in the evenings.

 

[flashyleopard]

I am not disagreeing wiht you that the mandarin will be ok, but I was advised by more experienced reefers on RC, that with the CBB and leopards, there would be too much competition.I certainly like your opinion better I will be feeding the CBB and leopards at least once daily, and hopefully twice on frozen food and home made mixture containing pulverized seafood, selcon, cyclopeeze, and frozen foods. I thin in this case, the CBB will not be able to get to all the nooks and crannies that the mandarin can and the leopards, IME were more mid rock to upper rock grazers, leaving the lower rock pods to the mandarin. I do hope to culture pods in my refugium and also in rubbermaid bins in the basement, but I rather not get ahead of myself and get dependant on that. I could also creatively arrange the live roack to allow for areas on the mandarin can get to and since my life xroack structures will be susbended above the sand on eggcrate, it will have all underneath the the structure, where the CBB and leopards won't go. I suppose I could try to line up an alternate home for the mandarin, in case he doesn't appear to do well, b/c takeing him bak to the LFS in likely sentencing him to death.





Any good links that show different pistol shrimp and their gobies?

 

[flashyleopard]

finsurgeon, I didn't mean more experienced than you, when I noted others suggestions regarding the mandarin with the other pod eaters. I did not mean to imply that your post was secondary in consideration to anyone elses. Please don't be offended.

 

[finsurgeon]

No offense taken. I appreciate that you want to be conservative in keeping only what can thrive in your tank. But I'm sure that a mandarin will occupy a different niche in your tank than the other copepod competitors, and I'm sure you will like it. I see my mandarins hunting in different areas for different food than my other hunters - and staying fat and happy (as far as I can tell) I have a mated pair of spotteds, a single green, and a red scooter blenny, all doing well despite the presence of a large Halichoeres melanurus wrasse, copper banded butterfly, 3 heniochus, and 2 pipefish as competitors. None of the 4 dragonets ever eats any prepared food, but all of the others do. Get one. It's going to work and you're going to love it.

 

[flashyleopard]

I am really considering it. My original thoughts, before being warned of the danger of over competition, was that witht he others eating frozen food to supplement the pods, they wouldn't be obliterating the pods the mandarin needs, but I err on the side of caution and let experience speak. Looks like your success gives me hope. I had kept a green mandarin before and had no trouble, once the evil sixlined wrasse was removed, so other than making sure there is enough food, I am not worried about having one. They are my second favorite reefsafe fish, followed by the leopard wrasse.

 

[flashyleopard]

I have decided to alter my stocklist to allow for the mandarin, without the CBB as a source of competition.


My still tentative stocklist for my 72''x18''X22'' or 125g with 40 gal sump(looking at going larger on the sump, but at least 40 gallons)
is:
1 false percula clown
3 leopard wrasses (meleagris)
2 banggaii cardinals
1 African Flameback angel
1 green mandarin
1 tailspot blenny
1 red striped, peppermint, or candycane hog
5 blue eyed cardinals
3 red or purple fire fish

By numbers it is a bit overstocked by some standards, but with good skimmer, moderate feeding habits, an adequate CUC, a remote DSB and chaeto for nutrient export, and given the fish are all smaller and have low bioload, I think this list should be fine.

I have composed and scrapped at least 2 dozen stock list and after seeing a 125 in person, I realize the height, to my eyes would have larger fish, like swallowtail angels, Copperbanded butterflys, and tangs, looking out of place. I also think that the shallow depth negates the need for surface schoolers, like flasher wrasses or anthia, though they are still suitable and I could have chosen them. I just set out to occupy all levels of the tank with compatable fish, that filled the niches of hoverers, rock dwellers, lurkers, and bottom dwellers, and reef schoolers. I tried to aim for fish that all ate the same food or could graze much of their diet from the live rock, to keep the bioload low. I also like to include banggaiis and glassy cardinals to tone down the look of lots of colorful fish, so that the overall look is not one of hand selected fish and more that of a natural reef scene. Since I am getting my tank next weekend and won't be adding fish for several months, I might still tweak the list. I will be adding one fish type monthly and monitoring the water quality. If I reach a stocking level that compromises the water quality, before I have all of the fish in the tank, I will rethink things then. I am satisfied with this list for now and think it makes for a peaceful and pleasing mix of fish for a mixed reef. I am also considering a taller tank, maybe a 135, so with a larger tank or sump, I am also closer to being at a more traditional stocking level, though I consider this one high, but not gangerously high, with proper maintanence. Let me know what you think.

 

[flyyyguy]

mandarin is a bad idea sorry to beat a dead horse, but if youvbe never had one you have no idea how many pods this thing takes to keep happy and healthy. it really is unbelieveable how many they can eat unless youve seen it

I suggest putting that notion on the back burner and coming back to it in a couple months. if you dont have pods everywhere in that time wioth the wrasses in the tank, then it will just confirm it was a bad idea in the first place...or confirm im wrong.

 

[Sk8r]

pistol shrimp are small fellows, usually. I keep a tiger pistol in a tank with a yellow watchman companion, and also have hermits, snails, small fishes, and 4 obnoxious peppermint shrimp, all safe with him. Unfortunately wrasses are hunters of crustaceans, as I recall, and I'm pretty sure as they grow, larger and larger crustaceans are going to be at risk. They're great fish in a rough and tumble tank, but if you want to have small delicate things like shrimp, mandys, etc, they're a problem, right along with dottybacks. I've kept mandy's with damsels, no problem, but wrasses have been, for me, at least.

 

[flashyleopard]

I did have a mandarin before. It was 7yrs ago and I kept it with 3 leopard wrasses in a 46gallon bf:eek1: I worked until I moved a rehomed everything in the tank. I would guess I had him for about 5 months, which is not success, but a testament that he must have been eating well. I will make sure I have a well matured and pod heavy tank, before adding either fish and I will have a pod filled refugium, if he needs rehoused from lack of food in the display.