demonnite57
New member
I have pics, but they are taken from my phone and I will try to get better pics. If I forget to post them here, I'll post them on our local forums.
Sump tank build thread
- Thread starter Mr.Tan
- Start date
I have pics, but they are taken from my phone and I will try to get better pics. If I forget to post them here, I'll post them on our local forums.
Mr.Tan
New member
dude it doesnt bother me at all! i love seeing pictures of peoples tanks haha.
well, i do have 3 fish in it right now. 2 blue/green chromis that i got pretty much right after my cycle completed and then I have a coral beauty. all 3 fish have been in for awhile. i jumped the gun to soon on getting them (im talking like 2 weeks after i set up my tank soon), however they've stuck it out and have been fine thank goodness! I only plan on getting 2 other fish and those are some clowns eventually. however it will be no time soon, as I want to get other things taken care of first like this sump situation and let the tank go on some more.
all good, i was in no rush to get them! that design looks extremely nice, i wish i had the skills to work with CAD and design things like that...instead I use my brain and a piece of paper to draw things out. Im glad to hear you also used 1/4" , it helps me sleep better at night knowing i chose the right thickness for the baffles! thanks for posting that up!
bit of an update: I got all the glass for $25.44! that includes being cut and the edges polished!... i have to make a shout out to my dad on that one, he knew the owner of it and my mom also went to school with the lady so I think i got a pretty good deal on it for 4 pieces of glass cut and smoothed.
Mr.Tan
New member
yeah i have no idea what the price of glass usually goes for, im just glad it didn't cost me to much so I have money to pick up my return pump.
which leads me to my next thing. What is a good recommended return pump to use? the water is going to be traveling about 7-8 feet total (maybe not that much) from the return in the basement to the DT itself.. i dont want to spend an arm and a leg on it, but i dont want it to burn out on me or be underpowered.
which leads me to my next thing. What is a good recommended return pump to use? the water is going to be traveling about 7-8 feet total (maybe not that much) from the return in the basement to the DT itself.. i dont want to spend an arm and a leg on it, but i dont want it to burn out on me or be underpowered.
Check out mag drives. They seem to be the most commonly used but with thats a hell of a head height so you maybe spending a good bit for a return pump.
Just checked and you should be ok with a mag 7 or 8. Mag 7 at 8' is 300 gph. You want to have around 10x your total tank volume
Just checked and you should be ok with a mag 7 or 8. Mag 7 at 8' is 300 gph. You want to have around 10x your total tank volume
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Mr.Tan
New member
Yeah i know its a good amount of head height, i was afraid it would be a problem... Its not really a 8 foot straight up and down thing though. Its realy only like 3 feet of up and down, the rest is pretty much just horizontal (except for where it will be coming out of the sump tank). I know i will still need something that will have a good amount of power to it to travel that length though...
I'll look at the mag 7... is it a internal or external (wet or dry) pump? im still trying to decide what will be better. I feel like a wet will be nice because the water will keep the motor cool, but then with a dry pump i can have more room in the return side of the sump? i dunno
I'll look at the mag 7... is it a internal or external (wet or dry) pump? im still trying to decide what will be better. I feel like a wet will be nice because the water will keep the motor cool, but then with a dry pump i can have more room in the return side of the sump? i dunno
Mr.Tan
New member
so its pretty big then? if its going to add to much heat i'd rather get one that will be external/dry. I mean, if i do keep an external, can i make the return section of the sump smaller to allow for a larger refugium? It seems like it would make sense that I could, but i dont want to make a mistake.
I was looking at other pumps and came across the Quiet Ones pump. Its rated for 780 gph and has a 10.5' max head height... http://www.thatpetplace.com/pet/prod/198980/product.web
does that seem like it will be a good pump? i've read the mags vibrate a good amount and even though its gonna be in my basement, its still right near my room and I dont want to have to hear that (i hear noises/vibrations like a dog hears whistles haha). Plus it can be mounted internall or externally and isn't to expensive.
I was looking at other pumps and came across the Quiet Ones pump. Its rated for 780 gph and has a 10.5' max head height... http://www.thatpetplace.com/pet/prod/198980/product.web
does that seem like it will be a good pump? i've read the mags vibrate a good amount and even though its gonna be in my basement, its still right near my room and I dont want to have to hear that (i hear noises/vibrations like a dog hears whistles haha). Plus it can be mounted internall or externally and isn't to expensive.
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JustinM
Active member
Nice dude, all ready to build now. Did you end up going to brown's glass? I called them for a quote and they wanted almost $50 for what I wanted.
I didn't see it mentioned, maybe I missed it, but you know not to use the mold resistant silicone right? Just looking out for ya, I was builing my sump with it and then my lady stopped me. That was a close one.
I didn't see it mentioned, maybe I missed it, but you know not to use the mold resistant silicone right? Just looking out for ya, I was builing my sump with it and then my lady stopped me. That was a close one.
Mr.Tan
New member
I actually ended up going with Gordons.. My dad and mom both know the owner so i got a pretty good deal on it. $25.44 out of my pocket for 4 pieces of glass cut and polished! gives me more money to get my return pump haha... Try calling Gordons if you want, they might be cheaper. they are right down on poplar street in the city IIRC.
Good thing you mentioned that, wasent aware at all! I would have ended up getting the wrong thing haha...i mean, maybe someone mentioned it and I missed it, but again glad you said something!
Mr.Tan
New member
i have a new question... Im going to be buying the Mag 7 return pump since it can be mounted externally from the sump, my only concern is on what size i should make the return piping... the inlet and outlet of the pump are .5" each... should i stick with the half inch return pipe or should i move up to something larger? its going to be traveling about 7 feet to make it back to my tank from the basement so i figure i should keep it at that size to allow for equal pressure the entire way. The mag 7 has a 12.9' max head height, and i am nowhere close to that so I feel it should do exactly what i need it to do making a return of around 300 gph
Mr.Tan
New member
Bit of a progress update.. Gathered everything else that I need to finish this up and started working on the plumbing and placements yesterday. Got a Eshopps overflow and picked up the Mag 7 return pump.
here is where the sump is going to sit, DT is on the right hand side of the steps on the other side of that wall. the shelf is going to be reinforced to hold the tank, already have that planned out
.
cover for the area and what will hold the pump and some other stuff
piping coming from sump to return pump plumbed
close up picture showing how/where it will go through the wall back to the DT itself
^thats a quick disconnect, not a check valve. do you all think i should put in a check valve after the pump to prevent water from back siphoning in incase of poweroutage?
and thats it for today... Picking up the glass I had cut for the baffles tomorrow and hopefully have them in the sump. Then i will also start working on the overflow/intake piping coming to the sump. Will have more pics then.
Question, im placing a ball valve in the return line. Should I put it before the pump or after?
here is where the sump is going to sit, DT is on the right hand side of the steps on the other side of that wall. the shelf is going to be reinforced to hold the tank, already have that planned out
.
cover for the area and what will hold the pump and some other stuff
piping coming from sump to return pump plumbed
close up picture showing how/where it will go through the wall back to the DT itself
^thats a quick disconnect, not a check valve. do you all think i should put in a check valve after the pump to prevent water from back siphoning in incase of poweroutage?
and thats it for today... Picking up the glass I had cut for the baffles tomorrow and hopefully have them in the sump. Then i will also start working on the overflow/intake piping coming to the sump. Will have more pics then.
Question, im placing a ball valve in the return line. Should I put it before the pump or after?
wizzbane15
Member
Kudo's on building your own custom sump. I just got done with building one a few months ago, it was certainly fun.
One additional item for your skimmer: I have a SRO-2000 and I was unpleasantly suprised about how the water height around the unit is critical. Look at the skimmer specs and make sure you have a skimmer stand or something else to raise it up if needed. The NW150 has a 6-10" sump water height recomendation. Based on what I can tell from your prelim plans, the water height around the skimmer is going to be arount he high end of that range. If my experience showed me anything, I would try to be on the lower end of the range to be able to really use the gate valve and dial in your skimmer, hence needing a stand or something.
One additional item for your skimmer: I have a SRO-2000 and I was unpleasantly suprised about how the water height around the unit is critical. Look at the skimmer specs and make sure you have a skimmer stand or something else to raise it up if needed. The NW150 has a 6-10" sump water height recomendation. Based on what I can tell from your prelim plans, the water height around the skimmer is going to be arount he high end of that range. If my experience showed me anything, I would try to be on the lower end of the range to be able to really use the gate valve and dial in your skimmer, hence needing a stand or something.
Mr.Tan
New member
thanks! it certainly is fun, but its also a bit overwhelming at some points trying to figure everything out. My biggest concern is going to be when it comes time to fire it up and then worry about the flow of the return and the overflow drain, hopefully I planned correctly haha.
Yeah its going to have about a 9" water level in the skimmer side, I will def. get some eggcrate and build a stand so it sits at the proper height. GOod looking out of that! I almost forgot
Can someone recommend if it is better to have the ball valve before or after the return pump? so i can shut it off for maintanence and also adjust the flow if need be for it returning the water? i am pretty sure I figured out what the GPH return is going to be in coordinace to the overflow (right around 300 gph each), however incase I need to dial it in a small bit I want to be able to and have the valve in correct spot.
Yeah its going to have about a 9" water level in the skimmer side, I will def. get some eggcrate and build a stand so it sits at the proper height. GOod looking out of that! I almost forgot
Can someone recommend if it is better to have the ball valve before or after the return pump? so i can shut it off for maintanence and also adjust the flow if need be for it returning the water? i am pretty sure I figured out what the GPH return is going to be in coordinace to the overflow (right around 300 gph each), however incase I need to dial it in a small bit I want to be able to and have the valve in correct spot.
demonnite57
New member
I have my ball valve after the return pump. To me it makes more sense since you won't be restricting the flow of water to the pump itself.
I would put a ball valve on both the return and drain. This would allow to cut off the water from draining and also from the pump during times of maint for the sump.
But you can dial in the amoun of flow you want from the sump and also amount of water going to the tank til they equal themselves out so your not getting too much flow or too much drain.
But you can dial in the amoun of flow you want from the sump and also amount of water going to the tank til they equal themselves out so your not getting too much flow or too much drain.
jer77
Phish Lover
Good job on your project so far and your DIY sump Mr. Tan. I have some suggestions for you.
I like your sump baffles. Glass is better I've heard cause it makes a stronger bond if you are using silicon to mount them as opposed to using acrylic. Just one suggestion about the height of the first bubble trap. The height shouldn't be higher than the output from the skimmer. The skimmer should be allowed to empty from its drain piping without water blocking it. You could lower the baffles or just raise the skimmer by sitting it on top of something.
To answer your previous question, ball valves should only be used on the output of any pump to restrict the flow. Restricting the flow on the input side will stress the pump. You can plumb in a ball valve or better yet a true union ball valve, on the input side, but only use it when the pump is off and/or when doing maintenance on the pump.
Another suggestion is you may not want to use the pump externally for a few reasons. Having the pump have to suck water out of the sump through any size pipe is going to reduce the overall flow quite considerably. Also only using 1/2'' pipe and having an elbow before the input will reduce flow even more. The input to an external pump should be straight tubing and should be horizontal. You will be surprised on how little flow is produced.
How big are the overflow drain holes and what size tank do you have?
I like your sump baffles. Glass is better I've heard cause it makes a stronger bond if you are using silicon to mount them as opposed to using acrylic. Just one suggestion about the height of the first bubble trap. The height shouldn't be higher than the output from the skimmer. The skimmer should be allowed to empty from its drain piping without water blocking it. You could lower the baffles or just raise the skimmer by sitting it on top of something.
To answer your previous question, ball valves should only be used on the output of any pump to restrict the flow. Restricting the flow on the input side will stress the pump. You can plumb in a ball valve or better yet a true union ball valve, on the input side, but only use it when the pump is off and/or when doing maintenance on the pump.
Another suggestion is you may not want to use the pump externally for a few reasons. Having the pump have to suck water out of the sump through any size pipe is going to reduce the overall flow quite considerably. Also only using 1/2'' pipe and having an elbow before the input will reduce flow even more. The input to an external pump should be straight tubing and should be horizontal. You will be surprised on how little flow is produced.
How big are the overflow drain holes and what size tank do you have?
jer77
Phish Lover
Another suggestion is to have the skimmer's drain water exit into the second section of your sump. You can achieve this by plumbing a length of tubing from the output over top the first baffle or bubble trap and have it exit the water into that section. This is better because the skimmer won't be re-skimming any water it just skimmed. This will improve the skimmer's overall efficiency.
Also, about the Mag7 again. The mag pumps can be plumbed externally but I would recommend using it internally. The sump water will cool the pump which will improve the pump's efficiency and let it pump stronger. Plus as I said before they are really inefficient at sucking water.
Also, about the Mag7 again. The mag pumps can be plumbed externally but I would recommend using it internally. The sump water will cool the pump which will improve the pump's efficiency and let it pump stronger. Plus as I said before they are really inefficient at sucking water.
Mr.Tan
New member
I will place the valve after the pump, thanks guys!
thanks!
I was back and forth with glass and acrylic, but when I found a place locally thanks to my dads help that can cut glass and it ended up being cheap i was sold on it. Especially because of hearing how much better it bonds compared to acrylic which the silicone would just be more of a wedge. I do plan on using a egg crate stand to raise the skimmer so the output is above water level, i just didn't get to that part of the build yet! thanks for the reminder though!
That was my biggest concern so far, i couldn't figure it out. I thought maybe it should be after so it doest cut back on water flow to the pump, but again i didn't know... I will be sure to put it after the output of the return pump and not before.
This part now is kind of a bummer to hear haha (although i appreciate the input from you)...I would really like to the keep the return pump external, mostly for ease of maintanence and also because i dont want the excess heat in the sump because my tank already runs warm and I dont want it any warmer. I did purchase a return pump that was stronger then what I probably needed, even at a 7' head height it says it should be able to pump over 300 GPH , and my overflow is a up to 75 gallon tank (or 300 GPH overflow). I got something a bit bigger for my tank because i am planning to eventually upgrade and I will carry this over to the new tank.... Do you think it is still ok to use it the way it is? i mean, if I don't really even need to adjust the ball valve for return flow?
I am using 3/4" tubing, i decided to go with that instead of 1/5" to help with more flow. Now I have a question for you. My overflow box uses a 1" drain tubing, can I step it down to be only 3/4" to equal out to what my return tubing to the tank is going to be? or should I keep it 1" and do that size piping all the way down to the sump?....
My tank is a 29 gallon and the sump is a 20 long
Mr.Tan
New member
That first suggestion was something i wondered about!! I thought it seemed weird and like it would just keep re-skimming the water in that area... I will for sure do that!
i mean, if you really think it will be better having it down in the sump, I will do that... I am completely open to suggestions as I dont want any problems in the future... I just liked how it looked with the pump outside the sump :lmao:
