Thoughts on treating ich in display tank with Cupramine

[rdefino]

I have a 210 gal tank with about 13 fish. 2 of the fish, tang and fox face have ich. No one else is showing signs. I treat these 2 fish in a quarantine tank for 4 weeks with hyposalinity and it cleaned them up, but 5 days after being in the display tank they had ich again.

So I'm thinking of remove most of the LF and treating them with Cupramine.

this is not a reef tank, just fish only. should I treat the whole display tank, or just remove the infected fish and treat them with Cupramine?

i'm in a bind. Should I treat the display tank?

The thing is I don't think these fish will work good in a 75gal quarantine tank.

Thanks

 

[byrdman81]

If its fish only you could treat dt if it has no inverts. I think cupramine may harm LR though but im not 100 percent sure. You have to treat all fish in the aquarium for at least 4 weeks and let the tank sit fishless for 6-8 weeks

 

[Sk8r]

It will kill your lr and sand.
I have at least a suggestion, take it for what it's worth, which is entirely untried theory: test your water. It should be at: 1.025 salinity, 80 temp, (leeway in both of those); 420 calcium, 7.9 ph, 8.3-9.3 alkalinity, very little nitrate, 5-0 if possible. If it's a light attack, you might try correcting water to those params and feeding storebought garlic crushed, hoping they would throw it off. I think it is in principle safer than treating the tank with copper.
If however it is a bad infestation, that's a wholly different kettle of fish.
You might try running a diatom or 1-micron filter: that would get any swimming form of the parasite.
You might try a UV sterilizer on this persistent problem. It would also get anything swimming.
In the life cycle of the parasite it infests fish, then drops off into the sandbed. Then swims back up to infest fish. Reproduction I think happens in the sandbed. There are however 2 stages of it while it is in the water. It is, i believe over 1 micron in size. And vulnerable to UV light.

if you get that I would try everything before dosing a display tank with cupramine, yes. If there is ANY other choice, including getting those two fish back into qt and using filtration and water balance to clean up the main tank, with an 8 week qt this time.

 

[rdefino]

Thanks for the reply.

Store bought garlic. How would I feed that to them? I use garlic extract now and soak their food in it.

Thanks again

 

[rdefino]

What do you mean by "feeding store bought garlic crushed, hoping they would throw it off."

Thanks

 

[dones20]

copper safe will not at all harm your live rock or live sand i have tried this plenty of times in my 12o gallons fowlr and a pair of cleaner shrimps it did nothing too rock or shrimps did kill any snails i had though other than that it worked great

 

[Sk8r]

Just crush ordinary garlic cloves and dice into bits, discarding hulls. Rabbitfish will actually eat it. I'd expect tangs would, savoring it as a treat. It does get into body tissues, into sweat in humans; and possibly it increases slime coat. It does seem to help the immune system, ---or it functions like Advantage in getting rid of fleas. Ich is rather like fleas, in that they come and go, and get into the carpet/sandbed. I do think fresh garlic is stronger than what they offer in bottles. Your eyes may tell you that (wear gloves).
I have not personally used copper safe, and cannot swear to it one way or the other. Those who sell it advise removing invertebrates: and bacteria are invertebrates...that would worry me.

 

[Texastravis]

My 2 cents: KILL ALL ICK. UV sterilizers and garlic in my opinion are more of a prevention than a true cure for the ick. You want an ick free system so I suggest pulling all live rock out (even pull sand out if you want) place some PVC and gutter hose for hiding spots and treat that tank for 8 weeks with hyposalinity (this way copper wont get in your system) after this put rock back in and you have yourself an ick free system

 

[rdefino]

If I was to leave the LS in there and do hyposalinity, what would happen? Even if the live sand died, wouldn't just become LS after raising the salinity level?

Thanks

 

[rdefino]

What is the best way to maintain all the LR & LS in a serparte tank?

Thanks

 

[Texastravis]

Yeah just leave the sand in there. You dont want to disturb any ammonia pockets anyways. Go get some extra salt because since your ls is out of commission you might have some trouble with water quality. So I would be rdy for some water changes.

LR just throw in a 55 gallon plastic tub from walmart. They are like 10 bucks. Make sure all the rock is covered up with water and place a pwerhead in there.

 

[dones20]

i dont under stand what the deal is with all you guys and the live rock if its a fowlr tank anyways say it does absorb some copper with time and water changes it will stop secreting it and fyi it takes months for it to absorb copper but wat ever do as you please... like i said i have done this in my 120 gallon fowlr that is now converted to a reef tank after about 8 months back i had an ick out break removed all corals and left rock and sand in there after 4 weeks of treatment i did a 100% water change let run for a week and did another 30% and putt all corals back in with no problems and like i said this was about 8 months back and the system is beautiful and colors are amazing no draw backs....

 

[rdefino]

Dones20,

Did you treat with copper or hyposalinity?

I looking to do hyposalinity.

thanks

 

[dones20]

no i treated with copper safe by mardel imo its betters than cupramine and safer also i beleive hypo is a waste of time because in order to kill anything forin with hypo its gotta be really low id say about 1.009 or so and copper is way more afective if you use properly i have overdosed my system accedentially with copper safe and never had a problem its the best med out ther imo if i were you i would shoot straight for copper

 

[phk36]

use copper dont lose all your fish

 

[rdefino]

Is it a good idea to treat with copper and hypo at the same time? Would that be a problem?

 

[limitdown]

<a href=showthread.php?s=&postid=13267982#post13267982 target=_blank>Originally posted</a> by rdefino
Is it a good idea to treat with copper and hypo at the same time? Would that be a problem?

That combination would be deadly. Choose one or the other.

 

[flameangel88]

I've been using Cupramine sine July 22nd on a 180g FOWLR tank (with 260 lbs of LR).

Administered Cupramine and had lots of problem maintaining 0.5 copper level most likely due to LR absorping it. After 13 days the 3 butterflies started breathing heavy so decided to take out cupper with WC, Chemi-pure elite and Polypad but ich came back within 3 days. The second time I administered for 25 days and pretty much had to add Cupramine every other day to maintain the 0.5 level. All the snails, worms died, lost 2 of 3 Blood shrimp, clams, 1 female Watanabe and 1 female GSM Clown. Also lost polyp rock. Survived the ich and copper treatment include 17 angels, all 3 butterflies, hermit crabs, 1 Blood shrimp, 1 Cleaner Shrimp, 1 Pistol Shrimp and 1 Sally Lightfoot C=crab.


See my thread here

Good luck!

 

[limitdown]

<a href=showthread.php?s=&postid=13273661#post13273661 target=_blank>Originally posted</a> by flameangel88
I've been using Cupramine sine July 22nd on a 180g FOWLR tank (with 260 lbs of LR).

Administered Cupramine and had lots of problem maintaining 0.5 copper level most likely due to LR absorping it. After 13 days the 3 butterflies started breathing heavy so decided to take out cupper with WC, Chemi-pure elite and Polypad but ich came back within 3 days. The second time I administered for 25 days and pretty much had to add Cupramine every other day to maintain the 0.5 level. All the snails, worms died, lost 2 of 3 Blood shrimp, clams, 1 female Watanabe and 1 female GSM Clown. Also lost polyp rock. Survived the ich and copper treatment include 17 angels, all 3 butterflies, hermit crabs, 1 Blood shrimp, 1 Cleaner Shrimp, 1 Pistol Shrimp and 1 Sally Lightfoot C=crab.


See my thread here

Good luck!

Howcome you didn't move your inverts and polyp rock to a temporary tank while you administered copper in the DT?

 

[flameangel88]

I'm already running 4 tanks in the house (one more I think I'll be living in the garage) and didn't want to transfer any ich into the other tanks.