Tough QT decision- need opinions!

[Reefahholic]

OK...So a while back, I bought some fish from Vivid Aquariums. The fish showed no signs of ICH in my qt for 4 weeks. Like an idiot (And I knew better I decided to go ahead and put them in my DT. I should have waited 8 weeks, but didn't. So a week later, ICH shows it's ugly face in my "Clean DT" that was ICH free for over a year. So...I tore down all of my aquascaping to catch ALL the fish. I put them all in my qt and started Hypo treatment for my first time. I watched a lot of them die-one after another-before the hypo started to work. I was left with less than half of my fish after it was all said and done. To be honest, I think some of my fish just became immune to the ICH. I feel that some ICH strands can tolerate hypo treatment and that my treatment wasn't completely affective. However, I did put the fish that seemed to be well that showed no signs of ICH for over 8 weeks back into my DT. Months went by and all of a sudden one fish would die for no reason. Then another fish would die a week later. No signs of ICH, but we all know that sometimes you don't always see the little white specks. The problem could have been my water parameters, because I was being lazy at the time and didn't test, but I have always done big water changes to keep the tank in check. So after loosing more fish, I decided ICH was probably back in the DT. The few fish I had left that didn't die showed no signs of ICH even until this day. I think they built up immunity to it. I took the fish out and put them in my qt and now they've survived 4 weeks of copper treatment at a therapeutic level. During that time, (Like and IDIOT), I fell victim to my weakness of Scooter Blennys and bought two of them. One came from LFS and the other from Petco's ICH infested tanks. I also bought a nice fat Lawnmower Blenny at Petco the same day. None of the fish showed any signs of ICH. After doing a little research, I decided to put them directly in my DT. You hear that dragonetts do get ICH or their skin is too tough. Now the Lawnmower blenny I don't know about. This was a decision I kinda regret now. Although they have never showed any signs of ICH, I wonder if they are harboring it or if they introduced it back into my DT. I'm debating on trying to catch them and let my DT sit fishless for 8 weeks. Should I to be safe or not??? I really don't feel like tearing down my scape again, but I would rather be safe than sorry, because I'm fixing to order some nice Tangs and other expensive fish. Please hit me with all your thoughts..:headwalls::beer:

 

[Spar]

ya, sounds like you need to do the fallow thing and just set it right to begin with.

since you have less fish now, you should consider doing TT using a pair of 29 gallon tanks or so, and then move them to a temporary larger tank while your DT goes fallow.

Fallow in your DT needs to do the full 10-12 weeks to be safe, not the 8 you refer to. this will ensure the 72 days that ich could by encysted is passed.

 

[enjetek]

Do you like spending money to replace the fish that keep dying? The obvious choice is to treat all your fish before purchasing the tangs and other expensive fish...?

 

[Deinonych]

Do you like spending money to replace the fish that keep dying? The obvious choice is to treat all your fish before purchasing the tangs and other expensive fish...?

+1

If it were me, I'd slow down and not buy any more fish until my DT were disease free, and all existing fish have been treated and confirmed to be free of disease. Then, reintroduce the fish into the DT and allow things to stabilize for a few weeks. Only then I would consider getting a new fish, and make sure any new purchases go through a thorough quarantine.

Nothing good happens fast in this hobby.

 

[Reefahholic]

Thanks guys. Looks like I need to catch those 3 fish. I guess TT for Dragonets? They don't tolerate copper well huh?

Ok, well I need to catch these turds.

 

[Reefahholic]

ya, sounds like you need to do the fallow thing and just set it right to begin with.

since you have less fish now, you should consider doing TT using a pair of 29 gallon tanks or so, and then move them to a temporary larger tank while your DT goes fallow.

Fallow in your DT needs to do the full 10-12 weeks to be safe, not the 8 you refer to. this will ensure the 72 days that ich could by encysted is passed.

Ok, I'll do 12 weeks.

 

[Spar]

Thanks guys. Looks like I need to catch those 3 fish. I guess TT for Dragonets? They don't tolerate copper well huh?

Ok, well I need to catch these turds.

just do TT for all the fish - quickest and most guaranteed success method. will take a bit of salt and a 2nd heater and powerhead, but will be worth the time and money investment. See if anyone nearby has an empty tank sitting around.

 

[snorvich]

Craigslist has lots of tanks (from those who don't quarantine)

 

[Reefahholic]

I have plenty of extra tanks. Do you really think tank transfer is the best method to rid ICH?

I think Copper is a sure way.

I won't do hypo again. If I do TT..it will be my first time.

Any tips??

 

[Reefahholic]

Caught all the fish. DT is Fallow!!! Here goes 12 weeks..

 

[Breadman03]

I have plenty of extra tanks. Do you really think tank transfer is the best method to rid ICH?

I think Copper is a sure way.

I won't do hypo again. If I do TT..it will be my first time.

Any tips??

TT is good stuff. Copper is good too, but is pretty harsh on the fish.

 

[snorvich]

I have plenty of extra tanks. Do you really think tank transfer is the best method to rid ICH?

Yes, because the front end of the life cycle, on which tank transfer is predicated is so tightly defined

I think Copper is a sure way. It is sure if and only if you keep the level at a therapeutic dose the whole time and you do it for 72 days. Remember the issue of the back end of the life cycle being so variable from a time perspective.

I won't do hypo again. If I do TT..it will be my first time.

Any tips??

Yes, read the tank transfer description under the Fish Parasites master sticky.

 

[Spar]

order of both easiest to administer and success rate at ridding Ich = TT, Copper, Hypo

IME and seems to be the most agreed on.

Go ahead and dose PraziPro once you are done with TT and get them settled into their temporary housing for the remainder of the 12 weeks.

Going forward you can just use a 5 gallon bucket or 10 to 20 gallon tanks for the TT for new fish. You will obviously want to keep up with the QT'ing so you don't have to go through this process again!

Good luck, you are doing the right and best thing!

 

[snorvich]

order of both easiest to administer and success rate at ridding Ich = TT, Copper, Hypo

Exactly correct. TT is by far the most effective, hypo, by far, the least effective

 

[Reefahholic]

Yes, read the tank transfer description under the Fish Parasites master sticky.

Copper for 72 days...it thought it was 4 weeks? Shoot, I forgot I guess or got mixed up with something else on time frame.

So tank transfer is you favorite method snorvich?

I'll have to try it for sure. How long does it take?

 

[Reefahholic]

order of both easiest to administer and success rate at ridding Ich = TT, Copper, Hypo

IME and seems to be the most agreed on.

Go ahead and dose PraziPro once you are done with TT and get them settled into their temporary housing for the remainder of the 12 weeks.

Going forward you can just use a 5 gallon bucket or 10 to 20 gallon tanks for the TT for new fish. You will obviously want to keep up with the QT'ing so you don't have to go through this process again!

Good luck, you are doing the right and best thing!

Well it seems like you guys are very confident in tank transfer. I have plenty of 5/g buckets and also have dedicated area for Quarintine. One tank is a pod tank in the group. Skinning the stands now. Painting tonight. All of the tanks will have the back painted black. All have aquaclear filters. No carbon. All have matching Jager heaters and glass thermometers.



As you can see, in the middle of construction. Pain in the butt, but worth it in the long run.

 

[Reefahholic]

And the poor DT sits fallow. Sniff Sniff...

 

[Spar]

Copper for 72 days...it thought it was 4 weeks? Shoot, I forgot I guess or got mixed up with something else on time frame.

So tank transfer is you favorite method snorvich?

I'll have to try it for sure. How long does it take?

No, not copper for 72 days... this is just referring to how long you need to keep your DT fallow for.

Yes, Snorvich is a huge supporter of TTM.

All you need is in this single thread. Feel free to ping additional questions though:
http://www.reefcentral.com/forums/showthread.php?t=1996525

very simple concept really

 

[Reefahholic]

No, not copper for 72 days... this is just referring to how long you need to keep your DT fallow for.

Yes, Snorvich is a huge supporter of TTM.

All you need is in this single thread. Feel free to ping additional questions though:
http://www.reefcentral.com/forums/showthread.php?t=1996525

very simple concept really

I really appreciate it! Well if snorvich using tank transfer and thinks it's the best. I'll be going that route.

So...one more question. What is the minimal time for copper to be effective?

I just did 4 weeks.

 

[snorvich]

Copper for 72 days...it thought it was 4 weeks? Shoot, I forgot I guess or got mixed up with something else on time frame.

No, you said you wanted a sure way. The normal way using copper is 4 weeks; however because of the variable nature of the life cycle's back end, and because only the theronts are susceptible to copper, it would have to be 72 days for certainty. Of course that assumes that you keep the dose a therapeutic levels for 4 weeks. Or would you be happy with a 90% solution?

So tank transfer is you favorite method snorvich?

For cryptocaryon irritans it is the surest way and easiest.

I'll have to try it for sure. How long does it take?

12 days. Did you read the stickies?