Upgrading to a 300 gallon wide. Need some advice

So why would stuff die off of rock just because it got moved to another tank? I guess I've never cured my rock before.

So the guys at the good lfs didn't say anything about the lemon peel angel i already have or coral beauty I ordered eating corals. They said large angels would eat them. And I've seen several videos of tanks with flame angels and coral beauties in reef tanks. I guess I'll just have to see what happens. I won't order a flame angel but I've already had my lemon peel angel a long time And already ordered the coral beauty. And as far as the wrasse I just won't have shrimp and crabs in the tank. That's why I was wondering how important are shrimp and crabs in a reef tank.


I want to have a bunch of anthias. I've got egg crate to use as lids now so nobody can jump out. Do different kinds of anthias school together? Is it ok to have males of different kinds of should it still only be one male even with say 3 or so different kinds of anthias. I already ordered 2 female lyretail and a male lyretail. I want to get 2 female bimaculatus anthias and a Hutchii anthias and I was interested in the bicolor anthias but it's only available in male right now. The lyretails are coming from the lfs but I'm looking into the other anthias on blue zoo aquatics website. Anybody have experience with them? I was thinking about telling the fish store nevermind on the male lyretail and get male bicolor instead
 
Only buy female anthias of any type. By the time you get them successfully past four weeks of quaranine they will have decided amongst themselves who will be the new male.

Dave.M
 
Ok if I just get the 2 female lyretails and no males can I get the other ones I want later and they school together or should I buy all of them together?
 
Different anthias will not school or shoal together unless they feel threatened. Males will fight each other to the death. They will also bully females mercilessly to prevent them from turning into males. That's why you need several anthias of a kind for best chances of success (not just two). We aren't talking guppies, here.

Best to get some books on keeping saltwater fish and reef tanks.

Dave.M
 
Another reason why forums suck because people are rude and assume everybody is stupid just because they ask a question. I have books and I have read about anthias and I've seen several YouTube videos of several different kinds of anthias swimming together. Not everything works exactly by the books
 
I've also read threads about anthias getting information about specific types of anthias and seen where people said they had 2 males in their tank and they were getting along. I will just get 3 female lyretails and 3 female bimaculatus then. I've seen lots of tanks with lots of different ones and I love all anthias and don't want to just stick to one type. I had a female hutchii and a male lyretail anthias for a long time that stayed together all the time. Had the female hutchii for 5 years and the lyretail about 3. Something happened to the lyretail then the hutchii jumped out of the tank after having her for 5 years I literally cried because she was my favorite. I'm only trying to get information on adding groups of anthias because obviously they don't have to be the same type. I'm getting information based on people experiences and what usually actually works. Not what's in books
 
Not to mention not including the tank i had before this one just this one alone I've had for 4 years with the same fish in it the whole time. The one before that I had 2 years before I upgraded to this one and my sailfin tang and like tang just died or disappeared after having them 6 years and they came from the other tank I had. Don't tell me I need to get books because I can show you a picture of all the books that I have and all the magazine's of tropical fish hobbyist not to mention magazine's I got from coral con when I went to Florida just for a convention. I like to read and research and learn more than probably anybody but just because of that doesn't mean anthias are going to act exactly by the books. If we went by the books then nobody would have all these Tangs in smaller tanks that what the books say they are supposed to be in!
 
I think a bubble Magnus that size will be just fine. Never owned one but have always heard good things about them.

You don't have to have shrimp in your reef tank. Keep your lunar wrasse if you want to. I don't see what it would hurt.
 
Not to mention not including the tank i had before this one just this one alone I've had for 4 years with the same fish in it the whole time. The one before that I had 2 years before I upgraded to this one and my sailfin tang and like tang just died or disappeared after having them 6 years and they came from the other tank I had. Don't tell me I need to get books because I can show you a picture of all the books that I have and all the magazine's of tropical fish hobbyist not to mention magazine's I got from coral con when I went to Florida just for a convention. I like to read and research and learn more than probably anybody but just because of that doesn't mean anthias are going to act exactly by the books. If we went by the books then nobody would have all these Tangs in smaller tanks that what the books say they are supposed to be in!

I've had a few different types of Anthias. I really like the fish, but some are much more difficult than others. I had 5 purple queens, never could get them to eat, they died about a month later, having never seen them eat a speck of food. I've got lyre tails and had dispar, and they eat like pigs no problems. The lyre tails are a bit more aggressive and chase and pick at each other but not other fish.
 
Another reason why forums suck because people are rude and assume everybody is stupid just because they ask a question. I have books and I have read about anthias and I've seen several YouTube videos of several different kinds of anthias swimming together. Not everything works exactly by the books

Beginner questions come mostly from people with beginner experience. How long it took you to reach this point is irrelevant, "new to the hobby" isn't an insult. Nobody is putting you down, you really need to come off the "forums suck" thing. The collective knowledge here is staggering to ponder, and it's all here for you to take advantage of.
With this amount of information, you won't always hear the same thing. People do things differently. Some times it works, other times not so much.
Angel fish are known coral eaters. There are one or two that some people have had some luck with, but I do not think I have ever heard of one going it's lifetime, or even a number of years without eventually turning and eating corals.
Dwarf Angels are hit and miss. While there are a lot more success stories with the dwarf varieties, they are far from "Reef Safe"
and even if you have one that's not picking, it's still not a guarantee that they won't. Catching a fish in an established reef tank is very challenging. This is why I suggested buying these fish from hobbyists that are getting out. Every fish is an individual, and if someone has had the chance to know that fish's personality before you buy it, your chances of a happy tank are higher.
 
I think a bubble Magnus that size will be just fine. Never owned one but have always heard good things about them.

You don't have to have shrimp in your reef tank. Keep your lunar wrasse if you want to. I don't see what it would hurt.


Ok cool thank you. once I get every thing up and running I will post my experiences with it.
 
I've had a few different types of Anthias. I really like the fish, but some are much more difficult than others. I had 5 purple queens, never could get them to eat, they died about a month later, having never seen them eat a speck of food. I've got lyre tails and had dispar, and they eat like pigs no problems. The lyre tails are a bit more aggressive and chase and pick at each other but not other fish.


Yea I've definitely heard bad things about purple queens. But it's hard to find good information on them all because there's so many different kinds. Ok so diapers are hardy also. That's good to know. I like so many different kinds of anthias it's hard to choose.
 
Beginner questions come mostly from people with beginner experience. How long it took you to reach this point is irrelevant, "new to the hobby" isn't an insult. Nobody is putting you down, you really need to come off the "forums suck" thing. The collective knowledge here is staggering to ponder, and it's all here for you to take advantage of.
With this amount of information, you won't always hear the same thing. People do things differently. Some times it works, other times not so much.
Angel fish are known coral eaters. There are one or two that some people have had some luck with, but I do not think I have ever heard of one going it's lifetime, or even a number of years without eventually turning and eating corals.
Dwarf Angels are hit and miss. While there are a lot more success stories with the dwarf varieties, they are far from "Reef Safe"
and even if you have one that's not picking, it's still not a guarantee that they won't. Catching a fish in an established reef tank is very challenging. This is why I suggested buying these fish from hobbyists that are getting out. Every fish is an individual, and if someone has had the chance to know that fish's personality before you buy it, your chances of a happy tank are higher.

Ok so I guess I will tell the fish store nevermind I don't want the coral beauty and looks like I'll be setting up another tank just for the wrasse and lemon peel angel because I hate to give them away when I've had them for a long time. Especially when I don't trust the one place that would take them because they are terrible and don't seem to take very good care of things and I would hate to see my fish end up dead there. And then I just feel like if I give them to somebody they might end up killing them lol I get attached to my fish just like my dogs.
 
Yeah my kids gave quite a few of the inhabitants names. Harder toss "Timmy" out when it dies, compared to calling it a Chromis and flushing the toilet.
 
I'm going to summarize your questions for you:

1) How many quarantine tanks should I have?

One for the new fish coming in. If they're coming from the same LFS, they are already still probably sharing the same water. You need to be sure for any quarantine system that you set up that you have accurate temperature control and filtration. Keeping a good quarantine system is hard. So hard that a lot of advanced reefers who have been in the hobby a VERY long time have said, "I just get a new fish and throw it in and hope for the best."

2) Can you move the old fish and the new fish into the new tank on the same day?

Yes, if it's very well cycled and probably if you're done something like NoPox to help feed the bacteria populations. Without fish to produce waste to feed the bacteria, it's going to be hard to grow enough of it to handle the fish load. Especially depending on how many fish you add.

So no, you can't add them on the day that it's set up unless you are 100% sure that you have very establish live rock. Even then, I would say your chance of success and of having a well tested system with no leaks is very hard. Also, setting up a 300 gallon system takes more than a day even if you have a lot of experience. That's a fair amount of plumbing work, rockscaping, lighting setup, temperature control. It's complicated. And, how do you intend to make 300+ gallons of salt water all in one day? It took two days to fill my tank with RODI water, and you don't want to dump salt in and then dump fish in right away.

3) So I put my current fish into a quarantine system?

You'd be better off moving your existing system. If it's sumpless and a 135, you could probably get enough people to drain most of the water out into bins and then push it out of the way, then carefully put the water back in.

4) Should I set up 3 40G breeders as quarantine tanks?

That would be extremely difficult to maintain and temperature control.

5) Do I treat fish from my LFS that quarantines them for two weeks?

Quarantine procedure is really an individual thing. Nobody can answer that question for you. I watched a long video on success rates with different butterfly fish. They rated them in categories and the best success rates were, if I remember correctly, >40%. Some of the fish that you're trying to keep probably have a 50% chance of surviving past the first 90 days if they have ideal conditions and great food. Your chance of being able to maintain a quarantine system perfectly for a long period of time is slim. Their best chance is possibly to put them all into the new cycled display system as soon as it's for-sure ready. I would decide that it was for-sure ready when you can test the tank for a couple of days with high quality test kits and see no ammonia or nitrite after a pretty heavy feeding of frozen mysis into an otherwise empty tank.

6) Does copper expire?

I have no idea.

7) I've seen people with tons of fish. How do they do it?

Most people just keep adding more. I got the majority of the fish in my system from the LFS on the same day and put them in with about 5 other fish. I only lost one clown tang that was too thin when I bought him (mistake on my part,) and if you add enough at once, especially to a large tank, it disperses aggression. Adding one or two fish at a time can be tricky, but people do that, too.

Note a lot of fish are very hard to quarantine because they are better off with pods and algae and stuff that grows in your display tank but not in your quarantine tank in order to survive.

Also, each fish will have its own personality. It's nearly impossible to predict what a fish is going to do.

8) Does anybody use Bubble Magnus?

Yes, people do. There aren't a lot of good scientific comparison tests between different skimmers. The only one I saw was maybe 7 years ago and it said that there was little difference between skimmer performance as long as they had similar air draws. I went with a very old, massive GEO skimmer with a huge pump and it's working great for me. It was in a "garage sale" at a LFS for $20 without a pump. I like it.

9) How do I keep a lot of anthias?

Luck, lots of food, an established system, and I'm finding mine love live black worms.

10) Should I get angels?

Depends on what coral you are going to have an whether you care if it gets nipped at.

11) Why is rock going to die off if moved to a new tank?

It won't, but you won't have enough rock, and you're adding a lot more fish. It's complicated.

12) If I get 2 anthias and add others later.. ?

Yeah, don't do that.

As previously stated, the large reef forum is really for advanced system design or build threads. When I clicked on this thread, I was not expecting this. I decided to take a half hour and try to answer all of your questions for you, but these are all beginner questions. You have never successfully had a sump before, you're unsure what skimmer to get, and you aren't sure how to add fish to a system. You've also lost a couple of fish after five years for unknown reasons in an established sumpless fish only system.

You also don't have any information about the tank that you're having built other than that it will be drilled and that it's going to have a skimmer. You have a lot more choices to make. Lighting, reactors, controller, heaters, fans/chiller, water movement in the tank, overflow style (herbie is awesome), return pump selection. Claim to be very experienced if you already have all of that planned out, but if you do, the thread doesn't indicate that you do. I think a lot of people are resistant to answering your questions because it's a rabbit hole and they don't want to design your whole system for you.
 
Another reason why forums suck because people are rude and assume everybody is stupid just because they ask a question. I have books and I have read about anthias and I've seen several YouTube videos of several different kinds of anthias swimming together. Not everything works exactly by the books

I'd stop with your rants because you are undertaking a huge project and your definitely not making any friends by going off so quickly. Many of the guys here live and breath this hobby and have for many years and know their ****, some have been at it maybe for longer than you've been alive..(I'm guessing your not much past 25 considering some of your posts..)

If you post pictures, you are more likely to get more responses.

And if you don't get responses, it's because its a boring question that doesn't interest anybody. Sometimes I ask a question or post a picture and see hundreds of people looked at it, but nobody answered. No biggie... Move on and don't let it get to you.

And just remember...this is supposed to be fun!
 
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