Based on research concluding that true UV can be detrimental, and rt's experiences with UV LED's (and his chart), that would seem to be correct.
UV leds. Is there any new information out there
- Thread starter josephv
- Start date
Based on research concluding that true UV can be detrimental, and rt's experiences with UV LED's (and his chart), that would seem to be correct.
rtparty
Raise The Reef!
Here is the chart:
I don't think light below the 400nm level is really needed but I definitely think light in the 400nm to 420nm area is needed. I have never understood why so many companies overlook the 420nm area. I know the 420nm LEDs are more expensive and their output and life expectancy isn't nearly what we expect from the blue and whites, so that may be the reason.
Hope that helps.
I don't think light below the 400nm level is really needed but I definitely think light in the 400nm to 420nm area is needed. I have never understood why so many companies overlook the 420nm area. I know the 420nm LEDs are more expensive and their output and life expectancy isn't nearly what we expect from the blue and whites, so that may be the reason.
Hope that helps.
Here is the chart:
I don't think light below the 400nm level is really needed but I definitely think light in the 400nm to 420nm area is needed. I have never understood why so many companies overlook the 420nm area. I know the 420nm LEDs are more expensive and their output and life expectancy isn't nearly what we expect from the blue and whites, so that may be the reason.
Hope that helps.
Awesome chart! Will definitely be consulting it when finalizing my LED array, thanks!
josephv
New member
Not Sure about uv being detrimental .Coral love the sun more than any other form of light and there is an abundance of uv in the suns rays' LEDS must not be making the correct type of uv or not in the correct amounts' Just looking for new info on correctly balancing the light spectrum from leds that will benefit my coral .
rtparty
Raise The Reef!
UV rays are filtered out VERY quickly in water. I promise, corals don't like true UV lighting. Go get a double ended halide and don't run a glass shield. Watch what the corals do. You will fry a tank pretty quickly.
Again, true UV does not cause coloration in corals from the reports I saw. The protein that protects corals from UV damage is clear in color.
Violet and small amounts of red will balance out your spectrum the best.
Joseph, you can see from the chart rt posted that there aren't really any photosynthetic processes taking place in the UV spectrum. Therefore, you would be providing unusable light energy for your coral.
Our goal is to reach photosaturation, yet stay under photoinhibition. These values take into account ALL light energy supplied to the zooxanthellae. By providing true uv light, you would have to cut back on the amount of useful light to avoid photoinhibition, which will, in turn, slow growth and hurt color.
That's my take on it, anyway. I don't pretend to be a lighting expert.
Our goal is to reach photosaturation, yet stay under photoinhibition. These values take into account ALL light energy supplied to the zooxanthellae. By providing true uv light, you would have to cut back on the amount of useful light to avoid photoinhibition, which will, in turn, slow growth and hurt color.
That's my take on it, anyway. I don't pretend to be a lighting expert.
josephv
New member
Trust me; I believe all of you as I know very little about this type of subject matter. I'm just curious as I'm sure you are as well about what the sun and metal halide have that leds are not supplying. Maybe MH just have a larger range of usable spectrum and leds are just to specific in the spectrums they deliver. As far as UV goes maybe we just cannot produce the right type or intensity of uv with our lighting options.
What I am shocked at most is the lack of posted new internet information on the advances leds have made in the last few years in reguards to the husbandry of marine life.
I just ordered 5 green and 5 violet cree leds to supplement my tank.Im thinking that in small doses they may help my coral.
It's definitely worth a try. It seems the only way we will be able to nail down proper LED coloration is with experimentation.
I think, though, that we need to separate coloration and growth.
I think good coral growth is a better indication of health than coloration. LED's have proven reliable for healthy growth.
I believe Coloration is more for our enjoyment than the corals. All the coral wants to do is grow and multiply. If you are getting good growth, you are meeting the basic needs. I've seen ridiculous looking corals that I highly doubt would look the same in the wild.
It would be interesting to build an LED array with peaks in the same region as popular MH bulbs, then do a comparison over time with regards to growth and color, ideally both over the same tank.
rtparty
Raise The Reef!
This has basically been done by EcoTech already with the Radion fixture. It was meant to mimic a Radium MH bulb. However, they slightly missed the mark because they have no spectrum below the 435-440nm region.
This is not me patting myself on the back but I have been calling for different LEDs then just the standard white and blue/royal blue for a couple years now. My thought process comes from my extensive research and knowledge concerning T5s. The standard white/blue mix doesn't work with T5s so why would it work with LEDs?
One major hurdle that had to be overcome though for LEDs was a company that produced more than the standard colors used for everyday items. They then had to produce them at a price point that was acceptable.
Thus, we have waited for violet, red, green and other colors to become available for our use. Green is a tricky color though because it does nothing for corals. It is a purely aesthetic color for us humans.
Some will argue that a little bit of green is used by corals but it isn't. Green in and of itself is not used. It is the border areas where you shift in and out of green that will be used.
Providing "green" light will just allow the pigmentation of certain corals to reflect that light.
josephv
New member
vivid aqueriums is doing an 800 gallon Metal halide vs LEd face off experiment using the exact same coral on each side of the tank. They are using the 12 Ecotech Marine Radion XR30w LEDs on one side and MH on the other.It has been running around 3 months now. I talked to some people at the store and The MH still have a slight advantage for grow out and color. I like the rest of the world just want to know why! If the par on each side is equil,What is missing with the leds ?
Is the water flow and coral placement on each side identical too?
rtparty
Raise The Reef!
It has taken some of my corals almost 8 months to totally acclimate over to LEDs. 3 months is no where NEAR long enough to draw ANY type of conclusion.
It also looked like the PAR was lower on the LED side of the tank than the MH.
Unfortunately, you can't just put LEDs over one side of a tank and MH over the other and call a winner. Flow and food are not taken into consideration and no one even looks at the real growth of a coral.
Let's say you have a coral that grows 2" vertically, 3" horizontally and gains 4 ounces of weight. Coral B has grown 1" vertically, 2" horizontally and gained 7 ounces of weight. Which coral grew more?
josephv
New member
The vivid guys have only had the tank going around 3 months and have by no means called it for MH.it has same water flow,temp,parameters and par as well as same coral and placement. It will take some time before any hard evedence an be gleaned from this tank but it will prove out some interesting info. Wish I could see it in person. They put up you tube videos all the time.
Rocky_Mtn_Reef
In Memoriam
This is an interesting thread. Alot of manufatuers are looking into UV LED supplimentation...but cost is a huge factor. LEDs didnt start gaining alot of momentum untill cost came down...raising fixture cost by adding a few more costly specilty LEDs sounds counter tuitive of a good buisness model.
lucky_snapper
New member
Is the PAR exactly the same ? There are too many variables to say that one is better then the other based on this test ...I would love to see a true scientific study with an A and B test of MH vs LED.
Masterofnonsense
New member
Something to think about is T5 lighting. There are plenty of tanks that prove that you can get great growth and color from fluorescent lighting. If you look at the bulbs available for T5 fixtures, the true actinic 420nm is the lowest you will find. Based off of that, I don't think there is any need for LEDs below the 420nm range.
rtparty
Raise The Reef!
Actually, the light for a quote a bit of t5 bulbs travels down into the sub 400nm range. LEDs though have a very narrow bandwidth of light. thus you need to use the lower level LEDs to full in this void.
josephv
New member
The Guys at vivid tried to match the par levil to be equil on each side of the tank.You yube it. Its kind of cool.
Similar threads
