Vodka dosing and anemones
- Thread starter Payton034
- Start date
Safe is a relative term, and the answer may depend on a host of factors that vary tank to tank and species to species.
I choose vinegar instead of vodka, but I know that at high doses I can turn RBTAs brownish with excessive zoox, as presumably the zoox thrive on the acetate. The same may happen with vodka, but I've not specifically heard of that. At lower doses, such changes did not occur. I currently dose vinegar and keep giganteas.
That said, there have been some reports of issues with organic carbon dosing and anemones, including my own large H. crispa. Was it coincidence, or cause and effect? Not sure. But one can hypothesize that anemones struggling against bacterial infections may be harmed by added organic carbon sources which may help spur bacterial growth.
I choose vinegar instead of vodka, but I know that at high doses I can turn RBTAs brownish with excessive zoox, as presumably the zoox thrive on the acetate. The same may happen with vodka, but I've not specifically heard of that. At lower doses, such changes did not occur. I currently dose vinegar and keep giganteas.
That said, there have been some reports of issues with organic carbon dosing and anemones, including my own large H. crispa. Was it coincidence, or cause and effect? Not sure. But one can hypothesize that anemones struggling against bacterial infections may be harmed by added organic carbon sources which may help spur bacterial growth.
HighlandReefer
Team RC
Zooanthallae utilize acetate which causes them to grow faster. I have read Randy's article regarding the break down of acetate and that is pretty straight forward. Bacteria utilize acetate directly.
What happens when we add ethanol to a tank? What does it break down into when bacteria break it down? Are these biproducts when ethanol is broken down toxic at lower levels? Which type of bacteria ultilize ethanol? Is ethanol used directly by zooanthallae? Does the alcohol kill organisms at high enough levels? What are these levels where the ethanol directly has negative effects? I have seen research regarding this for waste water mangement but not in marine environmensts.
Lipogenesis in the intact coral Pocillopora capitata and its isolated zooxanthellae: Evidence for a light-driven carbon cycle between symbiont and host
J. S. Patton, S. Abraham and A. A. Benson
http://www.springerlink.com/content/x1542137913mh3h1/
Abstract:
Surface tissue of the reef coral Pocillopora capitata contained approximately 34% lipid on a dry weight basis. Of this, 75% was storage lipid (wax ester and triglyceride) and 25% structural (phospholipid, galactolipid, etc.). Based on chlorophyll a: lipid ratios of intact coral and isolated zooxanthellae, it was determined that over 90% of the storage lipid resided in the host tissue. One half of the structural lipids was found in the host and the other in the symbiotic algae. Gentle fractionation of coral tissue indicated that zooxanthellae possessed less than 14% of the total coral protein. Coral tips and isolated zooxanthellae were incubated with sodium acetate-1-14C in light and dark to obtain lipogenic rates and proportions of fatty acids and lipid classes synthesized. The rate of lipid synthesis from acetate-1-14C by intact coral was stimulated three-fold in the light (1200 lux), which indicated that the majority of coral lipogenesis occurred in the zooxanthellae. Intact coral triglycerides contained ca. 68% of the 14C-activity and wax esters ca. 21%. Zooxanthellae isolated by the Water Pik technique synthesized negligible amounts of wax ester, which implied that wax ester synthesis was a property of the animal tissue. Isolated zooxanthellae and intact coral synthesized identical triglyceride fatty acids from acetate-1-14C. This study provides evidence for a carbon cycle between host and symbiont whereby the zooxanthellae take up host-derived carbon (probably in the form of acetate), synthesize fatty acids using their photosynthetically derived energy, and return the lipid to the host where it appears as wax ester and triglyceride.
An interesting thread a few years ago involving some of RC's hot shots: :lol:
http://www.reefcentral.com/forums/showthread.php?t=288714
What happens when we add ethanol to a tank? What does it break down into when bacteria break it down? Are these biproducts when ethanol is broken down toxic at lower levels? Which type of bacteria ultilize ethanol? Is ethanol used directly by zooanthallae? Does the alcohol kill organisms at high enough levels? What are these levels where the ethanol directly has negative effects? I have seen research regarding this for waste water mangement but not in marine environmensts.
Lipogenesis in the intact coral Pocillopora capitata and its isolated zooxanthellae: Evidence for a light-driven carbon cycle between symbiont and host
J. S. Patton, S. Abraham and A. A. Benson
http://www.springerlink.com/content/x1542137913mh3h1/
Abstract:
Surface tissue of the reef coral Pocillopora capitata contained approximately 34% lipid on a dry weight basis. Of this, 75% was storage lipid (wax ester and triglyceride) and 25% structural (phospholipid, galactolipid, etc.). Based on chlorophyll a: lipid ratios of intact coral and isolated zooxanthellae, it was determined that over 90% of the storage lipid resided in the host tissue. One half of the structural lipids was found in the host and the other in the symbiotic algae. Gentle fractionation of coral tissue indicated that zooxanthellae possessed less than 14% of the total coral protein. Coral tips and isolated zooxanthellae were incubated with sodium acetate-1-14C in light and dark to obtain lipogenic rates and proportions of fatty acids and lipid classes synthesized. The rate of lipid synthesis from acetate-1-14C by intact coral was stimulated three-fold in the light (1200 lux), which indicated that the majority of coral lipogenesis occurred in the zooxanthellae. Intact coral triglycerides contained ca. 68% of the 14C-activity and wax esters ca. 21%. Zooxanthellae isolated by the Water Pik technique synthesized negligible amounts of wax ester, which implied that wax ester synthesis was a property of the animal tissue. Isolated zooxanthellae and intact coral synthesized identical triglyceride fatty acids from acetate-1-14C. This study provides evidence for a carbon cycle between host and symbiont whereby the zooxanthellae take up host-derived carbon (probably in the form of acetate), synthesize fatty acids using their photosynthetically derived energy, and return the lipid to the host where it appears as wax ester and triglyceride.
An interesting thread a few years ago involving some of RC's hot shots: :lol:
http://www.reefcentral.com/forums/showthread.php?t=288714
My RBTA seems fine with vodka and Vinegar. I would try it slowly you shouldn't dose quickly anyways just like everything else in this hobbie. If you start slowly and gradually increase you will see the changes that are created in your tank. You will be able to tell if it is affecting anything negativly and you can ease your dose back.
