Yet another red hair algae thread
- Thread starter Fmellish
- Start date
NicoleC
New member
From your recent posts and the pics, I would say 100% cyano.
You reduced the flow, reduced the skimming, you admit to lots of detritus and don't siphon clean. It's a master recipe for a cyano outbreak.
Fix those 4 issues and it will go away.
You may want to spend some time tweaking your flow pattern to get better coverage with the flow you have, and maybe get that Tunze somewhere where you can take better advantage of it. It's a slow process, but a few minutes a day tweaking the flow until you get it optimized for your tank shape, pumps and rockwork will have big dividends.
When I was talking about the daily water change, I was really saying to siphon the stuff up daily instead of blowing it around.
You reduced the flow, reduced the skimming, you admit to lots of detritus and don't siphon clean. It's a master recipe for a cyano outbreak.
Fix those 4 issues and it will go away.
You may want to spend some time tweaking your flow pattern to get better coverage with the flow you have, and maybe get that Tunze somewhere where you can take better advantage of it. It's a slow process, but a few minutes a day tweaking the flow until you get it optimized for your tank shape, pumps and rockwork will have big dividends.
When I was talking about the daily water change, I was really saying to siphon the stuff up daily instead of blowing it around.
I've had some success with the "blowing it around" method because when I blow it around I end up with a ton of gunk in my filter sock. Then I change the sock.
So getting the gunk into the water column and down the drain is my normal course of action.
My skimmer is almost broken in now.
Flow is a tough one. WHerever I place my Tunze in my tank it rearranges my sand at the other end of the tank. Oddly enough the cyano is most present on the part of the sand bed the Tunze is always battering.
I may rethink my skimmer plumbing so I regain my return output.
Thanks everyone. I will continue as if this is Cyano.
Nicole would you recommend I try any of the phosphate removal medias? You can buy media from a few companies that when placed in a media bag is supposed to de-phosphate the water.
However I haven't tested for phospates.
Thanks
Josh
So getting the gunk into the water column and down the drain is my normal course of action.
My skimmer is almost broken in now.
Flow is a tough one. WHerever I place my Tunze in my tank it rearranges my sand at the other end of the tank. Oddly enough the cyano is most present on the part of the sand bed the Tunze is always battering.
I may rethink my skimmer plumbing so I regain my return output.
Thanks everyone. I will continue as if this is Cyano.
Nicole would you recommend I try any of the phosphate removal medias? You can buy media from a few companies that when placed in a media bag is supposed to de-phosphate the water.
However I haven't tested for phospates.
Thanks
Josh
NicoleC
New member
I'm not a fan of using this chemical or that media or whatever without knowing exactly what you want to remove. Phosphate problems are tough to diagnose for sure, since they often don't show up on a test becuase they are bound up in the algae. Some other nutrient could be the fueling factor; remember cyano isn't really an algae.
PolyFilter is pretty safe stuff, as well as being easy to use and relatively inexpensive; plus you know when it's exhausted. And whatever color it changes tells you what the primary thing it removed was.
Just a bag of phosphate media in the sump probably won't do much. If you go that way, you'll need to run it in a reactor, or at least in the bottom of your filter sock where plenty of water will flow over it. I have a reactor I'm not using at the moment if you want to borrow it for a bit.
Oh, by the way, I don't think it has anything to do with the carbon, I think you just were pushing the line and reach a flashpointed; that carbon was just a coincidence. But you can test this by rinsing the carbon, soaking in saltwater for a day or so, and then testing the water for phosphates, iron, etc.
PolyFilter is pretty safe stuff, as well as being easy to use and relatively inexpensive; plus you know when it's exhausted. And whatever color it changes tells you what the primary thing it removed was.
Just a bag of phosphate media in the sump probably won't do much. If you go that way, you'll need to run it in a reactor, or at least in the bottom of your filter sock where plenty of water will flow over it. I have a reactor I'm not using at the moment if you want to borrow it for a bit.
Oh, by the way, I don't think it has anything to do with the carbon, I think you just were pushing the line and reach a flashpointed; that carbon was just a coincidence. But you can test this by rinsing the carbon, soaking in saltwater for a day or so, and then testing the water for phosphates, iron, etc.
pledosophy
Active member
If you turn off your lights for 48 continous hours it will be gone. It is photosynthetic and will die without light.
However with light the bacteria has the capability to double itself in 20 minutes.
I've tried everything for cyano, good to find the cause, and eliminate it but to solve the immediate problem just turn off the lights.
However with light the bacteria has the capability to double itself in 20 minutes.
I've tried everything for cyano, good to find the cause, and eliminate it but to solve the immediate problem just turn off the lights.
MonkeeFish
New member
that's like sticking a bandaid over an infection. Then once you take off the bandaid, it will keep growing. IM in the same problem but by turning off the lights. It will be no used once you turn it back on.
Thank you Nicole, pledosophy, and MonkeeFish.
I have taken steps to fix my flow issue. I essentially rolled back all of the changes I made in the last month.
I recently added a chiller to my return path which cut my return flow in half. My water was not moving around much after that. I just got done removing the chiller from my return path and installing a dedicated pump for the chiller. My tank is flowing well again, (a little better than before actually since I put the more powerful of the two pumps on the return). My leathers and other softies are mad at me now since they are getting blasted with water. I'll need to evaluate this potential new problem.
I also cut 2 hours out of my photoperiod. And I skipped a feeding.
My skimmer is jamming now too.
So with reduced light, reduced feeding, improved flow, good skimming, and a good turkey basting of all areas I am starting the battle over but with an advantage this time.
I'll keep you all updated. I'm not resorting to chemical treatment yet.
BTW I have 2750 GPH flow now in my tank. That's about 23x flow. I also moved my Tunze back to the location it was at before the cyano appeared.
THanks
Josh
I have taken steps to fix my flow issue. I essentially rolled back all of the changes I made in the last month.
I recently added a chiller to my return path which cut my return flow in half. My water was not moving around much after that. I just got done removing the chiller from my return path and installing a dedicated pump for the chiller. My tank is flowing well again, (a little better than before actually since I put the more powerful of the two pumps on the return). My leathers and other softies are mad at me now since they are getting blasted with water. I'll need to evaluate this potential new problem.
I also cut 2 hours out of my photoperiod. And I skipped a feeding.
My skimmer is jamming now too.
So with reduced light, reduced feeding, improved flow, good skimming, and a good turkey basting of all areas I am starting the battle over but with an advantage this time.
I'll keep you all updated. I'm not resorting to chemical treatment yet.
BTW I have 2750 GPH flow now in my tank. That's about 23x flow. I also moved my Tunze back to the location it was at before the cyano appeared.
THanks
Josh
pledosophy
Active member
There is a reason to use a band aid, that's why they are so popular.
The other issues have been resolved. The solution to the remaining problem is a time period without light IMO. IME this is the easiest and most effective way to treat cyano.
Cyanobacteria is a very efficent feeder and can live and thrive in optimum conditions, after it has a good foothold IME.
IMO the no light period is more effective then chemicals, it is more natural, and it is more effective. JMO, JME.
I agree with your reasoning pledosophy. WHen it comes to any issue there are two parts to contend with
1) Resolving the immediate issue, and
2) Making sure it never happens again.
I'll take your advice for #1, and #2 will be a long term effort involving me getting better at being an aquarist.
Cheers
Josh
1) Resolving the immediate issue, and
2) Making sure it never happens again.
I'll take your advice for #1, and #2 will be a long term effort involving me getting better at being an aquarist.
Cheers
Josh
MonkeeFish
New member
By not mean am i suggesting the use of chemicals. I try to keep as much out of my tank as possible. I just think that once you turn on the lights again, the cyano will come back.
Or another option is guess is to combine the two. Treat the Immediate problem and then lower the light period and work your way back up to the normal light period as the problem decreases.
tankslave
New member
Algae (including cyano) are just symptoms. You have to fix the root cause, and it will be fine. Besides, if you kill the cyano artificially, it'll just polute the water and make your job harder. It certainly helps to physically remove as much of it as you can, along with making all other necessary changes.
physicslord
New member
Scraping algae week after week is like that Buddhist story of the tiger chasing the man around the tree for all eternity.
Fix the problem, don't just keep running in a circle by scraping the algae.
Fix the problem, don't just keep running in a circle by scraping the algae.
pledosophy
Active member
Did you all fail to read where Josh has fixed the problem?
Cyano can survive on 0 phosphates and 0 nitrates. After removing the cause in some cases it is still necessary to remove the cyano as a seperate issue.
Cyano can survive on 0 phosphates and 0 nitrates. After removing the cause in some cases it is still necessary to remove the cyano as a seperate issue.
physicslord
New member
I doubt his phosphates and nitrates are at zero. But, you're right, the algae will continue to hang in there. You just have to wait.
"Good things happen slowly in a reef aquarium" -E. B.
I've actually been able to kill my algae.
Usually I've noticed it just falls into a big pile of dead skeletons which I can just syphon off.
GTR
Active member
After fighting with what at least looked like red cyno but instead was a bright green I nuked it with no ill effects seen in the tanks. The system at the time was 250 gallons total. 3-40g tanks each getting at least 1000gph flow. Nitrates <5 and PO4 <.02.
I used Maracyn disolved first in FW and dosed three days in a row with the skimmer off and carbon removed. Still none has returned months later and corals are all doing fine. Mostly SPS, but some mixed soft corals.
SteveU
I used Maracyn disolved first in FW and dosed three days in a row with the skimmer off and carbon removed. Still none has returned months later and corals are all doing fine. Mostly SPS, but some mixed soft corals.
SteveU
tankslave
New member
That is simply not true. You may think that when you test for NO3 and PO4 and read zero and see cyano still in your tank, but the reality is that your test kits are severly limited at or below .1ppm. You also arnt typically testing for organically bound NO3 and NO4. Notice that cyano is generally in close proximity to areas where detritus settles, allowing those organically bound nutrients to degrade and be taken up quickly by the algae, without it even entering the main system.
GTR
Active member
I agree with the nitrate test but not the Hanna for PO4. It will measure down to .01, my goal is <.02 tested at least twice a week. If it's higher I act.
My green cyno grew everywhere. Side of the tank right in front on the return, back of the tanks, on frag plugs etc. Water changes did nothing. Adding to the 1000gph would have meant not being able to keep frags upright. Treatment distroyed it all, carbon removed most of the residual and the skimmer went nuts for a couple days after being turned back on. 50% water change the next week insured I was exporting much of the biomass of it's die off. Gone in a less than 2 weeks after battling with other none chemical methods. I'd not hesitate to do in another sytstem.
I'm not saying you can't get rid of it more naturally but I see no need to fight it. Your husbandry issues can deal with stopping it's return much easier than getting rid of it.
SteveU
