ZM's 200g build

[zoomonster]

So is the Apex salinity probe not worth it? I've heard a bunch of people now say it's off from there refractometer. I was going to buy the gold, but not sure now.

Well I'll have a better idea in the next day or two. I'm adding a temp probe to it and will have more calibration fluid for it tomorrow and will try recalibrating. Keep in mind gold does not provide a temp probe for the conductivity module unless you for go using a temp probe for the PH on the main module. I hope I can get it working right because I may need it for ATO. I also have multiple ground probes so that is pretty much ruled out. One thing I didn't mention is the ORP probe seems a little wacked also. I'm finding it hard to believe ORP is only 129 right now but I'll wait and see after recalibrating it again. I'm also going to recalibrate with lights off to make sure none of the eballasts are causing interference. I never had conductivity before but always had and used ORP to control Ozone w/o issue.

 

[dave.m]

I also have multiple ground probes

Be careful. You should only need one. You run the risk of unintentionally creating a ground loop.

Dave.M

 

[zoomonster]

Be careful. You should only need one. You run the risk of unintentionally creating a ground loop.

Dave.M

Yep I'm familiar... should have been more specific in that I have my usual two ground probes. One in tank and one in sump. Pretty sure I'm ok as PH reading is on the money. From what I recall screwy PH readings are usually a good indicator of a ground loop.

 

[zoomonster]

I liked the idea of electronic ballasts but guess that was a bad idea. Yesterday only 2/3 would come on. Today that one worked and a different one was not working. Tried pretty much everything including multiple outlets (direct and Apex) and it just won't come on. After doing some testing now I'm down to just one that will come on. Talked to Hamilton today and they are replacing them all with magnetic ballasts. Excellent company to deal with.

As a side note I ran across several people complaining about Apex refusing to acknowledge an EMF interference issue with electronic ballasts. At least now I can nip that in the bud if it is/will be an issue.

 

[zoomonster]

Lighting

Lighting

I think I had mentioned a while back I was going to replace two of the blue plus T5's with actinics. I got two Giesemann actinics the other day and finally pulled down the fixture to see if I could fix the bank of T5's that stopped working. No cigar the ballast is bad so again waiting for a new T5 ballast from Hamilton due probably late this week. Interesting thing is unlike most fluorescent wiring setups one bulb in bank will work w/o the other so they should have known from the start it was a bad ballast since both bulbs were out. So that's two eballasts and a T5 that went out. They are also sending me a set of new MH bulbs for the hassle. They did offer to send back the whole fixture for repair but that was just to much hassle and I opted to replace the T5 myself.

 

[zoomonster]

Apex

Apex

Apex is mostly up and configured. I did have a problem that seems to occur with the PM1/PM2 (that I could find reference to anyway) where the unit comes online and after a matter of minutes the green light starts flashing and contact is lost. I really thought it was the USB plug socket because when I unmounted it to get the serial number and left it sitting upside down undisturbed it stayed online. Anyway I did a Neptune support ticket Friday morning and after literally a full day of email back and forth someone finally logged on and fixed it. Well at least its mounted again and has stayed online since Friday afternoon. All in all happy they fixed it but their support system absolutely sucks and they don't answer any phone, sales or support ever.

Temp: Because of the way they designed the system each module that uses temp compensation requires its own so I have 3. Gold came with one and I have bought two additional at ~$25 each. Two of the probes are next to each other and one inches away in refugium. Temp seems to not be very accurate with reading now (fuge)77.2, 77.4, 78.1. Compared to things like heater controllers that's not too bad. They can be calibrated but I would need a precision digital thermometer. I'm letting the fuge reading control the heater which also has a thermostat and pretty well maintaining 77-78 when heat is needed.

PH: Seems good. Running at 8.15 right now with just one bank of T5 on. I got my setup the way I wanted it and the Ca reactor is maintaining a pretty stable 6.5. Some data got erased but so far the swing is pretty good at ~8.0-8.18. PH seems to be the one reading that has been trustworthy and consistent. The main reading is also tied into the CO2 setup for shutoff.

ORP: Still don't know what to make of it. I'm giving it time but there may be an issue with low readings. 142-166 is the recorded up swing. Still on the fence about Ozone this time around but may go that route.

Salinity: Just plain off and going to try recalibrating today with temp comp. Reading 27.3-27.8 with a normal trend up and down as makeup water has been added manually each day. At the moment after makeup refract reads 31 and Apex 27.5. Still playing with water levels so salinity is not really set yet.

AMP: These power readings seem to work ok. It was quite useful in seeing what a pig the 800w titanium heater was at ~6.5 amps. I moved that over to one of the 10a relay outlets.

Fusion: For beta the latest C revision just works (B also). I use it on my PC and Android. Generally speaking for setup I still prefer connecting direct to it with the web interface via the Apex browse utility.

Feed: Got the skimmer and Jebao's on Apex and tied to feed. Still need to add in the waveline return pump.

 

[zoomonster]

Ca Reactor

Ca Reactor

I got the Ca reactor/CO2 online the other day and that was about as smooth as any piece of equipment. Literally the only complaint is the cheap little plastic airline valve for effluent that's impossible to adjust. I'll have to find something more usable for controlling effluent rate. Other than that it just works, pump is quiet and it does not leak. It will probably hold close to 2 gallons but to start I'm running it with 1 gallon of Caribsea ARM coarse. The carbondoser regulator rocks too. Hooked up, adjusted and working in minutes. They were short of CO2 when I filled but with 7# I am running at close to 1000# high pressure and low pressure (bubble size) dialed in at about 3.4 pounds. The bubble rate is set at about 2 right now and using Apex PH probe running a pretty consistent 6.5 PH. Time will tell how well the media dissolves and I'll check kh and ca here shortly.

CO2 setup

Fallback OFF
Set ON
If pHCa > 6.70 Then ON
If pHCa < 6.50 Then OFF
If pHSump < 7.95 Then OFF
If Outlet CaPump = OFF Then OFF
Defer 003:00 Then ON

 

[zoomonster]

Instant Ocean

Instant Ocean

Man they really must have screwed with Ca in instant ocean since I last used it. "When dissolved in pure water to a specific gravity of 1.026, Instant Ocean® should provide a solution that has 400 mg/L calcium ion and 1320 mg/L magnesium ion." is not even close at 1.024. Probably to force people to pay more for Reef Crystals. I tested Ca and KH and while KH is 10.5 Ca is so low its off the Red Sea chart at ~150. The lowest they go is .58/290 and I only used .3 so Ca is really low and that's after the Ca reactor running a couple days. I added some Turbo Calcium to see if I can't get the levels up somewhere the reactor can maintain. I'll test that again in a day or two along with Mg. I tested ammonia yesterday and its just starting to register. Assuming the live rock shows up Tuesday that should get the cycle in full swing and I can move along. About the only thing live in tank right now is live sand, some chaeto, and some bacter gen M. Phosphate is close to .02 and have not bothered with anything else. Don't know if its from the cleaned dead rock or the mix of live/dead sand but the skimmer has been pulling some pretty good yellow grunge since it started.

 

[zoomonster]

I went ahead and tested Ca tonight. The 4 tsp of turbo calc last night was a pretty good guesstimate and brought me up to 400. I'll probably add a bit more and get closer to 450. I probably should try and figure out how well the Ca reactor is actually working. It is dissolving at 6.5 because if I shut down the effluent the water starts getting milky pretty fast. I guess this could have been a bad batch of IO (bulk 4 bag box) but I'll have to think about whether I will continue to use it. I had good luck for years but maybe its time to part ways.

 

[dave.m]

Wouldn't you be better off addressing your concerns to Instant Ocean directly?

Dave.M

 

[zoomonster]

Rock ripoff

Rock ripoff

I guess we all get taken by rip off artists once in a while... I really should have better researched the website before ordering. I'm going to start a thread later with pictures so others will chime in with their experiences with Aquacon.com/Saltwater fish depot (and all the other names it has had) so others don't get taken. For the F BBB rating, complaints scattered all over the net there is very little info to be found here other than the occasional snipe about Aquacon. It was actually the delay in my order with no correspondence that prompted me to dig into their background. Once I finally got someone on the phone last week I got a boatload of excuses including under new management and moving for the delay.

Well they did finally ship yesterday and it arrived today. What I ordered was 50# of "hand selected premium Bali Alor rock" in large (8-12"). The shipment was two boxes with exactly two pieces of rock each. The rock is devoid of life, has scant traces of dark purple only coralline (certainly no variety of colors Alor is known for) and are denser/heavier (unlike light Alor) than any rock I have ever handled. Two of the pieces have some decent shape but two are basically near shapeless rocks. Basically it looks like junk base rock that has been buried in the bottom of a sump for years w/o light. Live and learn but I will be going after them by all means. I'll post some pictures tomorrow when I get a chance.

 

[zoomonster]

What aquacon advertises

What aquacon advertises

 

[zoomonster]

What aquacon shipped

What aquacon shipped

Sorry halides not working this side of tank just T5 actinic. The 4 large pieces on the right are the "Premium Bali Alor". Compare that to the unseeded acid etched dead rock next to it. There is one mostly dead yellow sponge and traces of corraline but most of the color is actually green algae. Hardly what works out to $100 per rock.

 

[zoomonster]

Out of tank

Out of tank

 

[zoomonster]

FedEx showed up early today with my MH replacement ballasts. Sure enough I plugged them in and all three MH's working :celeb1: Still a little amazed that 2/3 of the eballasts went bad in a matter of hours and one of the T5 went out. The T5 ballast replacement hopefully will be here by Friday, I can replace it and get everything back on Apex. The M58's are larger, more power hungry and noisier (pretty significant hum) but at least they work. I'd like to put them inside the stand but not sure how well that will work out with size and heat. In the stand it will at least dampen the noise and I could put in sound dampening material. I still need to setup my ATO but once the T5 is replaced that's the last known technical difficulty and hopefully I can start stocking in maybe a few weeks. CUC, then some fish and then start stocking coral and more fish.

 

[zoomonster]

Rock ripoff

Rock ripoff

Aquacon never bothered to respond to my email or call so I just called them. They are a pretty evasive bunch when it comes to answers and about the only thing I got out of them is they can't ship anymore rock this week but will be sending me a complete new order on Monday no charge and no return. I did ask if it would be anything remotely like what's advertised or the same garbage with no real answer other than a little attitude. I'll see when Tuesday comes what they actually send. Same crap again and next call is to CC company. No more chances.

BTW as an FYI they seem to have multiple names, numbers and websites. This is yet another that appeared on my bank statement.
QUALITYMARINELIFE COM 954-362-7588 FL

qualitymarinelife.com basically leads you to a slightly different website than aquacon.com (saltwater fish depot) with Quality Marine Life, Inc.

 

[Volcom698]

So how is the Apex for you then? I always thought there customer service was supposed to be good. I'm still trying to decide on a controller, not sure who to go with. Still strongly considering the apex.

 

[zoomonster]

So how is the Apex for you then? I always thought there customer service was supposed to be good. I'm still trying to decide on a controller, not sure who to go with. Still strongly considering the apex.

Neptune was good once I got someone. My issue was wasting a day of emails back and forth, with long delays between, before someone decided they could help me. Like I said before they just don't answer phones, don't have a phone queue and have an attitude of don't call us we'll call you. They seem to have/had a defective run of PM1/PM2's and it goes like this... 1) They manually attempt to adjust for the issue. 2) Then if it stays online hours-days your good otherwise it will need to be an RMA. My issue was with PM1 not PM2.

I did sit down and finally got the conductivity working. Couple factors...
1) Used different calibration solution brand (Pinpoint) at 53.0 mS same as last time.
2) Bought and attached a temp probe to PM2. What gets me is the comp range is manually entered at 2.1-2.3 rather arbitrarily and the temp probe is not put in solution with the probe. I took advise from a post and entered 2.2. Pretty sure this was the most critical factor and most don't read the documentation where its says you must use a temp probe plugged into the PM2. And of course gold does not include the extra temp probe, cond does not work well w/o it and you need the one it does include for PH.
3) When calibrated salinity now measures 30 same as calibrated refractometer. Still adjusting water level and adding rock so number is irrelevant other than the two are the same.

I had mentioned ORP readings but suspect that was the product of a new tank. I've only ever added ORP to established tanks. Slow process but as the tank comes alive the number is slowly but surely climbing and is over 200 now. I don't even pretend to understand the intricacies of ORP. At most I will use it as a control point for ozone.

Everything is working as expected now and satisfied with the product and recommend it. This is my second Neptune controller and no regrets. Like anything else reef related expect some setup and tweak time before everything's the way you want it.

 

[zoomonster]

Well the replacement T5 ballast came today and thought I would knock that out tonight. Only problem is they sent the wrong ballast for 2x55w instead of 2x80w. They are supposed to ship today so sometime next week maybe I can finally get this taken care of. The MH replacement ballasts seem to be working good and the only issue with that is they are hotter than hell. Being the light is a bit of a pain to take down I'm not moving the ballasts and organizing the wiring until I repair the T5. So that mess stays for probably another week.

On a more positive note the tank cycle is moving along and should be able to start stocking some soon. There's an old indicator that's worked for me... I have spots of brown algae forming on rock and sand. When it turns green I'll test but the tank should be good to go for at least CUC. I finally made a half assed attempt last night to stack/rearrange all the rock. Better than it was but not remotely where I want it yet and of course I'm supposed to be getting 50# of replacement rock on Tuesday. I'm probably going to end up removing some of the smaller stuff to sump or storage. Just too cluttered...

 

[zoomonster]

Oh yeah... I have been looking for a light that would be good/work for my small refugium. Probably a crap shoot but found a 48 led clip on at EBay for $15 the other day. Funny thing is that's probably what most of the small "aquarium" or "refugium" lights are really worth vs. $50-$100+.
It has 40 white and 8 blue leds. Not exactly a plant light with no red but I'll see how it works out. If its the right spectrum the white should provide red. Can't really go wrong at $15 shipped.