180 gallon sump

[IUfan]

Another question, this time: sump size.

Can I get away with a 40B sump? I know this is small for a 180, but I really wanted to have more space in the cabinet, I didnt want it mostly taken up by the sump.

I have measured it out, allowing 18x18 for Skimmer, 18x9 for return pump, and 18x10 for refugium. Would that be enough or does it sound like this is going to create problems later down the line.

Let me know your thoughts, appreciate the input.

The Petco in my area is having a $ per gallon sale this weekend so I'm keen to go and get the sump.

Have a great day.

 

[KJAhp098]

I don't think a fuge that size would benefit much in keeping your nitrates low. Nonetheless, it will be good to house microfauna.

 

[KJAhp098]

Is it possible to build upwards instead of outwards? Maybe build a stand where you can put a 30 gallon or so tank above the 40 breeder and dedicate one of them to just a fuge.

 

[canar]

lol I opened this thread going wow I have a 100 gallon sump and I thought mine was big. How big is this tank if it has a 180 gallon sump? ROFL

 

[IUfan]

@Canar. Hahaha yeah I wish I had a display tank that needed a 180 sump. Sorry for misleading ya, was in petco and was typing it out quickly.

@KJAhp098 that sounds interesting, I have loads of room upwards, it's 36" tall, so height isn't an issue. But crap, that is gonna be fricking complicated to plumb :S. I did go ahead and buy the 40 breeder just now, I knew that 36 long was all I wanted to go, so I sacrificed volume for space, and scored big on the $ p/gallon sale felt pretty good.

So to @KJAhp098 point, anyone have experience in stacking a fuge on top of there sump? And how this may be achieved? I'm a total newb at plumbing in the first place so I'm gonna need some advice here.

Thanks all iufan

 

[DopeCantWin]

Would you get an external Skimmer? Why do you need the space?

 

[IUfan]

I want to put the quarantine tank down there and also the RO reservoir, and whatever else, I just want lots of space in the cabinet really.

 

[KJAhp098]

That's what I'll be doing with my 180. I'll probably buy a heavy duty stackable stand from costco and stack my 30g fuge over my 40 breeder.

 

[DopeCantWin]

Just food for thought, this is my 125 gallon sump underneath a 210

The first two chambers with the water are for water changes/quarantine. They're each 21 gallons.

 

[DopeCantWin]

Just food for thought, this is my 125 gallon sump underneath a 210

The first two chambers with the water are for water changes/quarantine. They're each 21 gallons.

 

[GumbyIl]

I have a 30g fuge inside a 75g tank. The fuge is filled to the top and, in fact, overflows into the 75. The 75 is filled about half way, about 10", with the skimmer in the sump as well so maybe 20-25g of water in just the sump. I've never have measurable nitrates.

So I guess what I'm saying is a 30g sump with a 30g fuge should be OK. Depends on LR in the tank and stocking. More volume is better.

 

[IUfan]

I think I'm gonna just stick to the 40, been thinking about the complications of stacking tanks and I think it's gonna be too complicated. The fuge area may be a bit small, but I plan on using a BRS dual reactor with carbon/gfo to control nitrate/phosphate anyway.

I suppose in the future if i want more volume i can stack another tank, and run the overflow through it.

 

[IUfan]

Question, does anyone sell sump baffles? Like kits that are already cut and made and ready to install?

 

[synofreak]

Why not just baffle the fuge higher. If the 180 has 2 drains, send one to the skimmer, and one to the fuge, or split the drain if its a single. I run a 40 on my 125, does pretty well. My skimmer baffles are 9", over under over to return, and my fuge baffle is 13" just over to return. I dont run socks on my drains however. You'll have the height to go 14"with the fuge baffle also. The return and skimmer area can easily handle the power outage overflow.

With the height in the stand, you could easily mod a turf scrubber that runs into the fuge also with some plexi and screening.

As for baffles, just hit the hardware store and get some glass cut to fit. Some hardware stores cut glass for you for .50-$1 per cut if you can find some glass, no guarentee on breakage though. Some glass tops for tanks are tall enough for skimmer baffles. Just a thought.

 

[fishuntbike]

you can order acrylic from streamwood plastic (847) 895-9190 cut to size, ship or pick up from schaumburg.

 

[goat585]

I would be concerned with the amount of water back siphoning into the sump in the event of a power outage. A couple of inches of water for a 180 could be 20-30 gallons of water. Your sump may not be able to handle that much water and you will have a flood. You may need to use a check valve. I have a 240 with a couple of other tanks going into a 120 sump and I back siphon 60 gallons of water into my sump. My sump does not have a refugium though. It is worth calculating it all out to make sure. If it was me I would use no smaller than a 75 gallon on a 180.

 

[DopeCantWin]

I would be concerned with the amount of water back siphoning into the sump in the event of a power outage. A couple of inches of water for a 180 could be 20-30 gallons of water. Your sump may not be able to handle that much water and you will have a flood. You may need to use a check valve. I have a 240 with a couple of other tanks going into a 120 sump and I back siphon 60 gallons of water into my sump. My sump does not have a refugium though. It is worth calculating it all out to make sure. If it was me I would use no smaller than a 75 gallon on a 180.

If the turnover was low enough, say 1000 gph, I don't think that would be a problem, but definitely worth calculating it out.

 

[goat585]

If the turnover was low enough, say 1000 gph, I don't think that would be a problem, but definitely worth calculating it out.

It is not an issue of turnover. It is the amount of water above your lowest return line that is the problem assuming you are not using a check valve. Say your return is 2 inches below the water line of the display tank. Take 72" X 24" X 2"= 3456 square inches of water (15 gallons) that will siphon out if the power goes out. That is almost half of the 40 breeder sump. If you go to 3" below which is more you are now at 22.5 gallons which is more likely to cause a problem.

Lets assume his below chamber sizes. 18x18 for a skimmer needs to be 8" deep for most skimmers to work properly so there will be 11 gallons of water in that chamber. 18x10 for the refugium lets sat 7 inches deep for that which is another 6 gallons. 18x8"x4" deep for the return is another 3 gallons of water. If you add that together the sump will hold approx 20 gallons of water when running. So if you have 2" of water above return he should be okay but it will be really close to over flowing the sump. If there are 3" of water over the return line ther will be 3-5 gallons of water on the floor. Personally I would not chance a 40 breeder. I don't just my math that much plus I prefer more space in my sumps.

Hope this helps

 

[DopeCantWin]

It is not an issue of turnover. It is the amount of water above your lowest return line that is the problem assuming you are not using a check valve. Say your return is 2 inches below the water line of the display tank. Take 72" X 24" X 2"= 3456 square inches of water (15 gallons) that will siphon out if the power goes out. That is almost half of the 40 breeder sump. If you go to 3" below which is more you are now at 22.5 gallons which is more likely to cause a problem.

Lets assume his below chamber sizes. 18x18 for a skimmer needs to be 8" deep for most skimmers to work properly so there will be 11 gallons of water in that chamber. 18x10 for the refugium lets sat 7 inches deep for that which is another 6 gallons. 18x8"x4" deep for the return is another 3 gallons of water. If you add that together the sump will hold approx 20 gallons of water when running. So if you have 2" of water above return he should be okay but it will be really close to over flowing the sump. If there are 3" of water over the return line ther will be 3-5 gallons of water on the floor. Personally I would not chance a 40 breeder. I don't just my math that much plus I prefer more space in my sumps.

Hope this helps

That can be easily addressed via drilling a tiny hole at the top of the return to break the siphon.

 

[synofreak]

If your back siphoning that much, on a standard durso, there not setup right. I guess we should ask the op what his plumbing is and how much his pump would be pushing his drains max. In my standard reef ready 125 with megaflows, it might be 5 or 6 gallons when the return pump is off. Might go into my skimmer section by an inch and the top baffle is about 10" or so. My topoff keeps my return at around 8-8.25". Of coarse, my pump doesn't push the drains max, thats playin with fire(or water).