200g display + Sump Plans

[i Tuna]

With the recent leakage issue I've been having with my 24" cube sps reef, I have decided to upgrade to a larger system.

This time around though I want to avoid as many issues as possible and try to plan / think ahead with the design to accommodate any extra add-on's / filtration devises that I may or may not install in the near future.

Here is a pic of my general layout with some measurements that I put together real quick:

http://s1217.beta.photobucket.com/user/Drukkar/media/Aquariumv1.jpg.html?sort=3&o=0


The plan for the overflow is to go simple and have it be all glass,with the sides painted either a sky blue or white. I have no plans on adding any sort of mesh as of yet, but I think I may have issues with the sound of water splashing down so I'll probably incorporate a "muffler" to quite the noise.

As for the sump, the 2nd compartment is meant to hold the skimmer, I didn't specify the size of the compartment yet since it will be determined by the Skimmer I decide to use.

3rd compartment is to be used as a mini refugium, which I may add some eggcrate to the bottom to prevent any Chaeto from escaping and clogging up the return power head in the 4th and final compartment.

Please do no hesitate to criticize the plans and state how I could make this system more efficient / reliable.

I tried to minimize any possibility of a dead zone in the sump so hopefully that should be taken care of. At a future date I plan to add a Ca reactor but I have not had the time to properly educate myself on the matter, so I'll need the expertise of the rest of you Reef Central folk

Thanks in advance,

Walid.

 

[i Tuna]

Bump~ 63 views and not a single one of you think that this sump / overflow could be improved? :O

Walid

 

[caribfan]

I am in the early stages of redesigning my 75 gallon sump on my 120 DT, so I was interested in your thread.

One comment I might make, I believe the distance from the bottom of the sump, to the top of the plates that are attached to the glass on the bottom, willl be your overall water height in the sump. It looks from your pictures that those pieces that are attached to the bottom of the aquarium stop only a few inches away from the top. I might think about lowering those, especially if you are going to use filter socks in the first section, otherwise, you would have an almost full aquarium.

So on sumps like this, what are the main processors of Ammonia and Nitrite? My current set up uses bio balls and I plan to move away from them because I believe they are cranking out nitrates faster than any of the biological processes in my aqauarium can handle them. What are you planning to use to facilitate the nitrogen cycle?

Also, I am only about 3 months in, but I might recommend looking at the ATS thread and possibly considering incorporating one of those on your system.

 

[i Tuna]

I am in the early stages of redesigning my 75 gallon sump on my 120 DT, so I was interested in your thread.

One comment I might make, I believe the distance from the bottom of the sump, to the top of the plates that are attached to the glass on the bottom, willl be your overall water height in the sump. It looks from your pictures that those pieces that are attached to the bottom of the aquarium stop only a few inches away from the top. I might think about lowering those, especially if you are going to use filter socks in the first section, otherwise, you would have an almost full aquarium.

So on sumps like this, what are the main processors of Ammonia and Nitrite? My current set up uses bio balls and I plan to move away from them because I believe they are cranking out nitrates faster than any of the biological processes in my aqauarium can handle them. What are you planning to use to facilitate the nitrogen cycle?

Also, I am only about 3 months in, but I might recommend looking at the ATS thread and possibly considering incorporating one of those on your system.

Hi Carib, as per your statement about the glass dividers / plates, yes the ones attached to the bottom will determine the water level of the sump in the Skimmer compartment. However, the ones that are slightly above are meant to have the water move in a up and down motion to prevent any 'dead zones' with no flow. The water will not fill up the whole tank as I'll be leaving at least 5 inches of space above the uppermost dividers of the sump and the top of the sump to avoid having any water spill out due to bubbles bursting / water overflowing.

As for your question to the Nitrogen cycle.
Mainly I'll be relying on live rock in the display and the bacteria within, as well as heavy skimming from a reliable Protein Skimmer to remove organic Nitrate and Phosphate.

Bio-balls, from what reading I've done, are a nitrate trap. In the long run they end up trapping detritus, which in turn isn't removed from the system and is then processed into nitrates by the bacteria that is colonizing the bio-balls. But don't take my word, double check it to make sure.

Removal of nitrate/phosphate is going to be done by the mini refuge compartment via harvesting of chaeto. I plan on having an LED strip directly above that area.

If I overstock the tank, I'll end up employing probiotic methods like vinegar or biopellets.

As for the ATS, I suppose you mean Auto Top-off System? I already have a JBJ one I'm using on my current system that I'll just transfer over. I'll be adding a separate reservoir that can be closed, to minimize evaporation of the top off water.

 

[glarior]

I would suggest adding a little extra space between the baffles... have it wide enough to fit your hand between them if you ever needed to clean something from there.

Don't forget to estimate how much water will flow back into the sump if the power goes out.

Bioballs... only convert ammonia to nitrites to nitrates... you need something else in the system to remove nitrates. There are multiple ways to do this... algae scrubber, nitrate reactor, lots of LR, big fuge... etc etc

I just built a 5x2x2ft acrylic sump for my setup. It will use filter pad, bio balls, K1 kaldness fluidized media, algae scrubber, fuge and skimmer. I will be able to feed .75lb of food a day.

May consider a emergency drain on top of the sump. If for some reason the ATO failed or to much water drained into the sump from the display.... it would flow out of the sump and not overfill and flood the floor.

Going to be a nice build!

 

[lukehouse356]

If I were in your position I would go with BeanAnimal's overflow design for silent failsafe running.

http://www.beananimal.com/projects/silent-and-fail-safe-aquarium-overflow-system.aspx

 

[SantaMonica]

As for the ATS, I suppose you mean Auto Top-off System?

He probably means the Algal Turf Scrubber thread.

 

[i Tuna]

I would suggest adding a little extra space between the baffles... have it wide enough to fit your hand between them if you ever needed to clean something from there.

Don't forget to estimate how much water will flow back into the sump if the power goes out.

Bioballs... only convert ammonia to nitrites to nitrates... you need something else in the system to remove nitrates. There are multiple ways to do this... algae scrubber, nitrate reactor, lots of LR, big fuge... etc etc

I just built a 5x2x2ft acrylic sump for my setup. It will use filter pad, bio balls, K1 kaldness fluidized media, algae scrubber, fuge and skimmer. I will be able to feed .75lb of food a day.

May consider a emergency drain on top of the sump. If for some reason the ATO failed or to much water drained into the sump from the display.... it would flow out of the sump and not overfill and flood the floor.

Going to be a nice build!

Spacing between each baffle will be about 2 inches, the same as my current sump, which is wide enough for me to place an algae scraper within, in case I need to clean.

Also, how do u come up with the figure of 0.75lb of food a day?

Good idea on the emergency drain for the sump, I'll put it into the plans and update once I have the time

Thanks for the help Glarior!

 

[i Tuna]

If I were in your position I would go with BeanAnimal's overflow design for silent failsafe running.

http://www.beananimal.com/projects/silent-and-fail-safe-aquarium-overflow-system.aspx

Interesting read, I'll see about incorporating it into the design.

And Welcome to Reef Central!

 

[i Tuna]

He probably means the Algal Turf Scrubber thread.

Thanks for the clarification

 

[glarior]

Spacing between each baffle will be about 2 inches, the same as my current sump, which is wide enough for me to place an algae scraper within, in case I need to clean.

Also, how do u come up with the figure of 0.75lb of food a day?

Good idea on the emergency drain for the sump, I'll put it into the plans and update once I have the time

Thanks for the help Glarior!

50l of K1 kaldness can handle .50lbs. I have a big enough area to use 75l. This is not including the bio balls. The system will be able to take care of any ammonia/nitrites I have. However, my current scrubber build can handle ~0.3lbs per day. It is expandable but If I ever start to feed more I will look into heterotrophic bacteria denitrification method... aka Dr Tim's NP Active Perals (here)
If you really want to get your science geek on check this out Great presentation about solid phase denitrification (SPD) :reading:

 

[i Tuna]

50l of K1 kaldness can handle .50lbs. I have a big enough area to use 75l. This is not including the bio balls. The system will be able to take care of any ammonia/nitrites I have. However, my current scrubber build can handle ~0.3lbs per day. It is expandable but If I ever start to feed more I will look into heterotrophic bacteria denitrification method... aka Dr Tim's NP Active Perals (here)
If you really want to get your science geek on check this out Great presentation about solid phase denitrification (SPD) :reading:

That kaldnes stuff is simply going to serve the same purpose that LR does, providing an area for bacteria to grow to keep ammonia / nitrite down. It doesn't mention anything about nitrates / phosphate which are usually the problem in reef aquaria.

Nice read I already employ biopellets in my current 24" cube sps system. However, the more I feed the more phosphate accumulates, but my nitrate is at 0.

 

[glarior]

That kaldnes stuff is simply going to serve the same purpose that LR does, providing an area for bacteria to grow to keep ammonia / nitrite down. It doesn't mention anything about nitrates / phosphate which are usually the problem in reef aquaria.

Nice read I already employ biopellets in my current 24" cube sps system. However, the more I feed the more phosphate accumulates, but my nitrate is at 0.

Yep, kaldnes is only for ammonia to nitrite.

For nitrates that is where the scrubber or pearls come in. Live rock will do the same thing, however, using the 1lbs per 1g of LR would have cost me $2,100 vs $100 for kaldnes and $300 LED acrylic scrubber.

If I was going to go any bigger I would have used the pearls and upgraded the skimmer. At a certain point it would be cheaper to go that route.

My personal belief is a 100% sustained aquatic ecosystem. No water changes, everything works in unison. The only addition is the elements used by the corals and RO/DI water evaporated


Off subject:

How do you like the biopellets?

What type of lights do you use on that SPS tank?

 

[SantaMonica]

My personal belief is a 100% sustained aquatic ecosystem. No water changes, everything works in unison. The only addition is the elements used by the corals and RO/DI water evaporated

Mine too.

 

[i Tuna]

Yep, kaldnes is only for ammonia to nitrite.

For nitrates that is where the scrubber or pearls come in. Live rock will do the same thing, however, using the 1lbs per 1g of LR would have cost me $2,100 vs $100 for kaldnes and $300 LED acrylic scrubber.

If I was going to go any bigger I would have used the pearls and upgraded the skimmer. At a certain point it would be cheaper to go that route.

My personal belief is a 100% sustained aquatic ecosystem. No water changes, everything works in unison. The only addition is the elements used by the corals and RO/DI water evaporated


Off subject:

How do you like the biopellets?

What type of lights do you use on that SPS tank?

Well, to be honest I don't know what to think about the biopellets... Don't get me wrong they've been running on my tank for a good 5 months or so. Throughout the entire time though, I had not really had any algae issues other than the occasional carpet of cyano that would pop up on dying colonies of Zoa's. Algae on the tank walls usually took 4-6 days to get grow enough for me to notice to clean the walls. The main issue I have with the pellets is that they do not reduce phosphate enough (at least on my system). At the moment my system is nitrate limited, so phosphate just begins to accumulate, which I've recently begun to employ GFO to lower those level's. Also another thing I've noticed (not sure if this is biopellet related or not), but all SPS that comes into my system end up pulling back their polyps to 1/2 the size that they were in the LFS I got them at, and end up looking like their layer of flesh is 1/2 as thick... I assumed that this is due to the constantly low nutrients in the system.

As for lights, currently I have a Radion xr30w fixture set to 20k at 90% brightness for a photoperiod of 8 hours + 2 hours at 20% brightness. I also have a Kessil A350 pendant on the same tank that will eventually get used once I reach the max 100% brightness on the Radion. I'm trying to achieve a higher par source of 20k light, which IMO the Radion with no TIR lens can not achieve. The Radion seems good for 12 inches and above, however any lower and it seems like corals begin to become light starved.

 

[i Tuna]

Mine too.

I would love to do the same... However every time I slack on water changes, parameters go out of whack... Still trying to find the "best" method or rather one that I am satisfied with and requires minimum monotonous maintenance. Taking a clump of algae out of the sump once a week and cleaning the walls once a week doesn't seem like too bad of a maintenance schedule for me to upkeep

 

[glarior]

I would love to do the same... However every time I slack on water changes, parameters go out of whack... Still trying to find the "best" method or rather one that I am satisfied with and requires minimum monotonous maintenance. Taking a clump of algae out of the sump once a week and cleaning the walls once a week doesn't seem like too bad of a maintenance schedule for me to upkeep

Thanks for the light information.

Cleaning the wall is easier than cleaning the filter pad or skimmer.

the "best" method is the one that works for you and your budget. The main goal is to get everything to grow healthy!

Good luck

 

[i Tuna]

Thanks for the light information.

Cleaning the wall is easier than cleaning the filter pad or skimmer.

the "best" method is the one that works for you and your budget.

Your welcome. I'll look into modding my sump to be able to include a ATS in case I decide to use one.

The main goal is to get everything to grow healthy!

Good luck

Definitely agree! I just need to find that niche of how many fish I can stock to how much nutrient control needs to be employed to have a stable, diverse and healthy reef system.

 

[Jeff000]

Make the sump bigger. 40cm deep (front to back) when the display is 70, seems like you should have enough room to get a 60cm deep sump in there.

I never once wished I had a smaller sump.

 

[lukehouse356]

Any updates?