~300g build questions.

[Jeff000]

Right now I have a 90g that has been up and running for about a year. I really with I went big from the get go. Funny thing is I was thinking that the 90 was big when I first started. ha.

Anyways, I am looking at a 72x30x30 tank. Mostly SPS and fish.
I'll need a calcium reactor, or doser. But is there a set up that uses a controller to minimize issues that can arise from a doser or reactor?

And for flow, what is the most efficient way to do this? Right now I have a pair of tunze 6055's, I figure these will be far to small, but I like them.
Are a couple of bigger power heads the best way? closed loops? Should I just add a tunze 6205 and use it to make a wave, and then use my 6055's to kind of supplement the dead spots?

This is looking far more expensive then I first thought.

I have custom Cree 3w LED lighting right now that I will just be adding to so that I can cover the new tank, although for a bit the new tank might be a little dim on the ends.

I have been peeking through all the build threads, and look forward to starting my own, but these are still questions I have.

Thanks.

 

[maik1]

$1500- $2500 for a Skimmer, make sure you have the money for this project before you start. It sure will add up.

Maik1

 

[jpsika08]

Good luck on your new project, what I would suggest you to do is a pre-planning on everything, the reactor and doser is the last thing you should worry on the first stage.

Tank, stand, lights, pumps, heaters, sump, systems involved (ex, fuge, frag tank, etc).
There are lots of things you need to take care of, the better you do this the more cost effective the project will be.

Go through the large tanks thread at the first page, usually most of them have a list of equipment, you can get a good idea here of what is needed.

Again, good luck, any questions in the process just shoot.

 

[Jeff000]

Tank, 72x30x30
Sump, 48x22x26 (maybe taller so it can handle a power outage without flooding)
Stand, Custom, plywood and solid trim. With custom canopy.
Lights, Custom LED, would just add onto my current custom LED.
Heaters, not really a thought.

Sump will be one drain section large enough to house whatever skimmer I get and still have some room, then the return section, and then whatever is left will be a DSB fuge frag rack holder. I am not planning on having a lot of frags, but will have led lighting for it. I can really make the sump bigger if needed. And might just for fun to have more water volume.

The sump will not be under the tank. It will be out the back into a different room. but directly behind the tank.
Without knowing the skimmer and return pump and if I need closed loops etc it is hard to finish planning.
I was thinking of going 3 phase motors on a vfd for the closed loop, if I need it, so then I can have the pumps ramp up and down, and I still have some flow control. Could also run the return the same way, but do I go internal? external?

What controller is the best to control what calcium reactor? or do I go dosing instead of reactor?

 

[jpsika08]

It seems like a great setup.

Skimmer: that's up to you if you want to go External or Internal, if you have the room, I would go external, you can avoid overflow problems, I love my External skimmer and if I ever change it, it will be for another external.

Pump, I recently changed my Reeflo Gold Dart external for a Water Blaster HY-16,000 Internal, what I like about this pump is that all the inner housing is made of silicone, so no algae or calcium attaches to it, also, it's really powerful, I'm returning water to the DT, this divided into four 1.5" lines, with the same pump I'm feeding three reactors, fuge and the skimmer, and still I got more juice left for pushing water to the DT (Valve at 70% open).

On the controller, I got the Neptune Apex, what I like about it is that it's cost effective, proven to work and really expandable, with this I got an extra module for a second PH that goes into my GEO CA reactor, I got full control of it with the Apex.

For that size of tank, go with the Ca Reactor, on the long run it's going to be cheaper.

 

[Jeff000]

I can really make the room if needed for the external pumps, just always worried about leaks I guess.
That gold dart is an expensive pump, is it pretty quiet?
How do you have it plumbed to provide water for everything? So I could have it feed a carbon reactor, calcium reactor, skimmer, and fuge section? And still pump enough into the DT to use the flow as well flow for the tank?

With the controller do you need the two PH probes and the ORP to have it control the CA reactor? And then the apex controls the CA level in the tank right?

I was thinking about the Deltec skimmer, but everything is pretty expensive. I have a Tunze 9410 right now, and it says up to 270g, but not sure I can see it, but figure it might be ok for a bit as I will be stocked pretty light for a while.


1100 for the tank
250 for the sump
500 for the gold dart
700 for ca reactor and stuff for it
1000 for controller and accessories needed
300 in misc parts

And still need flow in the tank, as I don't think a pair of 6055's will do. lol.
And then 1000 in a couple months for a skimmer.

 

[maik1]

I can really make the room if needed for the external pumps, just always worried about leaks I guess.
That gold dart is an expensive pump, is it pretty quiet?
How do you have it plumbed to provide water for everything? So I could have it feed a carbon reactor, calcium reactor, skimmer, and fuge section? And still pump enough into the DT to use the flow as well flow for the tank?

With the controller do you need the two PH probes and the ORP to have it control the CA reactor? And then the apex controls the CA level in the tank right?

I was thinking about the Deltec skimmer, but everything is pretty expensive. I have a Tunze 9410 right now, and it says up to 270g, but not sure I can see it, but figure it might be ok for a bit as I will be stocked pretty light for a while.


1100 for the tank
250 for the sump
500 for the gold dart
700 for ca reactor and stuff for it
1000 for controller and accessories needed
300 in misc parts

And still need flow in the tank, as I don't think a pair of 6055's will do. lol.
And then 1000 in a couple months for a skimmer.

Sounds right, now double it! And you're still not done. I had a budget of $11000. Less than a year later I stopped counting at $21000.

Maik1

 

[maik1]

Sorry if I sound negative Jeff000 but once you start you can't stop. If money is an issue don't do it. You have to have a realistic plan and stick with it.

http://reefcentral.com/forums/showthread.php?t=2044202

Maik1

 

[Jeff000]

Sounds right, now double it! And you're still not done. I had a budget of $11000. Less than a year later I stopped counting at $21000.

Maik1

I'm not going to budget any rock/sand/coral/fish/salt. As they will just be whatever they be.

Just trying to keep a handle on initial hardware costs.
While money is always an issue, having 10k in a fish tank is not going to effect my day to day life all that much. But it would be nice to spread that cost out over at least a couple months.

My main issue is that the tank will be going where my current 90g is, so I need to have a plan and have everything ready to move, although I will set up the sump first and turn it into my fish tank while I finish everything else off.

 

[jpsika08]

I can really make the room if needed for the external pumps, just always worried about leaks I guess.
That gold dart is an expensive pump, is it pretty quiet?
How do you have it plumbed to provide water for everything? So I could have it feed a carbon reactor, calcium reactor, skimmer, and fuge section? And still pump enough into the DT to use the flow as well flow for the tank?

With the controller do you need the two PH probes and the ORP to have it control the CA reactor? And then the apex controls the CA level in the tank right?

I was thinking about the Deltec skimmer, but everything is pretty expensive. I have a Tunze 9410 right now, and it says up to 270g, but not sure I can see it, but figure it might be ok for a bit as I will be stocked pretty light for a while.


1100 for the tank
250 for the sump
500 for the gold dart
700 for ca reactor and stuff for it
1000 for controller and accessories needed
300 in misc parts

And still need flow in the tank, as I don't think a pair of 6055's will do. lol.
And then 1000 in a couple months for a skimmer.

Yes, the Super Gold Dart is very quiet, what you would need is a Tee Off with valve on the return line to the DT, with this Tee you can connect the rest of the equipment.

To connect the Reactors and rest of the equipment I would suggest a manifold, to connect each device.

With the Apex, I got 2 PH's Probes, one within the Sump that tells me the main system ph and the other one in the reactor, the Apex won't control the Calcium in the tank, but, it will control the solenoid on the CO2 to open and close with a PH range you establish.

To control the Calcium on the tank, well that should be done in the traditional testing method, you establish at one point the CA Reactor, measure the next 24 hours again and keep dialing it until the current setup meets the actual demand.

I have the Super Reef Octopus XP-5000 External Skimmer which is for up to 600g, is not that expensive and works great, I think this brand has the best value for the buck, not saying is the best, but for the money sure is.

I think you're missing some things but the list is a good start. Maybe think about more lightning, the rocks and sand, also, about the stand manufacturing and parts, believe or not, all the plumbing required for these tanks is expensive, I have spent over $ 1,000 just on plumbing, it's ridiculous I know.

 

[prop-frags]

Good setup so far Jeff.
It's always best to plan, take the time to put everything down on paper, then research everything thoroughly. Think it through. Just as you are doing, read this forum - find the build threads that most closely mimic what you are trying to accomplish, and cherry-pick design ideas from them. Read some more, adjust your plans, repeat. This is the best way to avoid making costly initial purchases that you have to either regretfully live with or throw away and re-invest later. So many fantastic reef keepers have put very detailed threads out here that describe what they've done, the mistakes they've made, and how they've corrected them - as long as you are willing to read it and incorporate that knowledge into your plan, you can really save money, time and anguish.

Consider the maintenance and upkeep time and expense of each decision. Many times, up-front investments save a bunch in the long run, and in other cases early adoption won't pay off at all.

A couple of things for you to contemplate:
1) for a large tank, make triple sure you have adequate support and structure for the tank. This includes the stand, flooring, sub-structure under your house, etc. Do not discount the importance of this!
2) go as big as your space and budget allow. You will find for things like sump space, skimmer capacity, drain lines and plumbing, etc., that bigger is truly better. More water volume can make a huge difference in absorbing equipment (and operator!) malfunctions such as run-away auto top-off incidents, or adding too much of this or that.
3) Obsess about fault tolerance. When you go into the world of large tanks, you are investing a ton of money and time. You have a large amount of livestock depending on your design, the quality of your equipment, and your maintenance and husbandry habits. Make sure to ask "what can go wrong" with each component and what you will do when it fails - you know that it will fail. This is some of what Maik is advising - "take your estimate and double it" is a rule of thumb, but consider what you'll do about losing a main return pump in the middle of a holiday weekend, or losing your electricity during a big winter storm, etc.

 

[maik1]

Thank you Prop-frags you explained it perfectly. Looking back I'm not sure I knew what I was getting into with upgrading to 300G.

Maik1