5017 Osmolator - Toast?

[Gbear]

Roger, I have been using a couple 5017's with great success. My first unit which has been tending my main system for 4 years plus seems to be on the outs however. I need a professional opinion before I give up on it.
This is obviously the older version where the led stick out the front of the case. My second unit is the newer style and tends my Q system.
All is well on that front.

Anyway yesterday I had the blinking red light. (Low level - unable to top up inside of 5 or 10 minutes what ever the time is) I disconnected the power a few times, had odd results, basically I could see the green and or yellow leds faintly flicking. I then inspected the sensor, looks fine. I then looked at the pump. It wasn't getting power or perhaps was dead. I keep a spare pump on hand as I have already worn one out in the past. Once installed and power restored everything seemed to be working correctly.
Not quite however.
Today once home from work I have the blinking red light again and my sump is down about 3 inches. This means it stopped working very shortly after I thought I had it fixed.
So I am messing with it again and at this point all I can seem to get out of it is a quick flash of the green led when I disconnect the power, other than that no lights and no pumping.
It is not the power supply as I have tried the one from my second unit and I get the same result.
So is this thing toast? I'm topping up about 4 gallons a day and don't want to mess around with this too long. It is a pain for me to move the working unit but unless you have a quick idea for me I'll need to do just that.

Oh, well ya I should mention I have taken it apart and I don't see any signs of corrsion anywhere other than the DC jack itself, which I have tried cleaning and actually bypassing with clip on wires. No dice.
So give it to me straight, it is time to go shopping for a now ATO right?

Thanks for your help.
Stu

 

[rvitko]

Hi Stu,

If this controller was from before late 2008 production it would have had a 800mA limit to power the pump. In late 2008 we changed to a beefier pump (looks the same but is better sealed and needs more power). At that time the pump got a 1200mA limit set on the controller. If you have a new pump on a older controller it will only work at 9V (power supplies at the time were 9V or switchable between 9 and 12) and with the connector and wiring in good condition. If the wiring is corroded or the pump connection the current limit can be exceded. I think this is the issue. I would make sure you have a 9V power supply and the pigtail to the pump has nice shiny copper wire, cut past any black sections and replace the pump connector.

 

[Gbear]

I broke out the soldering iron to ensure a good electical contact.
:thumbsup:
Back in business.

Thanks
Stu

 

[Gbear]

I guess I spoke too soon. I am back where I started.
Is there anything else I might want to try?

 

[rvitko]

At this point, if that didn't do it, or it worked only a short time, it is likely that a transistor is damaged from overheating. It is possible it is repairable, I would give 40/60 odds. If you want to send it to me, I am happy to have a look.

 

[Gbear]

Roger, thank you for the reply.
I had another idea, and so far it is working for me.
Since I have two units I decided to swap the pumps.
Theory being if the old one is now somewhat under powered for the new pumps perhaps it would make a difference. So far about a day and a half up and running with no issues. I'm sure both are newer pumps but the one has been running for a while on my Q system, the other is brand new.

If it goes out again on me I'm going to order a new one. I have had quite enough of manual top up for the time being. The older unit has earned it's keep over the years, might be time to move on and stop trying to nurse this one along. :deadhorse:

I will admit to being somewhat disappointed by the change in the pumps but I can hardly fault Tunze for improving the product.

Thanks again, Stu

 

[rvitko]

In general a new pump will work on an old controller but the key is that the transformer is an older 9V model or 9-12V switched to 9V and that the wiring and connection is clean, higher head pressure also helps.

Yes, it is a bit of a bummer but the double seal has resulted in a much longer pump life and was a worthwhile change.

 

[Gbear]

Well, so much for that. She gave up on me again so I decided to order another unit. Roger does the offer still stand to take a look at this one. I wouldn't mind having a third unit for backup or well you know perhaps another system which my wife would never approve of but yet still could pop up from seemingly nowhere.

I can probably swing a US mailing address if that would make it easier.

Thanks
Stu

 

[rvitko]

Yes, the offer stands and a US address would make things much easier.

Tunze USA
305 Victor St
Austin, TX 78753

Be sure to include a note in the box with phone number or email and a return address.

 

[Gbear]

Roger, you should have it on Wednesday. Via UPS.

 

[Gbear]

I thought it might be Santa making a bit of a ruckus but no it was my Osmolator.
Roger, what does it mean when the Red "Too High" and the Red "Too Low" are both flashing at the same time and the darn thing is beeping away?

It had been working perfectly but it has done this now twice in the last week.
I recenly moved the sensor to one of your filters (Reefpack 250) and suspect this may be a factor.
I can tell you that the controller is almost 4 feet away from the tank and I therefore do not suspect salt water damage. My RODI top off barrel is right next to the unit but I don't think there has been any spills or splashing which could have reached the controller. It is possible. I am going to open it up and have a look but to be fair I am not sure what I should be looking for.
Perhaps the magnets from the Comline filter are the issue? Near as I can tell the float switch is down all the way. It is mounted on it's own magnetic mount right next to the filter. No sump on this tank. There is also a heater mounted on the other side of the Comline filter. Is it in anyway possible that the heater flipping on and off could confuse one of the two osmoslator sensors?

If I am remembering correctly the Green Level light was also lit. The water level is being correctly maintained so all I need to do is cycle the power off and on to the unit. Once it has gone thru it's normal start up sequence it seems to be working perfectly again.

While the issue is easily corrected I certainly do not want to have this continue. It is somewhat alarming and I worry that it may be a sign of some more serious future issue.

Sorry for dragging up the old thread but this is the refurb unit which I purchased after my pervious unit could not be repaired.
Thanks for any input you can provide.
Stu

 

[rvitko]

Too high and too low is an error code that generally means water damage to the controller, but the heater and magnetic fields from other devices are a possibility as is a signal conflict such as the float is pinned up by a magnet or some obstacle and sending a too high signal and the optic sensor is sending a too low signal. I would double check the installation, make sure the float is free to move up and down and no magnetic fields besides the magnet holder for the float is near the float and no magnetic fields are near the controller itself. I have had heaters be the culprit but it seems it is more the "mirage" lines in the water of the rising heat can interfere with the optic sensor, so unless the optic sensor is right above the heater in the same compartment, this should not be the issue.

 

[Gbear]

Roger, the controller looks perfectly clean inside. I don't think there has been any water or other damage. It has been working normally for the past couple days. The float is free to move and does not seem affected by the other magnets. I will let you know if it happens again.

Thanks,
Stu

 

[m3lacoste]

5017 same exact problem

5017 same exact problem

Roger, I have been using a couple 5017's with great success. My first unit which has been tending my main system for 4 years plus seems to be on the outs however. I need a professional opinion before I give up on it.
This is obviously the older version where the led stick out the front of the case. My second unit is the newer style and tends my Q system.
All is well on that front.

Anyway yesterday I had the blinking red light. (Low level - unable to top up inside of 5 or 10 minutes what ever the time is) I disconnected the power a few times, had odd results, basically I could see the green and or yellow leds faintly flicking. I then inspected the sensor, looks fine. I then looked at the pump. It wasn't getting power or perhaps was dead. I keep a spare pump on hand as I have already worn one out in the past. Once installed and power restored everything seemed to be working correctly.
Not quite however.
Today once home from work I have the blinking red light again and my sump is down about 3 inches. This means it stopped working very shortly after I thought I had it fixed.
So I am messing with it again and at this point all I can seem to get out of it is a quick flash of the green led when I disconnect the power, other than that no lights and no pumping.
It is not the power supply as I have tried the one from my second unit and I get the same result.
So is this thing toast? I'm topping up about 4 gallons a day and don't want to mess around with this too long. It is a pain for me to move the working unit but unless you have a quick idea for me I'll need to do just that.

Oh, well ya I should mention I have taken it apart and I don't see any signs of corrsion anywhere other than the DC jack itself, which I have tried cleaning and actually bypassing with clip on wires. No dice.
So give it to me straight, it is time to go shopping for a now ATO right?

Thanks for your help.
Stu

Hi Roger,

Jeremy here. My 5017 has the same exact problem. The unit worked flawlessly for 2 years until I replaced the pump. The controller has a green light when it's level and starts to blink when I take out water to simulate trigger the low level but the pump won't turn on. I had this same problem last month and was about to send it in but then I had it unplugged for a day and the pump started to work. Well I came home today and had a red light low level. I filled the sump to get a green level light but it won't turn on the pump when I simulate a low level and no pump light indicator either. should I send it in? Also when I unplug the controller and plug back in, there is no pump activation.

Thanks,
Jeremy

 

[rvitko]

This could be a defective pump, corroded wiring or end connectors or an osmolator that was made before 2007 (if you bought it used), before 2008 the pump used less power (single seal was upgraded in 2008 to a dual seal) and the controller had a lower limit for power it could send the pump, the workaround is to use the original power supply which was 9V or switchable and should be switched to 9V, the current 11V power supply will not work with these older controllers.