9002 - Microbubble Problem Back Again

[DadofReefs]

Hi Roger - sorry to be a pain in the neck but we are having the same microbubble problem that we had a couple of weeks ago with our 9002 skimmer. If you recall, we had a significant microbubble problem about the time you left for Germany and you all were kind enough to replace the original skimmer since it had arrived with a a broken part.

Here is the previous thread.

We've seen a similar pattern as with the original skimmer. It worked great for about 2-3 weeks, then started dumping bubbles. It is leaking bubbles around the bottom of the skimmer as seen in the picture below.

I've adjusted the skimmer height (usually run 1/2" below the water line), adjusted the venturi, checked and double checked flow. I've taken the skimmer apart, checked the lines, checked the impeller and can't for the life of me figure out why we can't get rid of these bubbles.

We've never been completely bubble-free, but at the moment we have a tank full.

I find it funny that most people here with 9002 problems can't get any bubbles and we get way too many!

We would really, really, really like to get this problem resolved. Maybe we are doing something wrong. We are not dosing our tank with any additives at the moment.

Any ideas?

Thanks!

Greg Gibson

Here is a picture of the bubble leakage we were seeing in the previous skimmer. We are seeing similar leakage again with the replacement.

 

[rvitko]

Please give me a complete list of everything you add to your aquarium, everything from what your source water is to what type of salt you use and any sort of dechlorinators or additives of any type.

The cause of microbubbles is usually one of the following-

1) Additives that change surface tension, the results can persist for days to weeks. This includes vitamins, stress coat, dechlorinators, algaecides, antibiotics and medications, amino acid supplements, slime algae killers and certain foods.
2) Filter cartridges, pads or floss which contain phenols. The bubbles will follow a change in cartridges/floss and diminish over about a week. Carbon will help.
3) Oxygen saturation due to intense lighting and high growth rates (this includes algae and coral growth) in this case the bubbles get worse as daylight hours progress.
4) Excessive KH, this leads to CO2 saturation, a KH over 14dKh is very likely to cause this.

I don't see any reason to believe there is a mechanical cause for the bubbles. Your last skimmer had a crack in the housing that aggrevated the situation but was not likely the sole cause.

 

[DadofReefs]

Please give me a complete list of everything you add to your aquarium, everything from what your source water is to what type of salt you use and any sort of dechlorinators or additives of any type.

We have a 34 gallon Red Sea Max. We are running a couple of well-known mods to the stock system that includes replacing the stock skimmer with the 9002. Most users applying these mods don't have the bubble issue I have. In fact, most say they got more bubbles with the stock skimmer.

Here is what we have in the rear chambers:

Right behind the overflow we have a media rack that holds (from top to bottom on 3 eggcrate shelves) - poly floss, purigen, chemipure.

Next to the media rack is the skimmer. Water flows down the media rack to the skimmer chamber.

Next to the skimmer is the thermometer chamber and next to that are the powerheads that provide flow through the unit. Water flows over the top of the thermometer chamber baffle and the powerheads pull water from the bottom of this chamber.

As for water, we are using RODI saltwater from our local fish store. Occasionally we have made up some saltwater using RODI freshwater obtained from this store. They use Crystal Sea Marine Mix and that's what we have used on the few occasions we've mixed our own using their RODI freshwater. Actually, I believe they just changed over to the Deltec salt mix recently.

The recent bubble outbreak did start shortly after we added a small amount of saltwater we mixed using the Crystal Sea mix. Maybe 2-3 gallons at most were added. We were replacing some water used for acclimation and an iodine dip.

We had been dosing calcium but stopped about 10 days ago when calcium readings jumped up to 480. KH was on the higher side of the acceptable range. I don't remember the exact reading but we stopped dosing at that point.

We were using the Crystal Seas mix because to help with the calcium supplementation. Maybe this has continued to push or maintain an elevated KH level.

We are not dosing anything else in the tanks currently. Since we're getting our water RODI from the LFS, we are not using any dechlorinators. We've been soaking fish food in garlic with some vitamins, but any amount introduced to the tank would be tiny.

That's pretty much what we have.

We put the 9002 in the display tank and ran it for a bit. We do see significant bubble leakage from around the bottom of the skimmer. The majority of the bubbles seem to come from the edge where the pump intake sits.

Without the skimmer in the tank, we do still see a very small amount of bubbles...but nothing like the thousands we were getting while it was running. As I mentioned, it ran great for about two weeks then the bubbles hit again.

1) Additives that change surface tension, the results can persist for days to weeks. This includes vitamins, stress coat, dechlorinators, algaecides, antibiotics and medications, amino acid supplements, slime algae killers and certain foods.

Haven't added any supplements or stress coats. Foods are mainly frozen - Rod's food, mysis, brine, some oyster eggs.

2) Filter cartridges, pads or floss which contain phenols. The bubbles will follow a change in cartridges/floss and diminish over about a week. Carbon will help.

We do run some poly-floss, but we were running it when during the period when the skimmer was working fine, so I am less apt to be suspicious of it. Same brand.

3) Oxygen saturation due to intense lighting and high growth rates (this includes algae and coral growth) in this case the bubbles get worse as daylight hours progress.

Our lighting is average and certainly not intense. No change in bubble amount as the day progresses.

4) Excessive KH, this leads to CO2 saturation, a KH over 14dKh is very likely to cause this.

If anything chemical, I am somewhat suspicious of this. Last water check we were on the high side of acceptable and stopped dosing.

I don't see any reason to believe there is a mechanical cause for the bubbles. Your last skimmer had a crack in the housing that aggrevated the situation but was not likely the sole cause.

This skimmer isn't cracked. Hopefully we can find an answer.

 

[rvitko]

I think we can narrow it down to one of three things.

The KH.

The floss or possibly the Purigen. I know you may not believe this one but I know first hand if you install a brand new filter bag that is not rinsed thoroughly any skimmer will produce tons of microbubbles and overflow the skimmer cup. Phenols are a usual part of manufacturing polyester floss, bags or cartridges and it takes only a trace to cause this. If the bubbles coincided with a filter media change this would be my prime suspect. I have not used Purigen so I cannot definitively rule it out. I can however rule out Chemipure.

The vitamins and garlic used on the food. While normally I would not suspect this, given the very small volume of the aquarium I could see a possibility for these substances to accumulate. I might try not using them for 2 weeks and then use them more sparingly.

Whatever is the culprit it will take a couple weeks to go away, phenols dissipate slowly, the problem will progressively get better, chemipure will help remove it. A high KH will come down overtime if no buffers are added and the water is not changed. The vitamins and garlic will degrade over time.