A few questions for the SPS folks

[Underwaterparadise]

I'm trying to put together a little blog type thing to help out my customers.

What would you say are the top 5 things to cause SPS to brown out and what are the top 5 most important things in order to get good color from SPS. I want stuff other then the usual flow and lighting ( that part is a given)

TIA

Peace

 

[funman1]

Well, the "given" seems to be what people do wrong the most.

When most people change the lighting, flow, temp, and water quality (CA, Alk, Mag, and NO Po4, or No3) their SPS seems to do just fine.

Not sure what else you're looking for.
There's no magic to it really, just follow the recipe for success.

 

[fishsoldseprtly]

Rob, a good friend of mine in the hobby (ROAB) always told me that lighting is not the most important but a small intregal part. I would have to say top 5 would be:

-water quality 0 TDS

-calcium levels

-alk levels

-magnesium

-flow

ohh and I run PhoSar 24/7!

hit me up bro and good luck!

 

[Pico1]

phosphate

 

[Nuuze]

All of the above...and placement for some pieces. Here's an example of a Tonga Bonsai I had near the sand and decide to move it to the top after several months thinking it would color up more. It's back down near the sand again...

Before by the sand:

After I moved it up high:

 

[dots]

Discussions like this often get out of hand due to the lack of hard fact and opinion on the SPS forum. Most will tend to agree that there is a multitude of factors that can contribute to browning.

So lets start with this:
http://www.reefs.org/library/talklog/s_tyree_060202.html

Now assuming you say all other factors are in good fashion, and one has adressed the holy trifecta of water/flow/light and the corals are in otherwise "healthy" condition, I treat them like sparkplugs and tune them as if you were tuning a car.

If a piece is too brown, it tells me that it is not getting enough light or has excess food and has a concentration of pigment. I either back off the food, if lighting is already optimized or move the coral to a higher light spot. If you find you are in your highest light spot and still have a problem browning, they may need to reconsider if they had enough light to begin with. Take note that not all SPS are created equal and just like some are more sensitive than others, some need a lot more light to color up, and perhaps they can't keep it in good color due to thier tank load.

Nutrients within the water column are debated as well. How much does one thing or another contribute varies widely by opinion. In fact, I have gone as far a saying that SPS, LPS/Softie tanks are totaly different types of tanks and to have a mixed tank, one must make some concessions with either based on the nutrient load of the tank. On this same thought the sand bed debate of DSB,SSB and BB bring up what exactly a sand bed does and how it contributes to the overall nutrients within the system. Without getting into the pros and cons/opinions of this topic, most do recognize that it has an effect on coloration on SPS.

My tank, a BB SPS tank reacts very quickly to change and colors can brown or color back up very quickly. Problem children can be dealt with quickly and get them looking good. However, due to the lack of nutrients I am always on the edge of starving the pieces and they grow slowly compared to others. But I can offset the lack of nutrients existing in the water by overfeeding and overskimming to combat the problems of doing this.

No doubt, I touched on a lot of stuff and a lot of opinion, but this may help in opening a floodgate of information headed your way by others.

 

[Underwaterparadise]

<a href=showthread.php?s=&postid=10157169#post10157169 target=_blank>Originally posted</a> by funman1
Well, the "given" seems to be what people do wrong the most.

When most people change the lighting, flow, temp, and water quality (CA, Alk, Mag, and NO Po4, or No3) their SPS seems to do just fine.

Not sure what else you're looking for.
There's no magic to it really, just follow the recipe for success.

Not exactly what a customer would like to hear. I beg to differ as well. The great thing about this hobby IMO is there is no "Recipe for success" but rather an entire cook book


Thanks for the info Dots! I avoided the SPS forum just for those reasons. I know people right here in our own back yard know what they are doing!!

 

[dots]

Its a balancing act really, and I have come to an understanding that works for me. The biggest thing is there is more than one way "to skin a cat"

To oversimplify it down to the root cause its usually too much of one thing or too little of another, or a combination. The tricky part is figuring out which.

Trial and error is what it really is.......and that is what is the best part about this stuff, we are still learning and it isn't set in stone.

 

[Underwaterparadise]

Oh I know the trial and error all to well. I always tell people to listen to what I tell them then go get about 3-4 other peoples view and come to your own conclusion from that. What I am trying to put together will help customers understand a little more and give them an idea of what to look for. Sometimes just understanding something better helps people accompolish things more.

 

[Underwaterparadise]

where is Tim and Karl. I would like to hear there opinions!

 

[reedrodz]

For me, just like any other living things, corals also gets stress from lighting, water parameters, flow, and etc...after awhile it will adopt to all these things and it will color up again or not...

 

[tfp]

rob, i truly wish i knew the top 5 . there is nothing more humbling than thinking you are on top of things and then bam...minor, mysterious stn/rtn for unforeseen reasons :mad2:.

i'd say in general, if you take a systemic approach and monitor your params weekly anyone can do it. the real issue is for how long you're willing to be a slave to your tank . so my fav 5 would be:

1. keep water params in check (alk 8-10, ca 400-450, mg 1350-1400, sg .025-.026, temp 78-81, nitrate 0-5, phos .02)

2. feed your fish and reef (find that sweetspot that keeps your nitrate and phos reasonable without spawning nuisance algae).

3. good lighting and flow. both are very subjective and people get different results.

4. maintain all of your equipment (skimmers clean, bulbs clean, top of tank clean for max light penetration, test your failsafes, pumps/powerheads routinely cleaned, rotate carbon, filter socks, phosphate removers, ca reactor cleaned, co2 tank adequately filled, topoff/makeup water reading 0 TDS, water changes, all that boring stuff)

5. start off with only frags vs whole colonies and be willing to accept the fact that not every coral you acquire will survive...your DIP process for new aquisitions! and if you have to ask what should i be dipping for...you got some more readin in the sps forum to do .

hth,
tim

 

[Unarce]

Re: A few questions for the SPS folks

Rob,

This is what I have off the top of my head, (in no particular order):

Originally posted by maddness
What would you say are the top 5 things to cause SPS to brown out

-change in source water
-pests/predation
-parameter fluctuation
-chemical warfare
-excessive nutrients

Originally posted by maddness
what are the top 5 most important things in order to get good color from SPS

-water stability
-proper placement
-good control of nutrients
-'balanced' lighting
-exaggerated perception of color

Everyone pretty much touched upon what is a must for SPS keeping. What's gospel are Ca, dKH, and Mg for elements. Proper flow and lighting for an environment.

Now, even with all these things kept at a premium, you're always going to have a piece or two that you just can't get right. That's a given. No two tanks are alike, and this is where the 'your mileage may vary' (YMMV) caveat will apply.

Take for instance the true 'Purple Monster'. Despite this being one of the oldest, lineaged pieces in the hobby, there isn't a defined 'right' way to keep it. If you ask for advice on this piece, half of the people will say high light, high flow. The other half will say low light, low flow. 90% of the time, the advice is coming from someone with a 2" frag. By the time you fend off the people telling you it isn't a purple monster, your frag has already RTN'd and you're out $150

There's no 'sweet spot' where every single piece you have or will have, is going to be happy. You may find that some pieces look best at an 8dKH, while the rest look great at 12dKH. You can't have both.

Just play everything by ear, and do what you can. Just remember, that when you do make any adjustment or change, do it slowly and gradually. Such is the art of SPS keeping

Karl

 

[mpoletti]

Karl- for top 5 ways for good color, I'll add #6- photoskills.

Rob- I do not know what I could add that would help you out. What I can share with you is my experience. SPS are more gentle that other species of corals and as Greg Carroll says it, "SPS - Stability Produces Success".

The biggest thing I have found is tinker, don't tamper. Once corals get used to something and you shock them, bad things will occur.

I have moved different corals around my tank to see how they respond in different lighting and flow areas. I am also one of those people who believe in reading why the successful systems are successful. Here on RC, there is a library of TOTM's, and that is where I started my readings.

 

[Fragmented]

Not much to add there.

Patience--go slow and don't expect immediate results.

Knowing what things to do and doing them are two different things. Motivation is a key factor. The system will not maintain itself.

This hobby is filled with trouble shooting and problem solving. That's part of what keeps it interesting.