Adding flow to 20g sump

[NCReefDude]

Hey Everyone

I current have a 50g display with a 20g sump. I have had a custom built sump in the past, and you could actually see the progression of the water from the filter to the return. My new sump, I don't see this same progression, and I think I know why.

My current setup is a 20g with filter sock on left, Skimmer in middle, and return pump on right. I have roughly 5-10lbs of live rock in the back left corner, behind the filter sock.

However, I don't see any flow or water movement whatsoever in the sump. There aren't any baffles or anything glued in between sections, so I assume thats why things aren't "flowing" and just looking like a tank full of water.

Any suggestions on how to fix this without having to replace the sump or add baffles? Thanks!

 

[duncanpate1]

Fix what?


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[NCReefDude]

Fix what?


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Every sump I've used in the past or have seen online has actual flow through the sump with divided chambers, etc. If you look at mine its literally just water down there and you can't tell the progression through the sump with no flow. Theres film building up on the top of the water in the sump and I have a lot of stuff just floating through the display tank instead of crystal clear water, and I'm trying to see if the current sump setup is the reason why.

 

[Clowning_Around]

Your visible flow is a by product of your return. I.e. your pump and plumbing. If you want more flow you simply need to increase your return. If you have a ball valve restricting it somewhere, open it up for example. Another if you teed off your return for other means that could be reducing your flow to much for your liking try an auxilary pump if needed for that line... If still to slow check your math on pump headloss, pipe sizing, and pump sizing. Sidenote, what does the flow look like out of your return nozzle/outlet?

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[Pelagic_e36]

My 10 gallon sump is the same way with a film forming on the middle chamber which is currently empty. I would increase flow with the ball valve on my return but that only makes the overflow bubble and gurgle which leads to the sump intake bubbling and gurgling. Only thing I could think of was putting a reactor in that chamber to try to create flow or surface disruption.

 

[NCReefDude]

Your visible flow is a by product of your return. I.e. your pump and plumbing. If you want more flow you simply need to increase your return. If you have a ball valve restricting it somewhere, open it up for example. Another if you teed off your return for other means that could be reducing your flow to much for your liking try an auxilary pump if needed for that line... If still to slow check your math on pump headloss, pipe sizing, and pump sizing. Sidenote, what does the flow look like out of your return nozzle/outlet?

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I don't have a ball valve or anything restricting flow. Its a mag drive 7 return pump and the flow coming out of the return seems fine with a decent amount of pressure.

My 10 gallon sump is the same way with a film forming on the middle chamber which is currently empty. I would increase flow with the ball valve on my return but that only makes the overflow bubble and gurgle which leads to the sump intake bubbling and gurgling. Only thing I could think of was putting a reactor in that chamber to try to create flow or surface disruption.

I actually don't have a ball valve but I'm still getting micro bubbles a lot as well.

 

[Clowning_Around]

Do you have a bubble trap in your sump between the skimmer and return? Any pics?

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[Lsufan]

That is why I prefer a over-under- over bubble trap, or even a under- over configuration. As long as the water is flowing over the last baffle in the bubble trap it keeps the top of the water moving through the sump so a film doesn't build up.

Without adding any baffles about all u could do is put a small powerhead in. If u don't have the film then I wouldn't worry about it. If u do then I would install a over-under-over bubble trap & that would take care of the film & the micro bubbles

 

[Pelagic_e36]

I think I just discovered the flaw in my DIY sump design and the reason I have the film: I do have an over under over baffle, but the first over baffle is a tad shorter than the last over baffle before the return so the water level simply sits above the first baffle and therefore rendered as an under over baffle.

 

[Clowning_Around]

I think I just discovered the flaw in my DIY sump design and the reason I have the film: I do have an over under over baffle, but the first over baffle is a tad shorter than the last over baffle before the return so the water level simply sits above the first baffle and therefore rendered as an under over baffle.

Yep so of those 3 baffles, only the last one is doing much, simple fix thought, silicone on a piece to the top face of the first baffle extending its hght as needed.

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[ddanis60]

Adding flow to 20g sump

Every sump I've used in the past or have seen online has actual flow through the sump with divided chambers, etc. If you look at mine its literally just water down there and you can't tell the progression through the sump with no flow. Theres film building up on the top of the water in the sump and I have a lot of stuff just floating through the display tank instead of crystal clear water, and I'm trying to see if the current sump setup is the reason why.

You don't have any problems and your sump is working as it should. Just because you can't see the movement, doesn't mean it's not moving. If the film is the main thing you dislike, get a small powerhead like a korialla 425 or something and aim it at the surface from inside the sump. My skimmer section of my trigger emerald sump has a film.. but I let it be as it doesn't harm anything. If you want a more natural fix that doesn't consume energy and that will also solve the micro bubble issue as well, you can add some bubble trap baffles, creating a return section in your sump. That section will also develop a film tho as well. That solution will be more work but probably have greater reward as micro bubbles are annoying

Now if you feel like your display is dirty, then you have other issues all together. Either you have not enough circulation in the display, or possibly not enough flow through the sump/filter sock or possibly inefficient overflow. You'd need a bigger return pump and a overflow/sump supply capable of handling increased flow if you don't already.

Pics of your setup would also be helpful. Good luck!


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[ddanis60]

Adding flow to 20g sump

Oops, double reply.

 

[NCReefDude]

This is the right side of the sump, looking from the side door on the right side of the tank

left side looking from the front

right side from front

display

 

[NCReefDude]

ugh ignore that post. still trying to get used to imgur.

Display:

Sump from right side, side door view:

sump from front, left side:

sump from front, right side:

There are no baffles or anything in the sump, literally just a 20g tank with a clip on filter sock, a skimmer sitting in the middle with the return to the right of it. I bought the setup used.

I really appreciate your help everyone.

 

[ddanis60]

Adding flow to 20g sump

Tank looks great! Setup looks good to me. If you wanted to add baffles, I personally would wait for petcos dollar per gallon sale (which was going on last week I believe. Maybe still?) and just buy a new sump. That was you can work on one without disturbing your system and take your time. Get some baffles cut at a glass shop or with something that small, acrylic panels from Home Depot or somewhere like that should work as well. Just have them cut them to size and silicone them in with reef safe silicone. The whole project including the new tank could prob be done for just over the price of a new power head.


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[NCReefDude]

Tank looks great! Setup looks good to me. If you wanted to add baffles, I personally would wait for petcos dollar per gallon sale (which was going on last week I believe. Maybe still?) and just buy a new sump. That was you can work on one without disturbing your system and take your time. Get some baffles cut at a glass shop or with something that small, acrylic panels from Home Depot or somewhere like that should work as well. Just have them cut them to size and silicone them in with reef safe silicone. The whole project including the new tank could prob be done for just over the price of a new power head.


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Thats actually a really good idea. I plan to upgrade to a 125 when I buy a house, so I have been checking out sumps that'll work with my 50g now and a future 125. I've found the eshopps RS200 sump that I could use with my current system and then use for the 125. I might just say screw it and buy that soon, haha.

 

[Blackgagt1]

I think it would be good to mention That you need to get the rusting metal clamp out of your sump too. I suggest Getting some plastic ones

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