African cichlid reef?

[insanefishguy]

Ok, so the thread name was to get attention, but also relevant. My question is actually about damsels. African cichlids and damsels pretty much share the same behavioral characteristics. Those who keep cichlids do it "successfully" by overcrowding them to spread out the abuse. Has anyone heard of the same technique being used to keep a reef tank with damsels? There are so many colorful damsels out there and they are relatively inexpensive. I think it would make for a very active tank. It would also beg the question then, why not add some different types of dottybacks and maybe triggers, and other fairly aggresive fish.

 

[seapug]

Gangfight, anyone?

 

[flameangel88]

I'm going to comment on the cichlids part. I used to have 20-25 cichlids in a tank and they do fine when they are small but once they got big and started to mate that's when the problem comes in. They start to claim their territory and start killing the other tankmates. Even 2 mated pairs ( a reg flowerhorn pair and a gold flowerhorn pair) in a 50g was tough. They get more aggress as they mature.

 

[tomtoothdoc]

wow 2 mated pairs of flowerhorns in a 50? how big are they? i had one mated pair in a 125 and they had to be given away to a friend with a 300 gal. the male was about a foot and the female was about 8 inches. they sometimes fought in the 125 but the new owner told me they were much happier in the 300 and more than 70 babies survived to about one inch size from one hatching. then they had to be separated before the gang fights for survival of the fittest.

 

[Chris2500DK]

You can see about the same situation at most LFS. They'll have a tank full of damsels and you see some of them holding on to a little bit of territory like a pump or a piece of rock, and a bunch of others swimming around sometimes charging at each other.

You could probably do it, but you'd most likely end up with quite a few fatalities along the way.

Regarding the cichlids there's a huge difference between Central/South americans like the Flowerhorns (well technically that's a hybrid, but off american cichlids) and then Malawi Mbuna which was what I guess insanefishguy was thinking about. The Mbuna are often kept overcrowded to distribute aggression.

 

[flameangel88]

I got a whole bunch when they were about a bit under 3" and they paired off. They started killing the others so had to separate and yes it was tight in the 50 but both pair have their own cave on opposite corner. Eventually had to give them away to large tanks.

<a href=showthread.php?s=&postid=12510676#post12510676 target=_blank>Originally posted</a> by tomtoothdoc
wow 2 mated pairs of flowerhorns in a 50? how big are they? i had one mated pair in a 125 and they had to be given away to a friend with a 300 gal. the male was about a foot and the female was about 8 inches. they sometimes fought in the 125 but the new owner told me they were much happier in the 300 and more than 70 babies survived to about one inch size from one hatching. then they had to be separated before the gang fights for survival of the fittest.

 

[wayne in norway]

It is incredily important to get the 'right' type of cichlids to get controlled overstocking to work ,and that is basically mbuna and tropheus. The fact your's paired off indicates they are neither of the above, and it simply doesn't work for anything other than those fish that don't form distinct pairs.
It would be tough to make it work for many damsels, they are too variable between species,and far more attached to distinct territories compared to mbuna. It would work for anthias if you had a big tank, say something 10 or 12 feet long.

 

[cloak]

Here's a good article.

http://reefkeeping.com/issues/2003-11/hcs3/index.php

 

[insanefishguy]

Very good article. Thanks for posting it. This is just something that I have beeen thinking about for a while. I figured maybe someone else out there had tried it or knew someone who did. I know that some cichlids and some species of damsels are much more aggresive then others. I currently house a breeding colony of dwarf shell dwelling cichlids in a 20l with a masked brichardi and checkered juli as tankmates. I have had these guys for about five years now, but that is about the extent of my long term knowledge of keeping cichlids.

I just recently upgraded my reef from a 40l to a 125. I have been throwing around lots of ideas as far as stocking for the past few months while I let it cycle and let the critter populations climb. The tank is PACKED with all sorts of corals but only a few fish.