Algae Scrubber Basics

[Floyd R Turbo]

First 7 days of growth on the new scrubber...

 

[DavidinGA]

So what exactly is wrong with tapatalk and images anyway?

 

[Floyd R Turbo]

It's either a bug in the way RC processes the HTML from tapatalk users, or it is a on-purpose limitation mod on the tapatalk plug-in code to defeat a potential security flaw, of which Tapatalk is well known for not addressing. TT has started doing some pretty underhanded things ever since IB bought VB and ForumRunner, then ran both into the ground. So there's no competition. I run several forums and TT is a big point of contention among forum admins, pretty much the main reason most sites use it is due to a lack of another option and user revolt that typically occurs when it is dropped.

So once you make a post in tapatalk that includes a quote or a referenced image, you have to tap the post, go into edit, then save it (change nothing) and then it will show up normal for all PC users.

See this thread for more....think I'll bump it right now in fact

http://www.reefcentral.com/forums/showthread.php?t=2292517

 

[bambam918]

I set up a ATS about a month ago and I have got decent results so far. I it connected to my return pump and am trying to figure a better way to have it setup. I am not getting green hair algae like I want and this is one of the reasons why I am thinking of making adjustments.

Currently I am using two par 38 LED lights to illuminate both sides of the screen. I could only get the lights ~8 inches to the screen. In my new design I plan on getting it within the 4 inches that is recommended. I believe this is one reason why i have more slime than GHA. Also i am not sure how much flow is needed but reading others posts, I think I do not have enough flow. I have a mag5 for my return and the ATS is split off from the return line.

I want to upgrade the pump anyhow to get more flow for my display. How much flow does the ATS need? a bunch? Does faster water movement benefit GHA better than slower movement?

My main questions are, is more flow better?, are lights being closer to the screen promote better GHA growth? are Par 38 LED lights strong enough?

I would like the Santa Monica ATS, original design, but they do not make it any longer and I am not skilled at all at making something that sophisticated.

<a href="http://s1266.photobucket.com/user/akita451/media/E12A2873-7985-40DE-A6A6-BF9000BA6E09.jpg.html" target="_blank"><img src="http://i1266.photobucket.com/albums/jj521/akita451/E12A2873-7985-40DE-A6A6-BF9000BA6E09.jpg" border="0" alt=" photo E12A2873-7985-40DE-A6A6-BF9000BA6E09.jpg"/></a>

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<a href="http://s1266.photobucket.com/user/akita451/media/6E955694-9AB4-4B65-9221-CA84F0A542B9.jpg.html" target="_blank"><img src="http://i1266.photobucket.com/albums/jj521/akita451/6E955694-9AB4-4B65-9221-CA84F0A542B9.jpg" border="0" alt=" photo 6E955694-9AB4-4B65-9221-CA84F0A542B9.jpg"/></a>

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[Floyd R Turbo]

Currently I am using two par 38 LED lights to illuminate both sides of the screen. I could only get the lights ~8 inches to the screen. In my new design I plan on getting it within the 4 inches that is recommended. I believe this is one reason why i have more slime than GHA.

white LEDs do not grow well. You can't compare fluorescent source color temp with LED - LED are that way only for our eyes and architectural uses

Also i am not sure how much flow is needed but reading others posts, I think I do not have enough flow. I have a mag5 for my return and the ATS is split off from the return line.

I want to upgrade the pump anyhow to get more flow for my display. How much flow does the ATS need?

Does faster water movement benefit GHA better than slower movement?

You would need the whole Mag5 for that screen alone, so the answer is you have waaaaay too little flow. you need 35 GPH per inch of screen width actual measurable flow (not rated pump flow)

Overall the construction looks good, screen, slot pipe, etc.

But what are you using this on? That screen is huge. really only need 12 sq in of screen per cube of food fed per day, on average. At most, 2x that size. So if you feed 2 cubes/day, that's 24 sq in of screen, or 48 sq in max.

As to the LED lamp and distance, at these distances it may of may not make a difference. Also your lamps look like they have diffusers on them, like they are outdoor/deck floodlights. You want as bare as you can get LEDs, no diffusion. And you want grow lamps, with 660nm red mainly and a little blue doesn't hurt but mainly red.

So your main issues: wrong LED type, and not enough of it, but your screen appears too big so reducing the size means reducing the required lighting also (to be more in line with one lamp per side, possibly)

Way too little flow. This may self-correct by resizing the screen

 

[bambam918]

Floyd thank you for the response. I really respect your advice and will apply it to the redesign of the ATS. I will start to fund a replacement pump and get that up and running ASAP.

I went off post 1 in this thread where it recommended 1 sq inch per gallon of water. The current screen I am using is 180 sq inches (10x18).

I will look into new bulbs right away and get them closer when I redesign too. Thanks for the quick response and clearing up the issues I have! Happy reefing

 

[Floyd R Turbo]

You are using the old guideline. The feeding based guiding can be found in the updated Algae Scrubber Basics in my sig. It's 12 sq in of screen lit on both sides per cube of food per day. Your 180 sq in screen, if properly lit and provided the proper flow, would be a 15 cube/day screen. If you are much more than 2x oversized based on feeding, you will have a hard time getting green growth. I would re-evaluate your screen size first before buying a dedicated pump.

 

[bambam918]

a quick search and I found this LED light to possibly replace my lights on the ATS... do you think this would be a good option?

TOMTOP E27 7W Red Blue LED Plant Lamp Hydroponic Grow Light Bulbs for Garden Greenhouse

Specifications:
LED quantity: 7 pieces (1 blue & 6 red)
Power: 7W
Light color: Red & Blue (Ratio: 6 : 1)
LED wavelength: 650-660NM(red), 440-450NM(blue)
Voltage: 90-265V
Socket type: E27
Item material：Aluminum
Item size: 8.5 * 7.6cm/ 3.3 * 3in
Item weight: 197g/ 6.9oz
Package size: 10 * 9 * 9cm/ 3.9 * 3.5 * 3.5in
Package weight: 232g/ 8.2oz

 

[bambam918]

Ok thanks floyd. Ill fix the screen tomorrow

 

[Floyd R Turbo]

Way too small. the 12 LED version of that is better, but would realistically only cover about a 5x5 or 6x6 area effectively. That means for your 8x10 screen, you would need 4 of these on each side.

How much do you feed on average?

 

[bambam918]

I have the neptune auto feeder and that goes 3 times a day, enough to feed:

gold rim tang
yellow tang
kole tang
randalls goby
12 chromis
8 Bartlett's
two fire clowns
springer dottyback
tribal blenny
starry blenny
blue throat trigger

I will occasionally feed frozen 2-3 times a week. Ill work on cutting the screen down in size to around... 50 sq inches?

 

[SantaMonica]

One easy way to reduce size: Cut the screen vertically, and tape off the remaining slot.

 

[salty joe]

Not a bad idea for a quick fix. Gorilla Tape would probably last quite awhile.

 

[Floyd R Turbo]

One easy way to reduce size: Cut the screen vertically, and tape off the remaining slot.

You keep suggesting this but it's a pretty basic rule of thumb to avoid adhesives inside a reef tank, at all costs.

 

[callsign4223]

How about siliconing the unused portion of the slot? If you wanted to re-use it later it should be fairly easy to remove the silicone I would think.

 

[Floyd R Turbo]

It won't hold under pressure though. the point of my last post was that you shouldn't expose adhesive to the saltwater. If you wanted to seal it up with a thin sheet of plastic with silicone, then wrap that really tightly with duct tape, that might work. At least the adhesive wouldn't be directly exposed. The silicone may or may not seal it well, hence the tight wrap tape.

Then you have the issue of fresh silicone and water. Gotta use the right silicone (Momentive RTV from Grainger, if you can) and then let it cure long enough so that it won't affect corals (minimum 72 hours, 2 weeks if you can).

Easier and safer just to make a new slot pipe.

 

[DavidinGA]

Question:

Does an algae scrubber pull equal amounts of PO4 and NO3?


I have conflicted info on it. Some people are telling me it pulls in a 16:1 ratio (NO3 @ 16), while other people say it only does that because tanks have excessive phosphates bound up in the rocks/sand.


What's the story?

 

[Floyd R Turbo]

I've found that I pulls N down very well but sometimes not P. Depends on scrubber and tank. Oversizing it help with a P problem.

 

[Floyd R Turbo]

And I don't know if I would put a lot of faith in the 16:1 ratio, I think it does vary depending on the dominant strain of algae you end up growing

 

[SantaMonica]

Algae conform to the nutrients available. That's why different colors (species) of algae grow based on different nutrients and conditions. Even an individual species of alga can adjust its metabolism to conform to variations in nutrient availability.

If you google "algal luxury nutrient absorption" you can get a quick look at some studies on this.