Anybody ever build with PVC sheet?

[eleodes]

I am pondering a building project. I want to make a real strong tank with unusual dimensions. I wonder about using this stuff to build a floor and three walls:

http://www.professionalplastics.com/cgi-bin/pp.pl

......and then using a glass front panel. I know that that stuff is real easy too work and it should be super tough. It's pretty cheap too.

Any thoughts?

 

[bsackamano]

Look over this: http://www.reefcentral.com/forums/showthread.php?s=&threadid=465933&perpage=25&pagenumber=14

These don't have a glass front, but Rick did a lot of experimenting with sealing and bracing the PVC sheet.

 

[eleodes]

well he got it to work anyway. that's a very long thread and i didn't dig too deep.

that stuff is very flexy, but i was thinking of a shallow (12") tank.

the biggest drawback that i can see is that that material seems to all be in that same ugly grey color.

 

[ejmeier]

This looks like a good idea to me - or at least definitely worth looking into. What about for other stuff too - like sumps, CA reactors, or (for me), skimmer bodies.

That other link above didn't work, but I still found it from the base site. Do you mean this stuff: http://www.professionalplastics.com...r=85490&strfnbr=3&prname=PVC---Expanded-Sheet

Looks like its available in tons of colors (not clear though) Pretty cheap too, compared to acrylic anyway.

Anybody know what would you use to bond it? Is it the same as acrylic, with all the same techniques (pins/spacers, etc.) only with a different solvent? Looks like IPS has Weld-On 1001 and 1007 for foamed PVC. 1007 looks pretty similar to Weld-On 3 & 4 for acrylic, could be wrong though.

 

[HippieSmell]

I don't know about pvc sheets, but I was looking at thick sheets of HDPE at Menards today and started getting ideas. It was $50 for a 4'x8' sheet a 1/4" (I think) thick. It would be like those rubbermaid tubs, but you could make it into a box shape instead of being roundish.

 

[chipmaker]

I have stuck the PVC sheet material together with Weldon #3 and 4 as well as 16 and regular heavy duty or grey PVC glue. Its best to use primer on it since its not quite the same type of joints as a socket and tube would be, so the primer helps. BIggest thing is the need to clamp it until its setup.

I fyour going with the HDPE its gonna be a chore to seal it up short of plastic welding. I made an inground vault for my pumps at my pond using nitrogen blown core HDPE sheet (has slick sides with a porous center) and it did not take to having any type of adhesive or sealant stay stuck to it, so I had to weld the joints up. Its totally ridgid now and completely water tight. but as large as it was it took considerable time to properly weld the 4 corners, and the bottom in.....but its certianly doable..

 

[eleodes]

so it sounds as though the advantage of using PVC over HDPE is that the former is easier to bond--you can just use PVC cement.

ejmeier- that stuff you link to above looks interesting--available in a range of colors and pretty cheap--but it only comes in thickness to a little less than 1/4". this would work alright for small projects, but you would need something heftier for a larger tank.

 

[parshmar]

You should use a pvc welder when bonding pvc to pvc, imo.

 

[ejmeier]

<a href=showthread.php?s=&postid=6611657#post6611657 target=_blank>Originally posted</a> by parshmar
You should use a pvc welder when bonding pvc to pvc, imo.

Whats a pvc welder? Are you talking about a solvent, or a tool of some sort?

It looks from the IPS website that the best thing to bond sheet pvc to pvc is Weld-On #2007. I guess I would rest easier if I did things with the right tools/chemicals and with the right method rather than just wing it.

 

[dattack]

Eleodes, the PVC welder is just a tool similar to a hot air gun that helps melt the PVC for joining.
Anyways, have you seen the price of PVC sheets? It's even higher than acrylic.

 

[ejmeier]

So its just melted together? Do they do this because its just faster, or is it really a better way to do it? Seems like it could get a little sloppy... I'm trying to imagine making a skimmer with this stuff.

Anyway, that link above shows 1/4" sheet 4' x 8' for only like $50. (Colors cost more.) That seems pretty low to me, maybe we are thinking of different things???

 

[dattack]

Well the PVC welding I know is the hand held heat guns that you can use some small PVC rods that fit the heat gun. This rods melt and join the two sides. It's kind of like a soldering.
Anyways, the link you gave me is not the PVC you want to hold any water or anything of pressure. Like the description states on the website, it's like a foam material. Very "cardboard" like.
You probably want rigid PVC type I material. I have seen wholesalers just PVC cementing the sheets but they do route out slots on the PVC sheet so it wouldn't be butt-jointed.

 

[chipmaker]

Usually when PVC gets past a certian thickness its common to use a hot air plastic type welder to join it.....It would be the best choice for a lot of the sheet good especially that stuff of 3/16" and greater.......but in some applications it would be overkill if there is not any serious pressure on it like a skimmer......YOu can get a hot air plastic welder that will do ABS, PVC and HDPE materials form Harbor Freight, as well as the filler rods for the material. It also needs an airsource to use it. It is suitable for what its designed to weld, but may take a bit of practice to make it work right and have decent appearances. I find that adding in a rheostat to control heater portion made a big difference....Less than $40 for thre hot air plastics welder....and compressor does not have to be very large either.

 

[eleodes]

(this is my response to a few of above comments) well like i said i am interested in using a glass front panel. i could just build an acrylic tank, but i don't really like acrylic. "scratch management" is just too much of a hastle.

so it sounds like welded joints is the way to go. i still wonder about color choices. would it be possible to get something like 1/2" PVC in black, or white?

 

[ejmeier]

This might not be the right stuff, but that link above had 1/2" black pvc sheet (not sure what is meant by 'expanded foam pvc' but it says '*RIGID* expanded PVC sheet' so I'm hoping would work, not sure though. The brands they list are: Komatex, Celtec, Sintra, Intefoam. I know nothing about PVC, only acrylic, so I'm still waiting for more info.

If it is the right stuff, then its a bargain. 1/2" black full 4x8 sheet is only like $130.

 

[chipmaker]

YOu can get pvc in some colors up to 1" thick. I use a lot of 1/4, 3/8 and 1/2" pvc mainly in black or grey, and also have some in clear that is 1" thick. Other colors like reds, blues, greens yellow etc are even available but I have never seen it in sheets over maybe .125" thick..but the standard black, white, grey and clear can be had up to 1" thick. Some are available in high impact as well. Some sheets are a large as 48 x 120 inches......not really cheap when you get into the more than 1/2" thickness catagory 0r the clear materials.

 

[parshmar]

if you want it to hold water, don't use anything besides a pvc welder.

 

[blokrocbet]

Before you start. I worked in injection molding and extrusion for years, and I have a very good understanding of PVC. It looks as if you have gotten good advice as far as welding it. The only thing I would point out is there are thousands of types of PVC. None of this will mater in bonding only in the additives in PVC called plasticzers leaching our in the water. Plastacizers are made up of things such as sulfuric acid and a lot of other nasty stuff. There are PVC's that are perfectly suited for what you are doing. With less in the way of unstable plasticzers. Iââ"šÂ¬Ã¢"žÂ¢m not saying you selection wont work. Just double check with the manufacturer before you start and tell them exactly what itââ"šÂ¬Ã¢"žÂ¢s going to be used for

 

[eleodes]

oh my!! you know i started to think about this because i have begun to do some modifications to a regular glass tank with some pieces of PVC sheet--i lined the bottom and built a divider wall with a piece of 1/4".

i don't know who the manufacturer was and i don't even know if i would be able to figure that out--they were just some sheets that were laying around in a storeroom. what do you think the chances are that the material i have used is not aquarium safe? i would hate to have to pull apart my work.

 

[blokrocbet]

Well do you still have a piece? if its dry smell it. if it smells of oil ar if it its slimy or was slimy it sould be a problem. Chances are that if you found it localy or just lying aroung its ok. The reason im saying that is PVC is used in all types of things pluming on drain side IV tubing,and wire insulation.