anyone using a carlson surge device?

<a href=showthread.php?s=&postid=11205310#post11205310 target=_blank>Originally posted</a> by mothra
Matt, my wife just saw me looking at your diagram and made fun of me... thanks a lot.
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Sorry Jacob. :lol:
 
<a href=showthread.php?s=&postid=11205090#post11205090 target=_blank>Originally posted</a> by Twisted
And on the pvc pipe going into the tank, if you put it more to the center of the tank and all the way to the bottom with holes drilled in various spots for a few inches of it as a diffuser it will not create as much current, it will just surge the tank.
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I never saw pictures but Chris told me the surge they had entered the tank through a large slot that spanned across the tank. Basically invisible inside the tank. I would definitely want to do it that way, conceal it via bulkheads like a closed loop.
 
What if you used an electronic float valve to activate the motor on your air valve. I just have a problem with relying on timers.
 
<a href=showthread.php?s=&postid=11208532#post11208532 target=_blank>Originally posted</a> by Twisted
What if you used an electronic float valve to activate the motor on your air valve. I just have a problem with relying on timers.
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Sounds like it could work to me. There are lots of ways to solve that issue, so if you come up with one please share with the class. :D
 
Well I have been looking into about four methods of building a surge tank, out of boredom if nothing else.
In an issue of popular science a couple months ago they were talking about a set up they built to simulate tidale waves along resort type structures.
They built a model of the structure, beach and all. Then added the water, about three feet from the model beach there is a box with a single inlet/outlet, and then the air tight box has a bunch of fans in it, a set that sucks all the air out of the box, which brings the water in to replace it.
Then a set of fans that blow air into the box forceing the water back out, creating a typhoon type result.

So I was actually working on ways to turn this into a surge tank, and the system you are talking about basically does the same thing, vacuum to pull the air out, and then just breaks the vacuum to let the water back in the tank, rather then forceing it out like the machine in popular science did.

I think this is a great method, and I am wonder if there is a down side? I use a CPR HOB skimmer so I can use the air line from that to pull from I will just have to set it up again.
This takes care of the air bubble problem. As far as the air valve it should be fairly easy, but I will have to look up the part I saw in another thread, but it was more or less a float that closed a circuit allowing electricity to pass through, more or less a light switch with a float triggering it.
The only problem I can see is figuring out how to delay the air valve from closeing agin too soon before all the water made it back out to the tank.
Shouldn't be too hard to figure out though, some sort of gas shock type hinge like they use on screen doors to keep them from slamming.
 
It would seem simple enough to use a flapper type seal with a float attached to a string. The float won't pull on the string until the water level in the storage tank gets down to a certain point, at which it would pull on the seal to close it. My only question would be the ability to get that type of a "flapper valve" to be air tight to allow the air to be pulled out and replaced with water.
Also, using the venturi on a pump seems like it would take forever to refill even something like a 5 gallon bucket. Is this true, or am I underestimating how quickly air would be pulled out and water in?
 
<a href=showthread.php?s=&postid=11214626#post11214626 target=_blank>Originally posted</a> by Twisted
Well I have been looking into about four methods of building a surge tank, out of boredom if nothing else.
In an issue of popular science a couple months ago they were talking about a set up they built to simulate tidale waves along resort type structures.
They built a model of the structure, beach and all. Then added the water, about three feet from the model beach there is a box with a single inlet/outlet, and then the air tight box has a bunch of fans in it, a set that sucks all the air out of the box, which brings the water in to replace it.
Then a set of fans that blow air into the box forceing the water back out, creating a typhoon type result.

So I was actually working on ways to turn this into a surge tank, and the system you are talking about basically does the same thing, vacuum to pull the air out, and then just breaks the vacuum to let the water back in the tank, rather then forceing it out like the machine in popular science did.

I think this is a great method, and I am wonder if there is a down side? I use a CPR HOB skimmer so I can use the air line from that to pull from I will just have to set it up again.
This takes care of the air bubble problem. As far as the air valve it should be fairly easy, but I will have to look up the part I saw in another thread, but it was more or less a float that closed a circuit allowing electricity to pass through, more or less a light switch with a float triggering it.
The only problem I can see is figuring out how to delay the air valve from closeing agin too soon before all the water made it back out to the tank.
Shouldn't be too hard to figure out though, some sort of gas shock type hinge like they use on screen doors to keep them from slamming.
Click to expand...

Sounds cool! I wonder why they blow air in though. Gravity works well at making water move all on its own. :D

Sounds like you have some good ideas on the air valve. The biggest problem with relying on the water level in the container to control the opening of the air relief valve is the possibility of the "slurping" problem. You see this in CSDs and BSDs if the water is not getting pumped in fast enough.

I like the idea with the CPR skimmer too. :cool:
 
<a href=showthread.php?s=&postid=11214842#post11214842 target=_blank>Originally posted</a> by jtarmitage
It would seem simple enough to use a flapper type seal with a float attached to a string. The float won't pull on the string until the water level in the storage tank gets down to a certain point, at which it would pull on the seal to close it. My only question would be the ability to get that type of a "flapper valve" to be air tight to allow the air to be pulled out and replaced with water.
Also, using the venturi on a pump seems like it would take forever to refill even something like a 5 gallon bucket. Is this true, or am I underestimating how quickly air would be pulled out and water in?
Click to expand...

Depends on the pump you use I guess. An eductor (did I mention that?) or spa venturi attached to the output will get you a lot of bang for your buck.
 
Matt, I thought that an eductor had a minimum pressure requirement and wonder if you could achieve that with a gravity power device.

By the way, BIG congrats on the full time gig. You got my second dream job. Third would be taste tester in the Mikuni's corporate test kitchen.
 
<a href=showthread.php?s=&postid=11216498#post11216498 target=_blank>Originally posted</a> by Marc Daniels
Matt, I thought that an eductor had a minimum pressure requirement and wonder if you could achieve that with a gravity power device.

By the way, BIG congrats on the full time gig. You got my second dream job. Third would be taste tester in the Mikuni's corporate test kitchen.
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Thanks Marc! Mikuni's seriously needs to open up down here.

The eductor is attached to a pump, not operated by gravity. I used this one on a Mag 2:
http://www.aquaticeco.com/index.cfm/fuseaction/product.detail/iid/7967
 
Have you tried Godzilla Sushi, they are out in Pacific Heights on Divisadero, I believe on the corner of Bush St. Pretty close when you relocate back to GG park. There are also a couple in the Avenues just South of the park along Irving St.

The eductor would give a big boost,I know Tim (tfp) uses them in his 300. The output boosts is like 5 to 1, really amazing use of free energy.
 
Thanks, Matt, and everyone else for contributing to this thread. I think if I decide to put a surge device on my tank, I would go with the one suggested in this thread by Matt and probably just bite the proverbial bullet and buy an all-plastic electronic valve. Regarding eductors, I also use them on my 300 as well, they do indeed give you a lot of bang for the buck, so I'll definitely second them!
 
<a href=showthread.php?s=&postid=11219305#post11219305 target=_blank>Originally posted</a> by DrDNA
Thanks, Matt, and everyone else for contributing to this thread. I think if I decide to put a surge device on my tank, I would go with the one suggested in this thread by Matt and probably just bite the proverbial bullet and buy an all-plastic electronic valve. Regarding eductors, I also use them on my 300 as well, they do indeed give you a lot of bang for the buck, so I'll definitely second them!
Click to expand...

Cool! You should post pics when you do it. :D
 
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