Better future for Banggais
- Thread starter avagelli
- Start date
David M
New member
It's not that you can't sell them, that is easy. It's that you can't sell them for enough money to even come close to covering your costs and there's not a chance in a hot place you can actually make money raising them. So for now the captive breeding is really up to the devoted hobbyist who does it for love, not money. The best plan I have come up with so far is to raise a few every now and then and keep them until they mature and pair off. Then I sell the pairs directly to hobbyists at $75 - $100 plus shipping. It's not a huge market and it's not what I would call profitable but at least it's a decent return and I am doing something I feel good about.
point taken David- no worries
But i have to agree w/ your statement. It never about selling these fish, its about being able to get back anything equitable in return that will justify your labor and expenses.
IIRC, even the commercial facilities (like ORA) has not put lots of effort into this fish, primarily due to its costs. I believe another large commmercial firm was working on them back in the late 90's, but found they had to devote too much space, and cost into raising the small batches, so their cost out the door was approx $25, meaning they'd have to sell wholesale fish higher. Hence retailers would be selling $100/fish.
Now back in 1995 when i saw my first banggai, i paid $100+ for each fish-yeah, but today, you wouldn't find anyone willing to pay that.
frank
But i have to agree w/ your statement. It never about selling these fish, its about being able to get back anything equitable in return that will justify your labor and expenses.
IIRC, even the commercial facilities (like ORA) has not put lots of effort into this fish, primarily due to its costs. I believe another large commmercial firm was working on them back in the late 90's, but found they had to devote too much space, and cost into raising the small batches, so their cost out the door was approx $25, meaning they'd have to sell wholesale fish higher. Hence retailers would be selling $100/fish.
Now back in 1995 when i saw my first banggai, i paid $100+ for each fish-yeah, but today, you wouldn't find anyone willing to pay that.
frank
vitz
New member
Re: Better future for Banggais
according to the noaa website, anywhere from close to 3/4 of a million to nearly a million of them are collected a year
is this a truly accurate assessment? estimates of trade collection of various animal species by 'experts' has been way off before, sometimes laughably so (not saying that anything stated here is laughable, by any means
)
according to the noaa website, anywhere from close to 3/4 of a million to nearly a million of them are collected a year
is this a truly accurate assessment? estimates of trade collection of various animal species by 'experts' has been way off before, sometimes laughably so (not saying that anything stated here is laughable, by any means
)It's such a shame that more effort is not put into captive breeding.
My total cost (if I take out labour) to raise a batch of 25 for 6 months is approx $140. I pay for replacement bulbs and t5's for my main with the profit.
I Hope to pay all running costs by the end of this year.....(although the elect bill is a bit expensive)
Axe
My total cost (if I take out labour) to raise a batch of 25 for 6 months is approx $140. I pay for replacement bulbs and t5's for my main with the profit.
I Hope to pay all running costs by the end of this year.....(although the elect bill is a bit expensive)
Axe
Hey axe is that really all the costs ? Salt, electricity, your "worktime hour", money invested with the setup from the beggining, parents acquisition, food and everything expend with the parents from the beggining as well... ?
Even if it´s so, it´s already more than US$5,00 per fish what is pretty high if you think of it as an investment. How much can you get on them ?
In the banggai culture manual they were able to sell the fish for US$7,00 with profit and it was made with a lot of effort to change usual methods to make them cheaper and less laboured.
Anderson.
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EDIT:
Sorry axe, didn´t saw you took labour out of the total costs.Though you shouldn´t as it can become a large percentage of it with few batches at a time.
Anderson again.
Even if it´s so, it´s already more than US$5,00 per fish what is pretty high if you think of it as an investment. How much can you get on them ?
In the banggai culture manual they were able to sell the fish for US$7,00 with profit and it was made with a lot of effort to change usual methods to make them cheaper and less laboured.
Anderson.
****************************************************
EDIT:
Sorry axe, didn´t saw you took labour out of the total costs.
Though you shouldn´t as it can become a large percentage of it with few batches at a time.Anderson again.
Last edited:
vitz-
funny you make that comment....Alex is the worlds most noted expert on banggai cardinalfish, he has traveled to the banggai archipelago 3-5 times and he has personally performed the census that you see published. His most recent census suggested collection of over 700,000 of these fish annually, and unfortunately it also showed a major decline in banggai populations thruout the archipelago. Yes I believe the data
funny you make that comment....Alex is the worlds most noted expert on banggai cardinalfish, he has traveled to the banggai archipelago 3-5 times and he has personally performed the census that you see published. His most recent census suggested collection of over 700,000 of these fish annually, and unfortunately it also showed a major decline in banggai populations thruout the archipelago. Yes I believe the data
ediaz
Active member
I sell a lot different non clownfish species and the price is based on the wild caught price if the fish gets banned or they establish quotas the price of TR will go up and stay up no matter how many breeders flod the market.
If i am lucky i get 7 dollars for an orchid dottyback why beacuse from the red sea you can get them landed for 4 dollars each, for tha neon I get 15 dollars each it costs 14 landed from country of origin.This is to wholesalers that buy 200+.The fish require the same amount of work and thechniques.
Alex good job something to admire, I got about 10 calls and about 20 emails from wholesalers I supply worried about your proposal and asking me to start producing this fish in captivity wich I doubt I'll do anyways. Glad someone is making a difference.
Ed
If i am lucky i get 7 dollars for an orchid dottyback why beacuse from the red sea you can get them landed for 4 dollars each, for tha neon I get 15 dollars each it costs 14 landed from country of origin.This is to wholesalers that buy 200+.The fish require the same amount of work and thechniques.
Alex good job something to admire, I got about 10 calls and about 20 emails from wholesalers I supply worried about your proposal and asking me to start producing this fish in captivity wich I doubt I'll do anyways. Glad someone is making a difference.
Ed
David M
New member
There is a cost not considered in the posts above, perhaps the single most important one. It is called the "opportunity cost" :smokin: The point being that even if you could sell bangaii for more than the hard cost of raising them, you'd be letting $1000's of dollars you could have made using the same space, time and resources raising clownfish slip right through your hands.
Edgar, sending PM, I think you are getting screwed on the fridmani.
Edgar, sending PM, I think you are getting screwed on the fridmani.
Dman
New member
David makes the same point I've made to my partner over and over again, sure they're easy and sure we could sell them, but I could make 10-20 times more money with clowns utilizing the same space.
Now, if and when they go on CITES and we see a marked appreciation in their value, the same argument may not apply.
Now, if and when they go on CITES and we see a marked appreciation in their value, the same argument may not apply.
catdoc
Premium Member
How does raising banggai compare to raising, say maroons? Time-wise, especially. I figured banggai were a lot easier to try first since they don't need rotifers, even if I don't get as many fish out of it. I do have a pair of maroons who lay humongo spawns if I work up the nerve and time to try raising any.
catdoc
Premium Member
Yes, but I'm pretty intimidated by the whole rotifer culturing. I have read on it (here and in the book), just really leery of biting off more than I can chew. That's why I was hoping for a comparison the time involvement--raising bbs is easy, mix 'em up, strain 'em the next day, start the next batch. Rotifers, greenwater, and multiple vats of each just sounds like a LOT more work.
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