Biopellet Reactor: Tuning

[gdemos]

Logical: decrease media and increase effluent. Seems that the amount of recirculating in the reactor as opposed to "flow in-flow out" just perpetuates biomass buildup. I guess my only reason for increasing media was the fact that such a small
Amount of media in such a large reactor seemed paradoxical. I suppose I can just let the pellets burn down and keep cleaning as needed them keep the media at a lowered level with increased effluent.


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[DamonG]

Hmm.. I am at a loss, besides the pellets like we talked about, because I've never had that.. But then, like we discussed long ago,I have only used the rd pellets..

Now, with the tumble versus output, the thing that Jeff mentioned to me, is that you don't want the top layer to move much, or your shedding a lot.. That us controlled with your tumble valve. I usually kick off mine hard maybe once every 2 to 3 months for a few seconds, maybe 10 to 15.. Otherwise, my pellets look honestly like they are just wiggling the upper half of the amount of pellets.. The bottom,I cab easily see the pellets moving around, but I tumble them soft.

But even with the soft tumble, because of the nature of that reactor, you really don't need a lot of pellets.. Not at all.. And if you do have a good amount of pellets, note that I think about it, if your trying to get them all to tumble, it could be that, even though it doesn't "look"like it, you could be shedding a good bit.. Could be.. But the pellets shouldn't break down like that.. I still stick to and with that.. And honestly, trickle is how I've pretty much airways run mine, because of the effectiveness of the pellets..

But it didn't look like, in your videos it was tumbling too hard to shed like that.. And honestly dude, I don't even think about that reactor except a couple times a year to look at the pellets and see if I needed to add some more.. I honestly forget about that reactor that much..

I know your looking at other options also, and really, I don't blame you.. But before you go that route, I'd really try and get some more dynamics pellets.. And slow down the tumble rate as goofy as it sounds.. And the pellets shouldn't stick(of course, I base this off my expertise with rd pellets)..

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[gdemos]

Besides this being a media specific issue; i.e. Some nature of the pellet causing this excessive bacterial build up, I have to think when bacterial build up occurs it manifests and you can only take certain measures to fix it. On the media issue if dr tims truly is the best (and appears widely accepted) I can't blame that. If RD pellets are 'best designed for this reactor' perhaps that plays a part. It would come down to the Pellet structure (shape), composition (fillers or pure plastics) and durability (ability to withstand nutrient load and flow rate so as not to break down too rapidly).

I will say that so far as objective of no3 and po4 reduction this works! I went from 100ppm no3 to .02 and my po4 tests at .01-.06. My sps are looking good and as you know this is mostly Aussie stuff and some collected frags here and there with a high fish load. Not too many guys go this combo. So I am pushing things from the norm I suppose.

Yes I have considered changing to Aquaforest zeomix, phosphate minus, pro bio s, and pro np (that's a liquid polymer). That's a lot of product and dosing so not entirely convinced that's the path I'll take.

I'm past the stage most may give up on BIOPELLET (can't get them to work, cyano, can't find a good reactor, etc) soldiering through all that but I am at a point where I have a tough time changing flow/media brand/media quantity and the need to constantly clean sludge...all to possibly eliminate a natural process that is bacterial build up.

Two things that **** me off: Jeff is out of the biz and dr Tim is not helpful. Whereas a full bodied approach (Zeo, AF ) has a growing and communicative user base. You guys (Damon, aqua, others are certainly appreciated!) but a larger audience would be nice!

I'll post another video this weekend. Daddy daughter dance tonight can u believe the school won't sponsor this anymore now parents are putting it up themselves! Cmon.


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[Aqualund]

Well you could always go with an Aqualund reactor Just reduce the number of pellets and you'll be golden!

 

[DamonG]

Besides this being a media specific issue; i.e. Some nature of the pellet causing this excessive bacterial build up, I have to think when bacterial build up occurs it manifests and you can only take certain measures to fix it. On the media issue if dr tims truly is the best (and appears widely accepted) I can't blame that. If RD pellets are 'best designed for this reactor' perhaps that plays a part. It would come down to the Pellet structure (shape), composition (fillers or pure plastics) and durability (ability to withstand nutrient load and flow rate so as not to break down too rapidly).

I will say that so far as objective of no3 and po4 reduction this works! I went from 100ppm no3 to .02 and my po4 tests at .01-.06. My sps are looking good and as you know this is mostly Aussie stuff and some collected frags here and there with a high fish load. Not too many guys go this combo. So I am pushing things from the norm I suppose.

Yes I have considered changing to Aquaforest zeomix, phosphate minus, pro bio s, and pro np (that's a liquid polymer). That's a lot of product and dosing so not entirely convinced that's the path I'll take.

I'm past the stage most may give up on BIOPELLET (can't get them to work, cyano, can't find a good reactor, etc) soldiering through all that but I am at a point where I have a tough time changing flow/media brand/media quantity and the need to constantly clean sludge...all to possibly eliminate a natural process that is bacterial build up.

Two things that **** me off: Jeff is out of the biz and dr Tim is not helpful. Whereas a full bodied approach (Zeo, AF ) has a growing and communicative user base. You guys (Damon, aqua, others are certainly appreciated!) but a larger audience would be nice!

I'll post another video this weekend. Daddy daughter dance tonight can u believe the school won't sponsor this anymore now parents are putting it up themselves! Cmon.


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what? On the dance and the school.. They are cutting back evening that has not already been cut back.. It's unfortunate.. Really is..

And remember, Jeff isn't really out of the buisness.. He still has his other site, and you can still get pellets.. That is what I would do personally..

And, I am looking, like we discussed at their(AF) zeolite media myself.. The main thing that always kept me from going zeovit full blast was the shaking of the stones.. The dosing part, yes, it could be annoying depending on how many products you use.. But.. You could also put them on a dosing pump and just automate it.. The things like bacteria, you can't, simply because it has to be refrigerated, unless you make a refrigeration unit to dose.. And I'm part of their group also, but just like you,I don't want to do bottle juggling.. And switching over to a completely new method, mid steam in a system full of coral is asking for trouble.. So I'm just observing for a bit, while at the same time, I'm utilizing their gfo and bacteria to see how it does...

But for me, it's not the nitrate.. Lol, honestly,I don't think I'll ever cease using pellets simply because of how effective they are with nitrate.. It's phosphate for me that is the annoyance.. I wish someone would come up with something to manage them like pellets, so that you can forget about them.. And go on with other reef related tasks..

But I would order some of those NoPo pellets, leave maybe 4 to 10 of the old pellets in the reactor for seed, and then go with it.. What your dealing with would **** me off too.. I'm straight up with you on that..



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[gdemos]

My plan at present is to keep things as is although I will try out AF pro bio s for some bacterial diversity. I have been using Coral e and b and I like what I'm seeing! So far as making a full switch perhaps but AF is new in the us and I'm not an early adopter type.

I plan on letting the current pellet load burn down to lesser media and will then increase effluent rate.

Yeah daddy daughter is outlawed. Too gender specific. I get that some daughters don't have father figures and that could be an issue. But this is more about gender neutrality. Crazy times. At least my anthias are not alone now in their wavering gender issues.


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[gdemos]

Well i am continuing to get excess biomass and/or excess undisolved polymer build up in the reactor. left unattended for a couple weeks results in restricted flow. i basically have to break down the reactor for thorough cleaning of ALL lines and fittings Monthly to remove the sludge.

Having run the reactor now for a few months with less media I believe that teh media chamber does not have the weight needed to keep the pellets flowing evenly. as a result i am tumbling more aggressively otherwise i cant get the whole chamber to tumble properly. this is likely causing increased rate of media breakdown and shedding of material quickly enough to cause buildup.

so i'm going more media. keeping effluent constant this should have no adverse impact.

FYI, the former Reef Dynamics, now Aquarium source is in beta testing for a whole new reactor.

 

[NS Mike D]

my reactor can't keep the pellets flowing more than a few day and so the sludge builds up. I have given up and am not going to upgrade the reactor so I just make cleaning it part of my regular maintenance. The outflow has a fine filtration bag on it so that the sludge doesn't go back into the tank and will be exported during he cleaning. While it's more work, IMO, the mechanical removal of the build up is pretty effective. Not my first choice, but it get the job done.

 

[RTab619]

Following

 

[gdemos]

NS- I have thought about putting an inline filter of sorts but when the sludge build up occurs it is pervasive. Clings to every line/pipe/fitting and just builds up. I've found in my setup the increase volume of pellets indeed weights down better and allows for more even and subtle fluidization. So if this then slows the breaking down of the media it should help somewhat in excess biomass.


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[DamonG]

Well i am continuing to get excess biomass and/or excess undisolved polymer build up in the reactor. left unattended for a couple weeks results in restricted flow. i basically have to break down the reactor for thorough cleaning of ALL lines and fittings Monthly to remove the sludge.

Having run the reactor now for a few months with less media I believe that teh media chamber does not have the weight needed to keep the pellets flowing evenly. as a result i am tumbling more aggressively otherwise i cant get the whole chamber to tumble properly. this is likely causing increased rate of media breakdown and shedding of material quickly enough to cause buildup.

so i'm going more media. keeping effluent constant this should have no adverse impact.

FYI, the former Reef Dynamics, now Aquarium source is in beta testing for a whole new reactor.

You know dude, that's so odd.. I honestly can only think of one thing at this point, floaters.. But that is even a long shot.. That or shedding.. But I tried something when I moved, and I still am having no issues after two months: I turned up the tumble, but the flow through is just a trickle.. And still, it's flowing fine.. And no sludge..

Is there possibly anything in your water, possibly anything, that could be affecting them? Because besides tumble, floaters that got through, and shedding, I've never heard or seen that.. Maybe an additive? Can you think of anything? Including feeding and what's in the food that may cause this or an excessive shredding(and honestly, at this point I mean shredding, because it's like it's melting the pellets in your case)?

I'm at a loss to bee honest.. What did Jeff have to say?

from note 7

 

[gdemos]

Jeff is out of the biz so no corresponding there. So far as additives or anything that may create sludge I can't say for sure. This was happening before any AF products I've been using (coral e, b, pro bio s) and very sparingly. Other additives haven't changed much, heavy feeding, aminos, potassium, iron, lugols. I did speak with seachem (I use salinity salt and fuel, purigen) and spoke about remediation so trying that out. Thinking remediation could be a new strain of Bacteria to help breakdown sludge. We concluded the call with: increase the flow through reactor. Also reduce pellets but in my size reactor a low volume of media makes for uneven tumble so I just bumped the flow, continue my feeding and monitoring. So far less sludge.


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[Aqualund]

Wow. That's so weird.

So my recommendation in these situations is always to reduce the amount of pellets in the reactor, and open up the effluent output (higher gph into the system).

 

[gdemos]

Wow. That's so weird.

thanks for your help Aqualund, immodest deliberate condescension noted. Take into account my situation here: reduction in media = fluidization problems (in my reactor). so taken alone, your suggestion in my case is not entirely helpful. As also i would say that Dr. Tims pellets is the be all-end all, i would contest in my endeavors.

i would prefer to think that anyone researching or actively using Biopellet would stand to benefit by reading through my observations.

 

[Aqualund]

Imagine my position: Regularly log into the site to offer advice and suggestions in order to help increase the success rate of the hobby, and have my advice continually overlooked, and even go so far as to read that the same advice was only taken when given from someone at seachem (months later!).

Why even ask for advice on these forums if you regularly ignore it, and the only advice you do value is from people working for companies with brand identity?

Thank you for noting my condescension, and to be fair, I think it is well deserved.

 

[Sohal Tang Tim]

mysis

mysis

point of interest...someone said above the mysis is low in phosphate...

yes..that may be true but the *water* that they packkkk it in is LOADED
with phosphate...So...if someone is simply melting Mysis in their tank they are adding phosphate.

cheers


Tim

 

[trueperc]

Can any one help two guys out. Both of us have been in the hobby for while but are thinking about using bio pellets. Currently both of us are using no pox. What we seem to be stuck on is the reactor. From most I have read, recirculating is the way to go. My friend seems to remember, it does not matter and really is leaning toward the aquamaxx. I have to say at almost half the cost of most recirculating reactors I am leaning too. Can you help with a reason for recirculating over normal reactor or does it really matter?

 

[gdemos]

Can any one help two guys out. Both of us have been in the hobby for while but are thinking about using bio pellets. Currently both of us are using no pox. What we seem to be stuck on is the reactor. From most I have read, recirculating is the way to go. My friend seems to remember, it does not matter and really is leaning toward the aquamaxx. I have to say at almost half the cost of most recirculating reactors I am leaning too. Can you help with a reason for recirculating over normal reactor or does it really matter?

There are others here that have tried numerous types of BP Reactors, my only experience is with a recirculating (Reef Dynamics 500 which is no longer in production). The commonly accepted benefit of the recirc reactor is the ability to independently adjust effluent rate and tumble or media fluidization rate.

 

[Aqualund]

I make recirculating reactors and use them on about 10 systems in my coral farm and 15 maintenance customer locations (and have sold about 150 units). To me, it just seems obvious, and second nature. On my home DT I put in pellets about 6 months ago and just now I am thinking about adding more pellets. But I havent had to touch it once, have done no water changes, and My PO4 is <.08 and NO3 is <1ppm.

It's a great way to manage Nitrates is a safe manner,.

 

[reefteaser]

Just found this thread. I purchased one of Aqualund's reactors earlier this year after attempting to use bio pellets in a cheaper non-recirculating one with frustratingly little result. It's certainly more expensive than the DIY I was going to try, but it's well designed and made and I am very happy with my purchase.
My nitrates have gone from 30+ to .2-.5 (Salifert). Phosphates do not show up on a test, but I'm growing a healthy red "fluff" in my sump and a few very small spots of GHA in the display, so I'm assuming it's just getting consumed.
I noticed big reduction recently on algae on the glass, then saw that my output from the reactor had been clogged, so I'm thinking I need to turn down the effluent, which I just did.
I've been using Dr. Tim's pearls, which state in the instructions it wasn't necessary to feed the output directly into my skimmer. I'm now doing that as well, just to see if I can skim out more "stuff". Other brands say to do this, not sure why Tim's says it's not required.
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