Borbonius Anthias getting worse in QT! Please advise, treated with prazi

[clownishgambino]

I got my hands on a "in the bag" special from a LFS for a borbonius anthias. I got her at a good price knowing I will be QT'ing. The first two days I didn't treat and just watched. During this time she was eating pretty well but not very aggressively, she was also out all the time. The fish was also scratching at the pvc so I figured she had some type of flukes. The third day she was still eating but looked like less than before so I decided to treat with prazipro on the 4th day. I treated the 10gal tank with a little less than 1/2 tsp because of the displacement of water from the rocks. As soon as I put it in she started thrashing and shaking a bit, and for a second looked like a thin layer/film on her eye was peeling off. I was staring at the tank the entire time and within a couple of minutes I could see what looked like the flukes floating around in the tank, it looked like pieces of dandruff no more than a millimeter in length/width. I treated the night of 1/9/15. That night and for 2 days after she was great and went for food more actively than, before, she would also be out all the time in the open. But on the 3rd day, she didnt come out at ALL, couldn't even feed her, this was the same on the 4th day (today). I thought it might be something wrong with the water so I did a 50% water change yesterday (dripped the water in to not shock the fish) and redosed 1/4 tsp of prazi to replace what was lost. It is about to be the end of the second day without food, do you think she is acting this way due to the flukes or treatment? Or something else? Perhaps another disease/sickness that wasn't presenting itself yet? What might be the problem and what should I do? Also I noticed the morning after the prazi that the top portion of her tailfin was slightly frayed, I'm almost certain it wasn't like this before the prazi

Parameters:
Ammonia on yellow on seachem ammonia alert (<.02)
Salinity 1.024
Temp: 75.4

Also have an airstone running in the tank.

One thing I'd like to mention, maybe it will help, I heard prazipro is supposed to kill bristleworms? It didn't seem to do so in this case, I saw a large one sticking out of a rock to look for food last night and pulled out another little one (<1cm). Perhaps I put in a wrong dose and its just weakening them which is why the little one was off the rock? I put the little bristleworm in a cup to see if itll die and it didn't even in a cup of cold tank water over night



TL;DR-
-Fish has flukes
-Treat with prazi
-Fine for first 2 days, eats well
-Doesn't come out on third day, now about the be the end of 4th day
-Hasn't eaten since second day
-Whats wrong?!?!?

Thanks for your help!!

 

[sabo]

Could be either. Most of the fish I treat with prazi tend to lose appetite. Also if it was heavily infested, I have read that some fish even die when the flukes die due to blood loss. Not sure how true that is but seems plausable. Probably best to give it a few days then dose again.

 

[Chief Reef]

Could be either. Most of the fish I treat with prazi tend to lose appetite. Also if it was heavily infested, I have read that some fish even die when the flukes die due to blood loss. Not sure how true that is but seems plausable. Probably best to give it a few days then dose again.

this. Its likey your fish was just heavily infested and is now stressed from all the open wounds that are suddenly there because of the flukes falling off. some fish have been known to die of shock if there were too many.

Also prazi didnt kill any of my bristleworms in my experience, copper sure did though. Also prazi has been known to lower the availabe oxygen in the water a bit, could try putting in an airstone or moving a power head towards the surface to have more surface agitation. will help with oxygen if thats the problem, and at the very least help the fish breath easier.

 

[tkeracer619]

Adding an antibiotic may be helpful.

Kanaplex seems to be readily available and works well.

 

[Chief Reef]

Anti biotics could help but id be hesitant about mixing medications with prazi. But i dont know too much about how they react so it's possible it could be ok, maybe someone can chime in on that.

also wow i just noticed your name. Clownish gambino and chief reef. too funny.

 

[Newsmyrna80]

I got my hands on a "in the bag" special from a LFS for a borbonius anthias. I got her at a good price knowing I will be QT'ing. The first two days I didn't treat and just watched. During this time she was eating pretty well but not very aggressively, she was also out all the time. The fish was also scratching at the pvc so I figured she had some type of flukes. The third day she was still eating but looked like less than before so I decided to treat with prazipro on the 4th day. I treated the 10gal tank with a little less than 1/2 tsp because of the displacement of water from the rocks. As soon as I put it in she started thrashing and shaking a bit, and for a second looked like a thin layer/film on her eye was peeling off. I was staring at the tank the entire time and within a couple of minutes I could see what looked like the flukes floating around in the tank, it looked like pieces of dandruff no more than a millimeter in length/width. I treated the night of 1/9/15. That night and for 2 days after she was great and went for food more actively than, before, she would also be out all the time in the open. But on the 3rd day, she didnt come out at ALL, couldn't even feed her, this was the same on the 4th day (today). I thought it might be something wrong with the water so I did a 50% water change yesterday (dripped the water in to not shock the fish) and redosed 1/4 tsp of prazi to replace what was lost. It is about to be the end of the second day without food, do you think she is acting this way due to the flukes or treatment? Or something else? Perhaps another disease/sickness that wasn't presenting itself yet? What might be the problem and what should I do? Also I noticed the morning after the prazi that the top portion of her tailfin was slightly frayed, I'm almost certain it wasn't like this before the prazi

Parameters:
Ammonia on yellow on seachem ammonia alert (<.02)
Salinity 1.024
Temp: 75.4

Also have an airstone running in the tank.

One thing I'd like to mention, maybe it will help, I heard prazipro is supposed to kill bristleworms? It didn't seem to do so in this case, I saw a large one sticking out of a rock to look for food last night and pulled out another little one (<1cm). Perhaps I put in a wrong dose and its just weakening them which is why the little one was off the rock? I put the little bristleworm in a cup to see if itll die and it didn't even in a cup of cold tank water over night



TL;DR-
-Fish has flukes
-Treat with prazi
-Fine for first 2 days, eats well
-Doesn't come out on third day, now about the be the end of 4th day
-Hasn't eaten since second day
-Whats wrong?!?!?

Thanks for your help!!

Whether it be through water changes, adding bio Spira, or LR the ammonia needs to be at 0. You could also add an ammonia detoxifier.
All of the above posts are correct; Prazi will suppress appetite and reduce oxygen. Since Prazi will stay in the water for 72 hours you should see appetite come back assuming that is the only problem. As mentioned if a fish is inidated with flukes a sudden exodus can cause blood loss and secondary infections as the fluke's hooks release the fish's flesh. Water quality is very important at this point.
Also know that the healing of these wounds will likely cause the fish to scratch just as in does in humans.
I would keep the water clean and try to get him eating again before dosing the next round of Prazi.
Did you happen to take a pic of the "dandruff" in the tank? A lot of people don't know what they are looking for after dosing Prazi or doing a dip.

 

[clownishgambino]

Thanks for all your reply guys, I didn't reply right away but read it pretty much as it was posted and I really appreciate it. I've read about the blood loss when flukes release and was really hoping this wasn't the case, seems like a terrible way to go. I forgot to mention I've been feeding her food soaked with Focus and Metronidazole ever since I got her.

There great news though, she was out and eating again late last night after almost 48 hours without food, and has been out all morning!! Would antibiotics still be useful or would be be a waste at this point since shes better (at least for now)?

I'll be doing a large water change today since its the 5th day, also I've got around 7 pounds of live rock in there (2 pieces about 6x6x6), is that enough to keep the ammonia down in conjunction with the water changes? Unfortunately I did not take a picture of the "dandruff," I'd imagine though that with my phone camera none would be visible. They were slightly transparent, maybe just cause they were so thin. I'll be honest I have no idea what I'm looking for when I dose, just been comparing behavior before and after treatment so far. It looked kind of like the molt of a tiny amphipod.

Hahaha I noticed the names too, I bet we'd get along

 

[Newsmyrna80]

Good news! I would wait on the antibiotics. Feed vitamin soaked food and keep an eye on the ammonia. I would think that much LR would be enough in a QT but it may not be. If you have well seeded filter media from the main you could put that in the QTs filter.
That's a good description, they do look like amphipod molt

 

[clownishgambino]

Just wanted to update the thread, the borbonius is doing great and eating like a champ. she would charge a piece of food from the other side of the tank which she wasn't doing before. It's also the third day of the second prazi treatment. This time there wasn't such a violent reaction from the fish like the first time, she was swimming in her normal spot while the medication was dissipating like nothing was happening. I did notice she would get more picky with her food during the 2 days of treatment, while she would still charge it she would actually eat it only about half the time. Also I've noticed her color has been fading since about the second day of the first treatment. The pink portion looks pretty pale but I can see the spots pretty well, yellow during the day and slightly brown during the night. is this normal during qt or should I be worried it's something else creeping up? I also don't have a light on the tank, just ambient light from the lamp in the room. Do you guys think it's alright for me to put her in the DT? It's been about 2-2.5 weeks. Thanks for reading

 

[Kidd Reef]

Just wanted to update the thread, the borbonius is doing great and eating like a champ. she would charge a piece of food from the other side of the tank which she wasn't doing before. It's also the third day of the second prazi treatment. This time there wasn't such a violent reaction from the fish like the first time, she was swimming in her normal spot while the medication was dissipating like nothing was happening. I did notice she would get more picky with her food during the 2 days of treatment, while she would still charge it she would actually eat it only about half the time. Also I've noticed her color has been fading since about the second day of the first treatment. The pink portion looks pretty pale but I can see the spots pretty well, yellow during the day and slightly brown during the night. is this normal during qt or should I be worried it's something else creeping up? I also don't have a light on the tank, just ambient light from the lamp in the room. Do you guys think it's alright for me to put her in the DT? It's been about 2-2.5 weeks. Thanks for reading

No way man, Dont know where you bought that fish from but if they run non therapeutic levels of copper it'll be 3-4 weeks before she shows any symptoms of disease. I would give it a little more time, Hate for you to put her in only to have a disease break out. Actually besides prazi i dont see that you've treated the fish with anything. Fish can carry ich without ever showing symptoms so i'd reccomend doing TTM (since the fish seem's to have a bad reaction to medication) to make 100% sure ich isnt present. Should take aroud 12 days to do properly which allow you to treat her and deal with the 1 and half weeks more you need of observaton.

 

[Newsmyrna80]

^agree. Given that the fish had a lot of flukes I would go at least one more round of Prazi and confirm eradication with a FW dip. Also as mentioned the risk of diseases such as ich, brook and velvet is still viable. You could pair TT with Prazi then observe.

 

[chgoblknazn]

Any update on the borb? Did it come through with flying colors?