Breeding System/Rack Suggestions

[tanglovers]

Hi All,

Well I have been doing a lot of reading and searching the different threads out here the last couple months about breeding different fish. I am interested in possibly setting up a small rack system to hold broodstock then once they mature and begin breeding setting up a growout system and a larvae hatching setup. I have the last month or so gotten my greenwater station established and seeming to be going well with nanno. and rotifers building up their densities. I have been looking at various rack system pictures here and have a couple setup questions and also some questions about tank sizes for broodstock. I just got done reading martin moe's dottyback book and wilkerson's clownfishes. Any others recommended/suggested?

I am looking to build a rack system to house a couple different species of fish. I am not sure of the exact though other then a couple tanks to hold clownfish (occelaris and maybe percs if I want to raise babies that long before being able to sell/get rid of them).

What size broodstock tanks would you recommend for the following:

Clownfish (occelaris, percs, skunks?)
Gobies (yellow clown, neon)
Banggai Cardinals
Pseudochromis (orchid, neon)

From the reading I have done was thinking 10-15 gallon tanks for the clowns, 30-40 gallon for the banggai and 20 gallons for the pseudochromis. I do not have intentions of breeding these all just want to know the requirements so I can decide what I can incorporate in my rack with the space I have to build it in. I have not been able to see much on tank size for the gobies I am interested in.

Also with your rack systems, I want this to be designed for easy maintenance and energy efficient. In your opinion would it be better to have a large tank at the top of the system (40 gallon) and feed the tanks below via gravity then use one pump to pump the water back to the top? Or is it better to have a pressure pump/pressurized feed line to supply all the tanks? I am considering the gravity fed system except I imagine I will need a large sump at the bottom to catch the water in the event of a power outage etc and not sure I have the room to accommodate this.

Also what is the typical turn over rate for broodstock tanks? Like 1-2 x volume per hour? I am accustom to SPS reef tanks with huge flow. If it is a slow turn over rate, can one heater in the sump be enough to heat all the tanks? This is going in the basement fish room and the ambient temperature is about 66 degrees.

Also do you guys typically run UV and/or Ozone on broodstock tanks?

Also do you guys used substrates/live rock for added biological filtration or barebottom etc? I have seen both implemented at other breeding setups.

Any other suggestions for a rookie/newbie. I want to make sure I try to have everything planned out to a Tee before starting/deciding if I really want to take this project on.

Thanks,
Scott

 

[David M]

was thinking 10-15 gallon tanks for the clowns, 30-40 gallon for the banggai and 20 gallons for the pseudochromis.
>> sounds good

Clownfish (occelaris, percs, skunks?)
>> IME the skunks take waaaay too long to grow out and are not a very popular fish anyway, tough to market

would it be better to have a large tank at the top of the system (40 gallon) and feed the tanks below via gravity then use one pump to pump the water back to the top?
>> I am a big fan of gravity fed systems with a large header tank but had to move on as they become impracticle for larger systems. If it's just a few tanks then it's a good way to go. Look at that system in Moe's book, probably less than 100 gallons, right?

Also do you guys used substrates/live rock for added biological filtration or barebottom etc?
>> some do, some don't. I like a thin layer of fine sand in the broodstock tanks, not so much as bio-filter but it keeps the tank cleaner than bb. The fish are constantly stirring up the sand which sends detritus into the water and filtered out. I go bb in the growout tanks but the bottom grows a heavy slime which needs periodic cleaning, I don't like to disturb the broodstock so don't wanna be going in there to clean.

Any other suggestions for a rookie/newbie.
>> choose ocellaris

 

[Kathy55g]

Plan out, and get the electrical wired first. Sucks trying to do that with 500 baby fish in water below where you are working.

 

[Kathy55g]

Heaters, air pumps, big water pump, lights, auto feeders if you are using them, UV, protein skimmer if used, powerheads for mixing water, heaters for mixing water, etc.

Nexte think about labor saving placement. Gravity is your friend. I like my overflow on my sump and elevated water tubs for top off and water changes

 

[spk]

I would agree with Kathy, get your wiring done first. Trying to do that after is a nightmare.

Steve

 

[David M]

What? Doesn't everyone just string a bunch of power strips together at the last minute, dangling them over water and securing in place with tie wraps???

The worst part is, I am a liscensed electrician

 

[rsman]

Doesn't everyone just string a bunch of power strips together at the last minute, dangling them over water and securing in place with tie wraps???

tie wraps ???

thats way to permenent duct tape is a much better option. and those 3 outlet splitters work great they let you plug in something in between the extension cordz and power strips. 3 prong adapters are handy items to keep around also

 

[spk]

Ok,

I give up, i wish that i had done all the leccy work before i begun. now it looks like spagehtti junction

Steve

 

[Kathy55g]

<a href=showthread.php?s=&postid=7416233#post7416233 target=_blank>Originally posted</a> by David M
What? Doesn't everyone just string a bunch of power strips together at the last minute, dangling them over water and securing in place with tie wraps???

I could say "Works for me!" but I'm pretty sure, now I've tried it, that it doesn't...

 

[Dman]

As a fourth year apprentice, I too was using power bars plugged into power bars ad nauseum. When I changed insurance companies they wanted to send over an inspector, damn. Took me over two weeks to clean that mess up. Also, be very careful where you put your receptacles, I've put as many as I can in the ceiling to limit them from getting shorted out from water splashing.
Otherwise, there really is no substitute for lots and lots of square footage ( I know as I don't have any)
Cleaning tanks are a hassle, so I've made mine plug and play, ie. I can turn tanks off and move them to a sink to be cleaned/repaired. And be prepared for the worst love/hate relationship with salt creep you've ever had.
Make equipment that needs to be cleaned, adjusted, replaced, tweaked or beaten easy to get at. Nothings worse than having to clean a skimmer riser that you can just barely reach or replace a bulb that requires advanced meditational yoga to get at.

 

[David M]

replace a bulb that requires advanced meditational yoga to get at.

Even that wouldn't help, I managed to burry a fixture that I will never get to now. If/ when the lamps burn out I'll hafta rig a new light for the tank

 

[Siklid]

lol I am so guilty of extension cord wiring, I have three separate power bars for my DT its not even funny, I planed it right, but then I got the equipment bug ... now ARGH!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!

lets not count my second DT and the QT

I can honestly say I can not wait to move at the end of the summer so I can fix my wiring mess, get it right, count the plugs your going to need, double that and you should be good

Ray

 

[tanglovers]

Thank You for the suggestions.

I agree I will be planning out the wiring first. In your opinion would one 20 amp circuit dedicated to the fish systems be enough, keeping in mind these are not large systems at all? Obviously multiple electrical boxes on that one outlet to avoid the numerous extension/splitter boxes.

Also what brand/type skimmers are you guys typically using? DIY or what? On our reef tanks we use a Euro-Reef and a Bubble King on the SPS tank. I am looking to do this setup on a minimal cost basis but do not want to skimp on something as important as a skimmer. I am trying this fish breeding thing more for my own interested before worrying about make money at it.

Also I am thinking, 1 system for broodstock, 1 separate system for growout. Can/should larvae tanks be stand alone tanks for each batch the juveniles moved into the growout systems after metamorphosis? Also QT tanks will be separate from all systems.
For growout, 10 gallon tanks would be really nice size and price wise, are these realistic to use for growout or are 20 gallon tanks needed?

I like the idea of a gravity feed system except have some concerns with the overall height this will require and do not want daily maintenance/upkeep to need to be done one a step stool.

Was looking at another recent thread here and looks like a 750-1000 gph pump is typically enough for 4-5 tanks at about 5 feet of head if a manifold is used. Is my thinking/reading correct?

What would you guys recommend for UV? Run one on both setups the broodstock and growout? Is it needed if these are two separate systems?

Also what other methods do you guys favor for filtration besides weekly water changes? Bio towers?

Thanks,
Scott

 

[Siklid]

<a href=showthread.php?s=&postid=7419254#post7419254 target=_blank>Originally posted</a> by tanglovers


I agree I will be planning out the wiring first. In your opinion would one 20 amp circuit dedicated to the fish systems be enough, keeping in mind these are not large systems at all? Obviously multiple electrical boxes on that one outlet to avoid the numerous extension/splitter boxes.

should be ok

Also what brand/type skimmers are you guys typically using? DIY or what? On our reef tanks we use a Euro-Reef and a Bubble King on the SPS tank. I am looking to do this setup on a minimal cost basis but do not want to skimp on something as important as a skimmer. I am trying this fish breeding thing more for my own interested before worrying about make money at it.

get one rated for 2X system and you should be good but 3X is better

Also I am thinking, 1 system for broodstock, 1 separate system for growout. Can/should larvae tanks be stand alone tanks for each batch the juveniles moved into the growout systems after metamorphosis? Also QT tanks will be separate from all systems.
For growout, 10 gallon tanks would be really nice size and price wise, are these realistic to use for growout or are 20 gallon tanks needed?

30 - 50 gal for grow out is better

I like the idea of a gravity feed system except have some concerns with the overall height this will require and do not want daily maintenance/upkeep to need to be done one a step stool.

Was looking at another recent thread here and looks like a 750-1000 gph pump is typically enough for 4-5 tanks at about 5 feet of head if a manifold is used. Is my thinking/reading correct?

depending on tanks size 3-5 times tank size is good

What would you guys recommend for UV? Run one on both setups the broodstock and growout? Is it needed if these are two separate systems?

i would have one on both

Also what other methods do you guys favor for filtration besides weekly water changes? Bio towers?

i will be using large water changes (20 - 25% weekly) and skimming with LR at 1lb per 2 gal in sump

 

[David M]

While a 20 amp circuit may provide adaquate power, it is NOT the right way to go. You should have at least 2-3 circuits, one dedicated stricktly to the "heart" whether it be a main system pump ar several smaller pumps. You don't want all circulation to stop just because a heater malfunctioned and tripped the breaker. Likewise I like to have a seperate circuit for lights, and one for heat if used. IOW isolate essential loads from non-essential loads, no point in bringing the whole thing to a standstill just because there is a problem with some skimmer pump or something. Of course I'm thinking "fishroom" here, not really a small system. In your case try to have at least 2, one for essential (water & air pumps) and one non essential (everything else) loads.

 

[Siklid]

i live in a building and well sorta stick on one circuit

 

[tanglovers]

Alright, sounds good. I will tie into more circuits and run more boxes. Our fish room has four 20 amp circuits just for it and the 220 SPS tank so I can tie into one of the others if need be.

I am now trying to decide if I want one or two rows of tanks. I am leaning towards two but am not sure how the plumbing would work. I am leaning away from a gravity fed system and looking at doing one main pump and use 1" to 1/2" reducing tees to feed the tanks. I will do some searching on how the loop style manifold works/is set up. Any tips on this?

Also what do you guys have for growout? I am pretty close to knowing how many tanks etc are going to be in my broodstock system just not sure about the growout. I am leaning towards 29 gallon tanks for the dottybacks and banggais then 10 gallons of the clowns. Growout seems like there is a wide range of what people are using ranging from 10 gallons to 70-80 gallon tubs.

 

[ediaz]

Well for a guy who has seen two of the most well planned breeding systems you are asking to many questions;-)

If you are good with making things, make your own skimmers and save a couple 100s, skimmer for broodstock does not have to be as efficient as for a reef tank.

I would have a system for brood, larvae and growout, 3, you can not have larvae exposed to the high organics of growout and even when you go for stand alone tanks for larvae, eventually maint. will become tiresome and you will wish you have a system in larval so you just can open the water and don't have to make any water changes.


I really recomend Reef flo pumps for breeding systems it pumps tons of water, so you can add up if you need to, they are cheap, the company backs you up and energy compsuption is VERY low.

For growout the bigger the better, but if money and space is a concern..., I know a few good breeders here that use 10 gal. for growout.

For dottybacks, larvae tanks must become growout, I suggest a separate system for them, juveniles can't be moved/transfered until they are a few months old unlike clownfish.

Ed

 

[tanglovers]

Hi Ed -

I know after seeing yours and Joe's systems they are very nice! I just like to get as many different options/opinions as possible before setting something up. I am looking to not do anything very large at all and more for my curiousity/interest rather then to make money at.

The rotifers and phyto are going great thanks to you Ed I appreciate all your help there.

I am sure as I look more into the possibility of setting up a system like this more questions will arrise.

Thanks, Scott

 

[james37128]

update?!