Calcium Reactor vs Dosing?

[Jeff000]

Is there a real benefit to having a Calcium reactor over just dosing?

The reactor and regulator and stuff makes it a 500-600 dollar addition to my 90 gallon (30g sump/fuge).
But I just got a softball sized pink birds nest and have some other real nice hard corals coming in over the next couple weeks and am not sure dosing can keep up I guess.

And does a calcium reactor control alk too? or do I need to dose/reactor that too?


I really should have made my stand bigger.

What other things should I know about a Calcium reactor?
I have searched and tried to find my information.

Right now I dose coral snow every couple nights, and then I dose ca and alk with my top off water so it is a steady source into the tank rather then a big dump.

 

[James77]

For a lower demand tank, 2 part dosing makes far more sense. It can easily keep up with high demand as well. Get some automatic dozers to make life alot easier for yourself.

Calcium reactors add both calc and alk in a balanced amount. IMO dosing is alot cheaper initially and costs a negligible amount more long term than a calcium reactor. Less amongsnance of probes and pumps. More reliable, as you can find plenty complainkng of inconsistent effluent rates on their reactors.

 

[The Punisher]

For your tank I'd stick with dosing, unless you start having to dose a ton to keep up with your demand. Calcium reactors, from what I've read, are better and more cost effective for bigger tanks or tanks with high calcium demand.

 

[Stanley-Reefer]

I changed to reactors a year ago....big learning curve on trouble shooting new equipment like ph probes going bad, having to calibrate them, checking alk/ph of effluent and what to change--effluent rate/ph of reactor to lower/raise values in the tank.

When I 2 parted I put it all in every morning....if one was low/high you just add/subtract and you know what is/isn't going in immediately.

I'll stay with my reactors but I feel there is more ultimate real time control with 2 part solutions and mg.

 

[ibnozn]

Why not do kalk in your top off? I have 100G total system w/ lots of SPS and it keeps up pretty well. I run a DIY Nilsen reactor but you can mix up kalkwasser in your ATO reservoir.

 

[Jeff000]

You know I have seen this Kalk mentioned a LOT for the year and bit I have been doing this, but never really looked into it.

I use seachem powder, one is cal, and the other alk. I think.

Can I dose kalk and what I am now?

I'm really starting to run out of room in my sump.
Where do I find an auto dozer?

I would love to have my tank just full of hard corals, but right now outside my big pink birds nest everything is just frags.
So for best growth there isn't really a clear winner eh, maybe i'll try a different brand to dose with?

 

[Jeff000]

I have done some more reading and I think I am even more confused now.

I figure I can buy 3 dosing pumps for about 130 bucks, and then have my PLC control the timing for the dose.
This has the advantage of not taking up much space too.

The CA reactor is about 700 all said and done, and will hardly fit in my stand.
I am being told that once dialed in they are self running for quite some time.

With the two part, I just need to make up a couple containers of mix, one being calcium and the other being alk right. Do I mix with RO water? So my ATO will run far less often this way too. But how do I figure out how much I need to dose?
Is a 3rd doser needed? Or just two?

I feel like I am leaning towards the dosing, but hard to not notice that a reactor is running on just about every nice tank that I see.

 

[billwill]

Go to bulkreefsupply.com. They have a reef calculator that tells you what you need, how much to start with, etc. Two part with dosing pumps on a 90G is more cost effective than a calc reactor. My 90G is a beautiful mixed reef, so not all nice tanks are running calc reactors.

 

[tangtang clown]

I have a 125 with mostly LPS ie Frogspawn, Bubble Coral, Leathers, GSP, and I am looking into adding SPS very soon. I make R/O-DI water for top off of evap and I store it in a 40 gallon can. Can I add Kalk to my top off of 40 gallons? I going to BRS now to look for additional help.... Thanks.

 

[biecacka]

yes tangtang you can add kalk to your ato and it will work fine, many ppl do this
corey

 

[Sk8r]

What I do: 54 gallon packed lps reef, 30 gallon sump, evaporation 1 gallon or more daily.
Basement sump, but you can do this with ANY ATO reservoir. Because I have scads of room, I use a 32 gallon Rubbermaid Brute for my ATO reservoir, and a float switch from autotopoff.com, with a maxijet topoff pump, with the 1/2 inch outflow reduced to 1/4 airline tubing. THAT is my inflow hose. I park the pump on eggcrate to keep it clear of the white slurry in the bottom.

Kalk's pretty safe, and will NOT dissolve too much in ro/di no matter how much you put in. If you shoot slurry into your tank by mistake, you might want to drop a couple of teaspoons of Schweppes Bar Soda into your tank to calm the ph down...but outside of that, a topoff accident involving kalk is dangerous NOT because of the kalk so much as the fresh water that just went in: ie, it's JUST a topoff accident, not a disaster. Again, the bar soda can take the top off the spike.

TO set up: you add 2 tsp (TEAspoons) of kalk powder per gallon (Mrs. Wages' PIckling Lime, about 5.00 for 2 lbs) into your ATO, lid it tightly except for the exit hose and cord (I use rolled paper towel for a gasket)---and bulldog clip that topoff line firmly to your sump. If that thing gets loose and drains 32 gallons of white water onto your carpet, you will be sad. That's the worst kind of kalk accident.

TO SET UP: first dose into the range you want to be in. Start with magnesium, then buffer, and 8 hours after the alk is ok, add calcium until it's where you want.

FILL THE RESERVOIR. Set up your ATO. Test it. And dump in however much kalk you need. Because I'm lazy, I just dump a pound in, the correct amount always dissolves, (it's magic, that way) and the residue falls to the bottom. When I add more ro/di, it kicks up, dissolves more, and the leftover falls back to the bottom. I can run that thing a month without intervention, and the corals are very happy. Your levels will stay up until your mg runs out, so keep testing mg, and adding before it runs below 1300, and you're good to run until you have to add more kalk. I dump in another pound, fill the reservoir, never letting my mg fall too low, and I can keep that deal going for another month---or five or six. It's the lazy man's way to healthy corals.

 

[acrohead500ppm]

calcium reactors keep alk/cal levels stable 24/7 when setup correctly, some smaller volume systems with a high amount of calcifying organisims (packed with coral). Can see fluctuations in as little as 12 hours. If this type of system is dosed with two part 1x every 24hrs to conteract the drop, the alk/cal levels are fluctuating, not stable.
calcium reactors dont just add cal/ alk but other elements as well, most reactor media is made of coral skeletons, hence it will release what those corals used to grow.
Some tridacnid clam freaks even add crushed clam shells to their reactors as suggested in D. knops book on tridacnids.

however,
Calcium reactors should have really been named carbonate reactors, despite being very effcient at maintaining both alk/cal levels , many reactor owners find themselves having to dose calcium chloride everyonce in a while. They maintain alk better than calcium.
But it may just depend on the demands of your reef.
for people who can dose everyday or even better yet 2x a day (1/2 dose x2) its not worht the $600 for a reactor. However, if you travel alot, can't commit to daily dosing- a calcium reactor maybe right up your alley.
hope this helps-
Corey

 

[this is me]

Here's my take on Ca reactor vs Dosing. I had ran a CA reactor for almost ten years and recently made the switch to 2-part dosing. They both have their pros and cons. I made the switch because I'm sick'n tired of adjusting my effluent and my level was swinging too much. Cleaning this thing is PITA with all the pumps and water line. And a reliable solenoid is hard to find. I have to replace mine every two years or so and ultimately ended up not using one. To me, there's just too many things can fail on a CA reactor.

CA reactor is nice but the set up time and dial in time is often long. Some may experience up to a month or two to have it stable. Once you get it dialed in, it definitely can keep your MAC(Mag, ALK, and CA) level a lot more stable than dosing. And it's set and forget it for 6month-1year. After that, keeping your effluent drip rate to be consistently constant for a long period of time can be tricky. Mine often get clogged and/or the Co2 pressure has changed and the drip rate is all over the place.
-Low PH can be an issue for some tank. I know for my tank(~70gal total volume) PH can be as low as 7.8 during a 24hr period.
-The starting cost is pretty high but a high quality dosing system is pretty high as well. However, you have to account for the pumps that's runs 24/7 and the heat(negligible) associated with them. Most CA reactor has a feeding pump and a recirculation pump. And if you have an electronic regulator and a solenoid, that's drawing power too.
-Reactor media is pretty cheap and they last 6months-a year depending on your need. A gallon of ARM media is about $35.
-Co2 is also pretty cheap. It cost me ~$25 to refill a 5lb bottle and I refill once a year. Keeping the Co2 connection tight and leak free can be an issue as well. You can't see if it's leaking so you just tighten it as best as you can. Somtime, I have to refill my bottle in less than 3 months because I did not make a good connection.

A high quality dosing system is quite expensive as well. A 3-pump unit from GHL is about $400. After you buy all the 2-part salt and container, it will run another $200. Having it up and running is a little easier than a CA reactor because you can calculate how much your system is using and how much to add with the 2-part calculator.
-The 2-part salt is actually pretty cheap if you buy it in bulk. A 5gallon container is ~$65 average between the 4 salts you need. (Soda Ash, Calcium chloride, Magnesium sulfate, magnesium chloride). This can last you a year to 5 years depending on your tank consumption.
-You can get your level to fluctuate less and stable if you set it to dose little at a time and often. The dosing pumps only run for a couple seconds at a time a day and they draw a negligible amount of power.
-No more low PH issue.
-The biggest drawback of dosing is that you're adding salt to the tank. The salinity level will rise and if you don't like doing water changes, it can be a problem for the tank. This issue can be fixed if you have an automatic water changes in conjunction with a salinity probe. But the easiest way to fix this is during feeding, take out more water than usual to thaw out the food and let your ATO fill it up with fresh water. I take a cup a day to thaw the food and the salinity problem from dosing has not been a problem.

 

[webersole]

Quick question: when using pickling lime as kalk, is there something else needed to maintain the calcium or is that done with the pickling lime as well?

 

[das75]

started with reactor and moved to a doser more for just the new equipment thing over any problems I had with a reactor.

my observations
-tank seems the same with either
-doser a bit more work as having to mix the solutions about every month where with the reactor could go 6 months or more between maintenance (co2 bottle swap or media change) other than a quick little bubble or effluent adjust maybe every few weeks
-there's a Reefkeeping article that with larger systems (200g+) that reactors are more cost effective, not having done the math but have a feeling I'm spending a bit more with solutions than I was on gas and media
-though I believe a display can keep up on trace elements with frequent/regular water changes, the idea of dissolving coral skeletons with a reactor seems better for the traces than adding a sterile solution of calcium chloride and baking soda

 

[Stanley-Reefer]

dosing is more teadious on a day to day basis UNTIL you're doing maint/cleaning 2 pumps, reactor, teflon taping up all connections, calibrating and buying new probes, making sure you're controller is not sending the reactor ph too low, adding media and filling CO2 tanks.

My kent tech a-b was really easy! $30/month from F&S for 2 tanks and that was it!

 

[sirreal63]

Interesting...I have used a CaRx since 2004, it costs me about 30 bucks every 18 months in media, 17 bucks a year in CO2 (though I usually go about 14-16 months on 5#) and I clean it twice a year, or about 4 bucks a month total if you add the wattage for the recirc pump. The AP add on box was 125 bucks, I change probes every few years if needed. I don't spend any time tweaking it, the effluent remains rock solid and I don't worry about it. The upfront cost can be high or you can find a used setup pretty cheap.

Once you get a dkh demand of over 2 dkh a day, the reactor may pay for itself. Two part dosing has come a long ways in the past few years and is a viable alternative but long term the reactor is just easier and cheaper, but it isn't for everyone. Do what you are comfortable with. For me two part was just more tedious.