Clamtastrophe

TWallace,

Would it be possible of you to be able to capture the two angels, shrimp, and mithrax and then swap the clam with them in to the qt tank? I know it sounds impossible with the rock. But if you can I think it would help greatly in solving your problems. Once you do the swap and if the clam still looks good you can then start slowly re-adding the suspect livestock. Start with the crab then shrimp and finally the angels. Just know you will have to re-catch wich ever critter is the problem.

Or another solution is go to the lfs and buy a smaller "guinnea pig" clam and add it to your tank and see what happens. So you can try the bottle method.
 
Instead of that, I've moved the clam into the refugium of the display tank to see if it starts to look bad again. It's been in there about an hour now and it looks so-so. Mantle is extended, but not completely. The only livestock in the refugium is one astrea snail and one scarlet hermit. I'll leave it in there a couple days, or until it starts to look bad. The lighting in the refugium is definitely sub par, though, even for a derasa. It's just a flourescent bulb, the one Melev uses and recommends on his site for refugiums.

I could probably catch the flame angel without too much hassle. I have a trap that I used for a flame hawk not long ago. The flame angel entered the trap many times before the flame hawk was finally caught. I'm not sure about the coral beauty, but I think that's irrelevant. The coral beauty was added to the system after a few of the clams had already died. I never saw the crabs or shrimp bother any of the clams, but perhaps they adapted ninja skills from the flame angel who, rumor has it, only pecks at clams when no one's looking.
 
If your refugium still is a hang on it should be getting some of your display lighting indirectly too. it sounds like you use water from your display to fill your qt. If this is true I find it impossible to be a param problem since the clam was doing great in the qt. It may retracted from all the movement lately. Give it time.

Have you done any research on flatworms? That is another possibility. Reading up on the other forum it sounds like alot of other customers from the particular lfs are haveing troubles too. Possibly an outbreak of baby flatworms. I have never shopped there but want too soon, it sound like a great store. But I have wonder if the problem stems back to them since it is so widespread locally?

On a side note I feel the comment you made on the other fourum about us isn't too cool. Myself and ez are 2 of the 4 or 5 people on this forum that check the threads dayly and try to help others out. We see your problem almost weekly. This thread isn't getting alot of responses because I think the others of the 4 or 5 are away on holidays. I am sure they would agree with myself and ez.

The other thread is saying pm, I think from your expierience you have the ability to diagnose pm and from what you are saying it doesn't sound like pm.
 
I had the same thing happen with my 7 clams. It started with 1 crocea then a week later another and so on. I couldn't find anything eating them, none of my fish were bothering them and all my prams were normal. I even sent one off to pathology to see if it was something microscopic causing the problem and nothing but normal findings. I have not had a clam in my tank for 3 months now and I am afraid to try one ad have the same thing happen again.
 
skinz, I apologize for any comment on the other forum that was offensive. I'm just very frustrated with the whole situation. I still don't think the flame angel had anything to do with the clam issues I'm having. I've seen him bother clams over a year ago (only happened for one day) and he always did it right out in the open. It makes no sense to me that he'd now only do it when no one's looking. A local reefer says he had a fire shrimp bother his clams at night and I do have 2 of them in my tank.

The derasa is still doing fine in the refugium, which to me indicates it's not a water quality issue, and likely not pinched mantle, but instead some animal bothering it that only lives in the display and not the refugium. Admittedly, that evidence does lend credence to your flame angel theory, but it could also be cleaner shrimp, fire shrimp or something else. I did say that I have emerald crabs in my tank, but honestly I haven't seen them in several weeks. They may not be around anymore.

I'll give the derasa a few more days to recover in the refugium, then put him back in the display and watch for things bothering him. I'm certain that it will happen again, but maybe I can find out what it is.
 
It's too bad I live a couple hours away I would loan you my trap. At first I started thinking your stainless steel theory had some merit but on the other hand I use a stainless knife for cutting byssal threads when I have to work on my clams and I leave the knife in the tank the whole time I am messing arround in there. I have kept lots of emralds with my clams and have never had any problems too. I have had cleaner shrimp and the only time I have seen them touch a clam is when the clam was dead or dieing. I have never had fire shrimp so I can't help you there. But from what others are saying I think they can't be trusted with clams.

So if it were my tank I would highly suspect the fire shrimp and both angels. If possible I would remove all of them and see what happens. Put them into the qt.

Personally I think all of the others on the other forum have alot of different problems and a lack of knowledge. So they are all saying they are all experienceing the same thing as you. Don't get me wrong I know there are some people on there that do know thier stuff though.

I know some angels are good to go with clams and never have problems. But it is hard for me to even come close to recommending keeping them together becuase the risk is too high. Its just not responsible reefkeeping to me.
 
I am surprised that nobody mentioned Bristle worms. I have read that they have like to munch on them. Could that be a possibility?
 
they only eat on clams when they are already dead or dieing. They are pretty much a part of the worlds best clean up crew.

Don't get me wrong there are some worms that are bad but they are usually huge and easy to spot.
 
I am in the NW and am having the exact same problem. Water params are excellent but ALL 7 of my clams are retracted and have been for some time. They have been in the tank nearly 2 years.

I do have a couple of cleaner shrimp but have been losing them. I put in a CBB prior to the clam problem, but haven't noticed him picking on the clams. Just before the problem started I added two cleaner wrasses and I haven't noticed them bothering the clams, but I do observe them getting real friendly with some corals.

Other issues that merit discussion are the huge die-off of snails and subsequent dino outbreak. I solved the dino issue over the course of about 2 months, and after they were gone, the clams started looking weak.

One other major thing to note: I have found the remains, or the molt, of a decent sized red crab with black pincers. I don't know if they molt, and the pieces looked more like remains than a molt, but it's definitely worth mentioning.

I also have a longnose hawk, but he seems to behave himself, 10 tangs, maroon pair, sebae clown, one chromis, one foxface. I have not observed anything bothering the clams.

I am getting very tense about this situation as some of these clams are really quite nice specimens. I do have a 40g QT, but it is a real hassle trying to get a clam out of the tank. I did inspect one for snails but no banana.

So, recommendations the same?
 
start off by doing the bottle qt asap. the others from the local forum waited too long and lost thier clams.

Post some pic's

What kind of tangs?
 
<a href=showthread.php?s=&postid=11538367#post11538367 target=_blank>Originally posted</a> by jnarowe
I am in the NW and am having the exact same problem. Water params are excellent but ALL 7 of my clams are retracted and have been for some time. They have been in the tank nearly 2 years.

I do have a couple of cleaner shrimp but have been losing them. I put in a CBB prior to the clam problem, but haven't noticed him picking on the clams. Just before the problem started I added two cleaner wrasses and I haven't noticed them bothering the clams, but I do observe them getting real friendly with some corals.

Other issues that merit discussion are the huge die-off of snails and subsequent dino outbreak. I solved the dino issue over the course of about 2 months, and after they were gone, the clams started looking weak.

One other major thing to note: I have found the remains, or the molt, of a decent sized red crab with black pincers. I don't know if they molt, and the pieces looked more like remains than a molt, but it's definitely worth mentioning.

I also have a longnose hawk, but he seems to behave himself, 10 tangs, maroon pair, sebae clown, one chromis, one foxface. I have not observed anything bothering the clams.

I am getting very tense about this situation as some of these clams are really quite nice specimens. I do have a 40g QT, but it is a real hassle trying to get a clam out of the tank. I did inspect one for snails but no banana.

So, recommendations the same?
Click to expand...

i would get a polyfilter and through it in the tank to see if it turns up any heavy metals. the snail die off leads me to think you might have copper or another metal
 
snail die-off was do to a heat wave and 50 Mexican turbos kicked the bucket. They fouled the water and killed off about 5000 small snails...then came the dinos. It's been a tough year.

I'll do the bottle QT tomorrow and see how it goes. I have a 10 tear drop on th esand bed that is looking not so good, so I will start with it.

Unfortunately I have such heavy coraline growth that I cannot get a good pic. I will try a top-down ASAP.
 
Just MO, but FW dips seem like a terrible idea. Sure in theory it will kill parasites, etc., but most any cells that touch the freshwater (from a SW organism) will swell and burst. I would try other experimentation with chemicals in SW. I used an crystal violet SW dip on a clam suspected of pinched mantle and it seemed to work very well, Could have been just luck though.
 
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