Coral Warfare. Things are dying.

[240gallons]

After a few months of investigating why my corals were not doing good, I think I've narrowed it down to Coral Warfare.

I had a couple threads going where the Reef Central Community has help me troubleshoot my issues. However those threads are getting messy. I'll summarize here.
Essentially I ran into an issue where my zoanthids were closed for several weeks. I also lost a very large short tentacle plate .

All corals look lackluster despite water changes and literally perfect water quality.

I replaced all powerheads in return pump just in the event they were leaking voltage or metals. After massive water changes (80%) my zoanthids would open for one to two days then slowly start to close again.

After literally changing everything out except for the Corals in a tank I stumbled upon what I think maybe the cause tonight.
Due to the recent rearrangement of power heads Etc I have no water surface agitation
I was able to see on the surface of the water a thick layer of slime. This slime typically would be in the water column due to surface agitation but it was just they're on the top. I put a little in my hand and it definitely has a LOT of Sting to it.
I added to carbon reactor which would become essentially useless after being coated with slime.
I do not run or ever have had a protein skimmer on this particular tank because I do regular large water changes.

1. What could be causing these corals to fight each other? There's absolutely no touching and plenty of space between each Coral.
The corals are zoanthids euphyllia and chalices and toadstools. Pretty basic stuff.

2. Would a protein skimmer help remove the Slime from the water column or just mix it up more and keep it in the water column? I have extremely limited space in my sump.
Has anyone else dealt with this type of issue before?
Pics are of my 75-gallon tank 48 hours after water change corals were open yesterday and closed again today.

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[240gallons]

https://youtu.be/jBi0BbHLzQg
I want to cry
Just came across this video I took Last year.... Wow have things gone to hell.



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[Drix]

Hows your skimmer doing?

 

[Kevin Guthrie]

Back in the under-gravel filter days, I could remove the surface bacteria skin by sort of floating a paper towel on in. Pick up the towel and the skin goes with it.

If you don't have a sump and an overflow I would get one. If you do and the surface still has a bacterial skin, point the circulation pumps so the surface current is toward the overflow, not away. The skin prevents oxygen exchange.

 

[45commando]

Corals will release compounds into the water to inhibit other corals from growing. The corals don't have to be near each other for this to happen & in the confines of a tank it can really start a chain reaction. Some corals (many leathers & softies) are more potent at this type of warfare than say SPS. Search Coral Terpens or Terpenoids if you want to research more.
A skimmer will help with removal of these terpens & other organics. Carbon will also help in removing them. I don't run carbon 24/7, but simply hang a bag in high flow area about 48 hrs before a WC, to pull out some of the nasties & polish the water before adding new. Both will help with overall water quality & clarity in the long term.
Also not sure why you would have any noticeable surface film with a built-in overflow type tank as pictured above. The overflow should be skimming the surface water even without surface agitation. Have you cleaned the surface grate area of the overflow recently? They can get plugged with algae & become restricted, so worth checking out. I would add surface agitation as it will help with gas exchange, cooling & should break up the surface film for removal by skimmer etc. HTH & best of luck.

 

[Potsy]

It's interesting that upon touching the slime you feel stinging. As far as I know, the compounds released by leathers act as a growth inhibitors rather than stinging agents. Is it possible that the slime is loaded with nematocysts from one of your lps? Does the chalice coral ever look slimey? Out of water my chalice was the slimiest of all my coral. I don't think the toadstools are to blame.

 

[Smokey Stover]

Are you sure that stinging isn't stray voltage from a power head?

 

[240gallons]

Hows your skimmer doing?

Hopefully it shipped today.
I've never run a skimmer on this system. light fish load and I do frequent large water changes. As you can see in the video the tank usually does well without a skimmer.

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[240gallons]

Corals will release compounds into the water to inhibit other corals from growing. The corals don't have to be near each other for this to happen & in the confines of a tank it can really start a chain reaction. Some corals (many leathers & softies) are more potent at this type of warfare than say SPS. Search Coral Terpens or Terpenoids if you want to research more.
A skimmer will help with removal of these terpens & other organics. Carbon will also help in removing them. I don't run carbon 24/7, but simply hang a bag in high flow area about 48 hrs before a WC, to pull out some of the nasties & polish the water before adding new. Both will help with overall water quality & clarity in the long term.
Also not sure why you would have any noticeable surface film with a built-in overflow type tank as pictured above. The overflow should be skimming the surface water even without surface agitation. Have you cleaned the surface grate area of the overflow recently? They can get plugged with algae & become restricted, so worth checking out. I would add surface agitation as it will help with gas exchange, cooling & should break up the surface film for removal by skimmer etc. HTH & best of luck.

When I replaced the powerheads I did not adjust them well. No surface agitation pushed the surface water to one side. Overflow grate is open.

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[240gallons]

It's interesting that upon touching the slime you feel stinging. As far as I know, the compounds released by leathers act as a growth inhibitors rather than stinging agents. Is it possible that the slime is loaded with nematocysts from one of your lps? Does the chalice coral ever look slimey? Out of water my chalice was the slimiest of all my coral. I don't think the toadstools are to blame.

To your point, I think the Torch or Frogspawn are releasing the stinging agents. Just from past experience fragging them.

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[zachfishman]

With no protein skimmer and your slime surface layer (get some power heads pointed slightly upwards to break up that layer and get that overflow back to skimming the surface), you likely have significantly hindered gas exchange. This can result in oxygen depletion at night and exaggerated pH swings as CO2 builds without escaping adequately. I think you will see improvement after adding the skimmer and breaking up that surface slime layer.

 

[Joe0813]

i had some warfare going on... just moved a few corals around, problem solved

 

[rffanat1c]

What salt do you use? Do you add anything? A friend of mine lost lots of coral due to a bad batch of Instant Ocean and putting Algae Fix in his tank.

 

[240gallons]

skimmer, skimmer Chicken Dinner!

Placed the skimmer 24 hours ago. wet skimming light yellow slime..
Corals are loving it

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[Anemone]

With no protein skimmer and your slime surface layer (get some power heads pointed slightly upwards to break up that layer and get that overflow back to skimming the surface), you likely have significantly hindered gas exchange. This can result in oxygen depletion at night and exaggerated pH swings as CO2 builds without escaping adequately. I think you will see improvement after adding the skimmer and breaking up that surface slime layer.

This.

Kevin

 

[WVfishguy]

With no protein skimmer and your slime surface layer ..... you likely have significantly hindered gas exchange. This can result in oxygen depletion at night and exaggerated pH swings as CO2 builds without escaping adequately. I think you will see improvement after adding the skimmer and breaking up that surface slime layer.

I second this.

Tales from the maintenance business:

A saltwater customer called me once, said fish were not feeding as well, which was always an emergency call to me. Ordinarily, those fish would eat me if they had the chance.

This was a only few days after my employee cleaned the tank. :angryfire:

The 135 developed surface scum, which shouldn't have happened with the powerful return pump and overflow I had in that tank.

My employee DIDN'T EVEN NOTICE the scum, but to me, surface scum means a major malfunction which will result in oxygen deprivation and CO2 buildup.

Turns out the return pump needed a good cleaning, problem solved.

Moral of the story, surface scum is a symptom of a problem which needs fixed.

And an employee will never care as much about customers as the business owner.

 

[ReefkeeperZ]

Looking at that tank I highly doubt it could even remotely be coral warfare, chemical or physical, you can have a tank stocked to the hilt with chemically agressive corals and not experience those symptoms. one of my old 75g tanks had a leather that was 18+ inches and I was still easily growing everything lemme see if I can find a picture

It is most likely gas exchange problems.

 

[ReefkeeperZ]

I couldnt find a picture of it full sized just one of it's baby pictures